Can Howell Leapfrog Heinicke to be our #2?

[lavar703]

3 hours ago, turtle28 said:

You’re not in the minority, Indont think. I want Wentz to be great for us but, I also want him to be great to shove it in Philly & Indy’s faces who think they made this great decision by moving on from him after a few bad games & are smearing him in the process. 

I want Wentz to succeed but it will be much more advantageous if Howell is the better player and becomes a franchise guy. Great, cheap QB play for the next 4 years would set this franchise on what would essentially be a 15-year course of success. 

[turtle28]

 

[offbyone]

If i am on coaching staff I tell Howell he isn't allowed to run the ball for the next 2 pre-season games.  We know he can run, he needs to break this habit he had last year in college of always running at first sign of distress.  He needs to learn to either work progressions or throw it away.  Sure let him move in pocket, but I would tell him if has no option or space to move behind line of scrimmage- throw the ball away.  

[lavar703]

On 8/15/2022 at 2:25 PM, turtle28 said:

 

PFF has some of the dumbest rankings and grades of any respected outlet I’ve ever seen. “We graded him with two interceptable throws” while a few tweets later “the DB never really had a chance to make the catch” lol. I appreciate the work they do but they can’t be taken seriously and boy, look out if you challenge their grades. I’ve heard several NFL players say they have no idea what they’re doing. 

[DCNative]

8 hours ago, offbyone said:

If i am on coaching staff I tell Howell he isn't allowed to run the ball for the next 2 pre-season games.  We know he can run, he needs to break this habit he had last year in college of always running at first sign of distress.  He needs to learn to either work progressions or throw it away.  Sure let him move in pocket, but I would tell him if has no option or space to move behind line of scrimmage- throw the ball away.  

I'm not sure I like the idea of teaching him not to use one of his best strengths, his feet. Yet I agree with the idea of throwing the ball away before throwing a interception. Howells 1st TD was the perfect situation to use his feet. Everything was covered, the middle was wide open for Howell to step up beat the LB and score the TD. His potential INT was a forced throw that should've been thrown out of bounds. Throwing it away is better than a InT, while using his legs when necessary is a gift he has to showcase on the field. 

[turtle28]

19 hours ago, lavar703 said:

PFF has some of the dumbest rankings and grades of any respected outlet I’ve ever seen. “We graded him with two interceptable throws” while a few tweets later “the DB never really had a chance to make the catch” lol. I appreciate the work they do but they can’t be taken seriously and boy, look out if you challenge their grades. I’ve heard several NFL players say they have no idea what they’re doing. 

Spoiler

 

[turtle28]

On 8/16/2022 at 1:40 PM, offbyone said:

If i am on coaching staff I tell Howell he isn't allowed to run the ball for the next 2 pre-season games.  We know he can run, he needs to break this habit he had last year in college of always running at first sign of distress.  He needs to learn to either work progressions or throw it away.  Sure let him move in pocket, but I would tell him if has no option or space to move behind line of scrimmage- throw the ball away.  

It make sense for the final two preseason games I think. He definitely needs some more work on intermediate to deep accuracy throws & the only way that’s going to happen is if he doesn’t take off and run.

I wasn’t happy that he missed that possible TD to McGowan the last game. He had him open for a TD but threw the ball out of bounds, McGowan had no chance to catch that pass in the intermediate to deep part of the end zone like he should’ve had.

Yes, it was just one throw but throws like that are the difference between starting QBs & back ups in the NFL. Good to great QBs hit them regularly.

On the sack he took. He took the snap for the shotgun & didn’t take and drop after that - maybe one step - he missed someone who came open right in front of him, either RB or TE/WR in the slot but he held onto it & got sacked bc he didn’t take a 3 step drop from the shotgun & didn’t get the ball out quick to an open receiver in the flat, so he was sacked.

Edited August 17, 2022 by turtle28

[MikeT14]

I disagree. Let him play his game and give him the teachable moments after. 

[turtle28]

16 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

I disagree. Let him play his game and give him the teachable moments after. 

