2023 Off-season Talk

[JetsandI]

24 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

He’s been doing that for years though and keeps playing. 

He is pushing 40 now.

[Bobby816]

Just now, JetsandI said:

He is pushing 40 now.

Oh I know. My point was strictly that we have no clue when he will be done. Even if we trade for him we won’t have a yearly commitment. It will still be year to year. But to say he’s only playing 1 year has the same amount of validity of me saying he’s playing 4 more years. Meaning neither are true.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, KingOfNewYork said:

Thing is it’s so uncharacteristic of Rodgers to play that way. Is it an anomaly or a sign of decline?

I’ll await a reply about Zach Wilson rather someone just having a discussion about those throws in particular.

Generally speaking, common sense probably needs to be applied here.  He's got a young WR group sans Allen Lazard and Randall Cobb to a lesser extent, nothing at the TE position, and arguably the worst OL production he's had as a starting QB.  And that's before mentioning the broken thumb he played with most of the year.  You don't go from back-to-back MVPs to suddenly forgetting how to play QB overnight.  You can blame it on the motivation, supporting cast, etc., but players don't fall off the cliff.

[CWood21]

35 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

He’s been doing that for years though and keeps playing. 

Agreed.  He's always talked about playing into his 40s, and it's not like he's struggled to stay healthy.  He's had his fair share of injuries, but never enough to keep him out for an extended period of time.  I feel confident that any team trading for him gets at least 2 years out of him.  And then there's also conditional picks if the Jets are worried he might not be there beyond the upcoming season.

[Bobby816]

5 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Agreed.  He's always talked about playing into his 40s, and it's not like he's struggled to stay healthy.  He's had his fair share of injuries, but never enough to keep him out for an extended period of time.  I feel confident that any team trading for him gets at least 2 years out of him.  And then there's also conditional picks if the Jets are worried he might not be there beyond the upcoming season.

I think it’s actually nearly impossible to predict how long he’ll play. Few scenarios….

1. We trade for him and he gets injured or we just look different than we did last year and miss the playoffs. I could see him retiring. Thinking this team isn’t close to a SB. This also if he had an injury could have him say I’m not going out like that as well.

2. We trade for him and we look good with him. But start out with some learning curves and only win 1 playoff game and finish second in the division. Making it to where we are unsure if he’s coming back.

3. We trade for him and we win a SB and he wants to end on top and retires.

4. We trade for him and we look great. Make a SB run but lose in the AFCCG or even SB. Keeping his hunger there and knowing we’re close so he likely comes back another year for sure.

5. We almost win a SB with him in 2023. He comes back and we almost win a SB again. I could easily see him coming back for a 3rd year as well. Knowing we’re that close.

[CWood21]

4 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I think it’s actually nearly impossible to predict how long he’ll play. Few scenarios….

1. We trade for him and he gets injured or we just look different than we did last year and miss the playoffs. I could see him retiring. Thinking this team isn’t close to a SB. This also if he had an injury could have him say I’m not going out like that as well.

2. We trade for him and we look good with him. But start out with some learning curves and only win 1 playoff game and finish second in the division. Making it to where we are unsure if he’s coming back.

3. We trade for him and we win a SB and he wants to end on top and retires.

4. We trade for him and we look great. Make a SB run but lose in the AFCCG or even SB. Keeping his hunger there and knowing we’re close so he likely comes back another year for sure.

5. We almost win a SB with him in 2023. He comes back and we almost win a SB again. I could easily see him coming back for a 3rd year as well. Knowing we’re that close.

If nothing else, Rodgers is an incredibly proud individual.  He cut out his own family from his life.  When he believes in something, he's going to see it through.  And I have little doubt that if Rodgers was traded, he's going to do everything in his power to prove to Green Bay that they were wrong to move on from him.  You think it's any coincidence that he was a back-to-back MVP after they took Jordan Love?  He's incredibly prideful.

For the first scenario, it goes back to him being prideful.  I don't see him wanting to go out like that.  He's also mentioned how legacy is important to him, and leaving Green Bay where he's played his entire career for one year in a lackluster situation seems unlikely at best.  The second scenario probably ends up with him coming back.  As for the 3rd scenario, isn't that the Jets' goal?  What would you pay for a championship?  Either way, I'm sure there will be some discussion about how long he's looking to play, and I'd imagine there could be protections in place in case he retires.

[KingOfNewYork]

54 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Generally speaking, common sense probably needs to be applied here.  He's got a young WR group sans Allen Lazard and Randall Cobb to a lesser extent, nothing at the TE position, and arguably the worst OL production he's had as a starting QB.  And that's before mentioning the broken thumb he played with most of the year.  You don't go from back-to-back MVPs to suddenly forgetting how to play QB overnight.  You can blame it on the motivation, supporting cast, etc., but players don't fall off the cliff.

So what was it? Everything around him or him?

The things we’d surround him with aren’t much better. 

We currently have 1 OL projected to start that isn’t coming off a season ending injury and he had an awful year. Our starting Center will hit free agency.

Our receiving core is Garrett Wilson and a bunch of inconsistent guys, two who might be cap casualties and two young guys who haven’t found themselves. 

Our stud running back is coming off an ACL tear so he’s not to be counted on right away.

Our offensive coaching staff is a bunch of dudes who just got fired. 

