BDL 2022 Week 3 - Raleigh Firebirds @ Cancun Kaiju

[VigilantZombie]

Just now, Blue said:

I have made a whopping three posts on his gameplan, all of them regarding the double standard in having to explain my offensive plan in detail but Raleigh not explaining how they're going to defend it.

Why shouldn't he have to explain his hybrid scheme every week but I have to explain my run game every week? Because that is my point. Why criticize the one and not the other? If you're going to use that as justification for your vote, be consistent about it. Otherwise it comes across as making up a justification for the vote after the fact.

 I am consistent about the way I vote so don't even go there. Secondly explaining your run game it's far different than explaining how meaning how hes aligning his 3-4 Hybrid defense.  Having said that you feel that he needs to explain that, And I feel that it's completely acceptable for you to feel that way. My point is simply that this entire entire thread is filled with comments by you back-and-forth arguing how someone else is wrong about their opinion, Stats, And what is wrong with his game plan. 

It is too much talking by an owner that is involved in the game. You are not the only one who has posted stats here EPC has done it too. I am saying stop with the conversation and let the other voters have that conversation for themselves and decide which way to go we don't need you telling us we're wrong when we express an opinion unless we are asking you for clarification on something.

[Blue]

2 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

 I am consistent about the way I vote so don't even go there. Secondly explaining your run game it's far different than explaining how meaning how hes aligning his 3-4 Hybrid defense.  Having said that you feel that he needs to explain that, And I feel that it's completely acceptable for you to feel that way. My point is simply that this entire entire thread is filled with comments by you back-and-forth arguing how someone else is wrong about their opinion, Stats, And what is wrong with his game plan. 

It is too much talking by an owner that is involved in the game. You are not the only one who has posted stats here EPC has done it too. I am saying stop with the conversation and let the other voters have that conversation for themselves and decide which way to go we don't need you telling us we're wrong when we express an opinion unless we are asking you for clarification on something.

I don't think it's fair to blame me for back and forth over my opponent's gameplan when I've barely mentioned it at all and only when it's relevant to discussion about mine.

[VigilantZombie]

Just now, Blue said:

I don't think it's fair to blame me for back and forth over my opponent's gameplan when I've barely mentioned it at all and only when it's relevant to discussion about mine.

 The fact of the matter is you have had a  Back-and-forth for 3 pages whether it is about your game plan and how someone is wrong about their criticism or about your opponents game plan. I am the same enough is enough you've had your share of saying your opinion now it's time to leave it up to the other voters and move along

[Blue]

1 minute ago, wwhickok said:

 The fact of the matter is you have had a  Back-and-forth for 3 pages whether it is about your game plan and how someone is wrong about their criticism or about your opponents game plan. I am the same enough is enough you've had your share of saying your opinion now it's time to leave it up to the other voters and move along

It's not even that they're wrong in their criticism, it's that I think the criticism is selectively applied.

[VigilantZombie]

5 minutes ago, Blue said:

It's not even that they're wrong in their criticism, it's that I think the criticism is selectively applied.

 Isn't that the  Is pot calling the kettle black? You got upset when somebody took something you said yourself and applied it consistently to your game when you apply it to someone elses. and you were not OK with that.

 So it sort of is telling people their criticism is wrong.  Because I don't see anybody so actively applying criticism. At least not amongst the voters whose votes actually matter

[Blue]

2 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

 Isn't that the  Is pot calling the kettle black? You got upset when somebody took something you said yourself and applied it consistently to your game when you apply it to someone elses. and you were not OK with that.

 So it sort of is telling people their criticism is wrong.  Because I don't see anybody so actively applying criticism. At least not amongst the voters whose votes actually matter

What, me making fun of Bcb in his game thread by using his logic of playing a guy out of position? That was pretty obvious sarcasm. I'll put in italics next time so there's no confusion.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Blue

[VigilantZombie]

Just now, Blue said:

What, me making fun of Bcb in his game thread by using his logic of playing a guy out of position? That was pretty obvious sarcasm. I'll put in italics next time so it's more obvious.

 Yeah you probably should have but no not even BCB thought it was obvious.

 I am absolutely done with this back-and-forth though I'm going to go   Read these gameplans again since now at this point I forget what I've read and try to make a decision on this game since it's the last one I haven't voted on

[MWil23]

7 minutes ago, Blue said:

I'll put in italics next time so there's no confusion.

I don't know why but this made me laugh. The "Italics" thing is my favorite random inside joke.

[VigilantZombie]

Based on the articles I have read today, My interpretation of a hybrid 3-4 defense is basically a 5-2 look.  That is my own interpretation of what I have read via SB nation and other sites.  How the rest of you interpret that is up to you. However I would offer that in my opinion a 5-2 base look is designed for stopping the run.

[MWil23]

23 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Based on the articles I have read today, My interpretation of a hybrid 3-4 defense is basically a 5-2 look.  That is my own interpretation of what I have read via SB nation and other sites.  How the rest of you interpret that is up to you. However I would offer that in my opinion a 5-2 base look is designed for stopping the run.