Have to break bad habits early or else they become routine, just look at RG3

[MikeT14]

2 hours ago, turtle28 said:

Have to break bad habits early or else they become routine, just look at RG3

You mean RG3 who was forced to play a way that wasn’t to his skill set? Smart. 

[lavar703]

7 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

You mean RG3 who was forced to play a way that wasn’t to his skill set? Smart. 

Well to be fair, RG3 forced that. 

[MikeT14]

18 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Well to be fair, RG3 forced that. 

Yes. Absolutely, you’re right.  My point stands. 

[turtle28]

11 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

Yes. Absolutely, you’re right.  My point stands. 

Yes, RG3 said he wanted to be the best Aaron Rodgers after he hurt his knee & going into his 2nd season. He didn’t want to be a read option QB anymore. As we know, this eventually led to Shanahan’s firing bc they thought/knew  - at least as a young QB - that he needed to be a zone read QB until he became a better pocket passer & could read defenses better which, RG3 fought against & Snyder took RG3’s side.

Then, in 2014 when Snyder hired Gruden who was a west coast & pocket passing QB whisper to be our HC, RG3 got what he wanted & he wasn’t even average in 2014 in Gruden’s offense.

Cousins & McCoy both outplayed RG3 in 2014. Really, in hindsight, Kirk shouldn’t have even lost the job IMO despite him throwing late across the middle vs Tennessee which led to Gruden benching him at halftime in favor of McCoy.

In 2014, Kirk was on pace for a 62%, 4600 yard, 27 TD, 17 or less int season. 
 

Kirk should’ve been our starter from 2014 until now. I hope Carson can outplay what Kirk was for us from 2015-2017 but Carson has never played that consistently throughout a whole season. I hope Carson does so this year & can become our franchise QB for the next decade but it’s totally up in the air.

Edited August 18, 2022 by turtle28

[aceinthehouse]

RG3 didn't know how to slide. That was his problem.

Otherwise, he might have prolonged his career. 

[e16bball]

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

In 2014, Kirk was on pace for a 62%, 4600 yard, 27 TD, 17 or less int season. 

No…no, he wasn’t. He was on pace for 26 INTs, as well as an additional 6 lost fumbles.

That was a weird year. One of the worst to be a Redskins fan that I can remember. Anyway, Kirk started 5 games (of which we lost 4, of course). The only Kirk start that we won was actually that TEN game where he was replaced by McCoy, who led us back for the win. But in fairness to Kirk, we did beat Chad Henne and the Jags in the game where he almost immediately had to replace RG3, so that counts for something.

Even without knowing what they all became in the future, it seems relatively obvious now that Kirk should have gotten more of a shot that season. He actually had the lowest passer rating of the 3 QBs (by a fairly wide margin behind Colt), but that does seem to sort of highlight the flaws in the passer rating — although they did also have the best record in Colt’s starts, so does it really? Anyway, Kirk rated way more highly in QBR and ANY/A and other more advanced stats that properly put more emphasis on ability to actually move the ball and score TDs, so they probably should have given him more of a shot. He was the only guy really making use of those weapons they had.

 

But in Gruden’s defense, everything that Kirk was going to become was also on full display. Take the Eagles game. Kirk put up huge numbers. 425 yards, 3 TDs, AY/A over 9. He brought us back from a couple different deficits (there’s no better QB on earth than Kirk Cousins when you’re losing by 10). But they get the ball on the Philly 41, trailing by 3 points, with just over 2 minutes left. Need a few yards to get into tying FG range, but it’s also a great chance to win it outright. Instead, after Morris gets stuffed on first down, Kirk throws 3 straight incompletions and we lose. 2nd down, turns down open Andre Roberts in FG range in favor of an underthrown ball to Jackson at the sticks. 3rd down, nice play by Boykin to break up a short throw to Roberts. 4th down, airmails an awful throw to an open Garcon to seal our fate. Classic Kirk — he giveth but he eventually taketh away. 

The story on Kirk remains the same as it always has been. Best QB we’ve had in a long time…but you know that you can’t ever win with him, so what’s the point? Had we kept him, these past few seasons would have been somehow less and more torturous at the same time.