What’s Rodgers gonna do with this core that he couldn’t with Green Bay? It’s just an observation on my part.

[KimuraGod]

The more I’m looking into Derek Carr the more I’m favouring going in this route. 
 

I have never been his biggest fan but I haven’t watched a lot of raiders games over the last ten years to be fair. 
 

Knowing we can bring him in for no draft picks is huge. Even more so we know he’s attainable unlike Rodgers who may not even want to come here.

Ultimately the more simpler thing to do would be to sign Derek Carr and let JD keep his picks. He’s proven by sweeping the rookie awards he can identify talent. He may think losing the draft picks is a kick in the balls and negates one of his best strengths. 

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, KingOfNewYork said:

So what was it? Everything around him or him?

The things we’d surround him with aren’t much better. 

We currently have 1 OL projected to start that isn’t coming off a season ending injury and he had an awful year. Our starting Center will hit free agency.

Our receiving core is Garrett Wilson and a bunch of inconsistent guys, two who might be cap casualties and two young guys who haven’t found themselves. 

Our stud running back is coming off an ACL tear so he’s not to be counted on right away.

Our offensive coaching staff is a bunch of dudes who just got fired. 

What’s Rodgers gonna do with this core that he couldn’t with Green Bay? It’s just an observation on my part.

I think it's a combination of all of the above.  Is he getting older?  Absolutely.  But that was his first year where his best WR was Allen Lazard.  That's a far drop off from previous years when he had Davante Adams.  And I think his numbers look pretty damn good without having any real significant talent aside from his INTs.  He threw 12 interceptions last year, and the previous 3 seasons combined he threw 13 interceptions.  I'd bet a LOT of money on him not throwing 12 INTs next year.  And despite all those issues, Green Bay was middle-of-the-pack offensively.  And that's with a garbage defense.

Rodgers with a solid set of weapons and a strong defense is a championship contender.  Rodgers with a solid set of weapons without a strong defense isn't.  That's part of the reason why the Jets make more sense for Rodgers than the Raiders.  The Raiders are probably closer to what Rodgers had early in his career, although the Raiders don't have the individual defensive players Green Bay had (i.e. Charles Woodson, Clay Matthews, Tramon Williams, Nick Collins, etc.).  If the Jets can piece a halfway decent OL, that's a dangerous team especially when a guy like Rodgers will make the OL look better than they are.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, KimuraGod said:

Knowing we can bring him in for no draft picks is huge. Even more so we know he’s attainable unlike Rodgers who may not even want to come here.

Why are you assuming Carr wants to go to the Jets and Rodgers doesn't?  Just because he visited doesn't mean he wants to come here.  At this point, he's already met with New Orleans and he will meet with Carolina at some point.

[xrade]

3 hours ago, NYJETS52 said:

If Carr had better tape with cold weather games I wouldn't be opposed to him. 

As others have said, he has always been in a warm weather environment. It is quite conceivable that he could adjust to a cold weather environment. Maybe he can’t but he has never trained to play in such a situation. If that is the only point of contention sign me up. I’ll take the chance that he will adjust and be just fine in NJ.

[JetsandI]

2 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Why are you assuming Carr wants to go to the Jets and Rodgers doesn't?  Just because he visited doesn't mean he wants to come here.  At this point, he's already met with New Orleans and he will meet with Carolina at some point.

Dolphins whistle and Rodgers comes. 

[Bobby816]

What does everyone think we’ll do at WR if/when we cut Davis? Berrios might take a huge pay but to stay and be a dirty guy for us. So not totally sold he’s out. But that starting outside WR spot more than likely will be open.

 

In house option is Mims. Maybe it clicks for him this year and with pretty much a lock for better QB play. He might deserve a chance.

 

But there’s names like Lazard out there in FA if we get Rodgers. Hopkins has asked for a trade. And I’m sure there’s several others. Those are more win now type moves if we can create cap.

 

Laos can always go the draft route still and continue to build a young WR group in all phases.

[Big T]

28 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

What does everyone think we’ll do at WR if/when we cut Davis? Berrios might take a huge pay but to stay and be a dirty guy for us. So not totally sold he’s out. But that starting outside WR spot more than likely will be open.

 

In house option is Mims. Maybe it clicks for him this year and with pretty much a lock for better QB play. He might deserve a chance.

 

But there’s names like Lazard out there in FA if we get Rodgers. Hopkins has asked for a trade. And I’m sure there’s several others. Those are more win now type moves if we can create cap.

 

Laos can always go the draft route still and continue to build a young WR group in all phases.

[Big T]

Just now, Big T said:

29 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

What does everyone think we’ll do at WR if/when we cut Davis? Berrios might take a huge pay but to stay and be a dirty guy for us. So not totally sold he’s out. But that starting outside WR spot more than likely will be open.

 

In house option is Mims. Maybe it clicks for him this year and with pretty much a lock for better QB play. He might deserve a chance.

 

But there’s names like Lazard out there in FA if we get Rodgers. Hopkins has asked for a trade. And I’m sure there’s several others. Those are more win now type moves if we can create cap.

 

Laos can always go the draft route still and continue to build a young WR group in all phases.

Why spend money on FA's when the draft year after year produce good WR's with top end speed? Draft someone if it is necessary in the later rounds. As for Berrios? Undrafted  FA's is where we find our next Berrios.