I am from a long line of 5-2 (or 50 as we call it) coaching tree individuals and then after a few years we went to an even front. This was my post:

4 hours ago, MWil23 said:

So he’s not running a hybrid 3-4, he’s running an old school 50 (5-2). Is he running a falcon, Eagle, or bear front? That should help give clarity on gap integrity and run fits considering his EDGE guys can’t be edge setters/edge rushers and inside gap players. Also if he runs a third CB on is he playing 2 safeties with 1 LB in the box? If so he’s a full fit short on +1 pull plays or other plays where a fullback is inserted.

In a Falcon front, you have a 1 tech, a 3 tech, and a 0 tech head up on the center, and realistically you dictate which way you are slanting your DL (strong or weak).

In an Eagle front, you have 2 3 techs with a 0 tech head up on the center, with both ends functioning as head up 5 techs. If the opposition has a TE, you will need to allocate the safety as an alley fitter and edge setter or else bump your LB out one gap to plug that B gap and have your DE in a 7/JAM tech.

A Bear front is shown below with your SS down in the box and Ends there, making it all but impossible to run the ball unless you have the ability to break a tackle from either a plug backer or an unblocked end.

Personally, I'm a HUGE Eagle front fan because of the gap integrity, but you are also not allowing your DE to get upfield more than 1 yard due to creating creases your LB cannot plug, so as a result, you are sacrificing on the pass rush end on early downs and really relying heavily on some inside blitzes to free up those edge guys.

You are also forced to either put your 5th down lineman on a 3rd WR, play a match man variation in 2x2, or if it's motioning to trips, showing your coverage presnap by having your safety motion across with him or rotating down (man vs. cover 3).

It's impossible to play Cover 2 variations against trips with 5 down linemen against trips or in a 4 WR set unless you are only playing with 1 LB...and if you are, that's a decisive 6 on 5 box advantage for the offense.

For what it's worth schematically.

[EaglesPeteC]

1 hour ago, MWil23 said:

I am from a long line of 5-2 (or 50 as we call it) coaching tree individuals and then after a few years we went to an even front. This was my post:

In a Falcon front, you have a 1 tech, a 3 tech, and a 0 tech head up on the center, and realistically you dictate which way you are slanting your DL (strong or weak).

In an Eagle front, you have 2 3 techs with a 0 tech head up on the center, with both ends functioning as head up 5 techs. If the opposition has a TE, you will need to allocate the safety as an alley fitter and edge setter or else bump your LB out one gap to plug that B gap and have your DE in a 7/JAM tech.

A Bear front is shown below with your SS down in the box and Ends there, making it all but impossible to run the ball unless you have the ability to break a tackle from either a plug backer or an unblocked end.

Personally, I'm a HUGE Eagle front fan because of the gap integrity, but you are also not allowing your DE to get upfield more than 1 yard due to creating creases your LB cannot plug, so as a result, you are sacrificing on the pass rush end on early downs and really relying heavily on some inside blitzes to free up those edge guys.

You are also forced to either put your 5th down lineman on a 3rd WR, play a match man variation in 2x2, or if it's motioning to trips, showing your coverage presnap by having your safety motion across with him or rotating down (man vs. cover 3).

It's impossible to play Cover 2 variations against trips with 5 down linemen against trips or in a 4 WR set unless you are only playing with 1 LB...and if you are, that's a decisive 6 on 5 box advantage for the offense.

For what it's worth schematically.

Fair,

I visualized more a 3-4 to 5-2 hybrid but certainly not something I stated specifically. I can be clearer with that next time

[MWil23]

6 minutes ago, EaglesPeteC said:

Fair,

I visualized more a 3-4 to 5-2 hybrid but certainly not something I stated specifically. I can be clearer with that next time

I'm just a 50/5-2 nerd. LOL.

I started off as a DB coach (we did a Cover 2/Cover 4 match scheme that focused intently on both the S and CB reading #2, and if #2 broke out within 5 yards, the CB and S switched their presnap responsibility. It forced a lot of turnovers on quick outs, bubble slants, etc. but we definitely took some lumps on multiple inbreaking routes).

[Blue]

I do want to apologize to @RTTRUTH. I tend to be very blunt in my tone and it’s not a positive character trait. I don’t think you’re intentionally doing anything shady. We have absolutely had instances in the past where people clearly voted solely to influence their own playoff/draft position, and I am maybe too sensitive to how people vote as a result.

[VigilantZombie]

22 minutes ago, Blue said:

I do want to apologize to @RTTRUTH. I tend to be very blunt in my tone and it’s not a positive character trait. I don’t think you’re intentionally doing anything shady. We have absolutely had instances in the past where people clearly voted solely to influence their own playoff/draft position, and I am maybe too sensitive to how people vote as a result.

 It's funny that you say this. I have made that same comment in the past and been absolutely obliterated because of because apparently that never happens in this league

[Blue]

6 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

 It's funny that you say this. I have made that same comment in the past and been absolutely obliterated because of because apparently that never happens in this league

I don’t have any reason to believe it still happens. I’m thinking of people no longer associated with BDL.