turtle28 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 (edited) 7 hours ago, Slappy Mc said: Both Edgerrin Cooper and Patrick Queen are listed as ILBs. Jamin Davis won't be on this roster after next season. There is a strong chance the new staff benches him during the season if he continues to be subpar. Cooper & Queen aren't MLBs though. They're undersized and I don't want to look how Dallas did Sunday night. Queen already failed miserably as Jamin did at MLB as a rookie, that's why Baltimore traded for & then re-signed Roquan Smith. We should not be overpaying other teams WILB’s to play MLB. We need a 240 pound MLB who can play the run like a boss and be good enough in coverage where he's not a liability. I guess Cooper or Trotter Jr - should we take one of them - can put on weight like Holcomb & Jamin did. Edited January 17 by turtle28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 2 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Cooper & Queen aren't MLBs though. They're undersized and I don't want to look how Dallas did Sunday night. We need a 240 pound MLB who can play the run like a boss and be good enough in coverage where he's not a liability. I guess Cooper or Trotter Jr should we take him can put on weight like Holcomb & Jamin did. Both Queen and Cooper are 230 lbs... I'm really not seeing what the problem is. Hell for that matter Jamin Davis is 230+ lbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 8 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said: Both Queen and Cooper are 230 lbs... I'm really not seeing what the problem is. Hell for that matter Jamin Davis is 230+ lbs. It's not just about the size although it's just 1 reason. It's also about their ability to be the QB of the defense. Be the alpha, the leader. Queen wasn't that. Now like I said maybe he's developed more and learned from Roquan but if you overpay for a MLB who’s been playing WLB bc he couldn't hack it as a MLB you better get that move right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 I think we need a defensive coordinator and to know the scheme before we really dig into specific player fits. I don’t know anything about Edgerrin Cooper. But I’ve watched plenty of Patrick Queen, and I think the primary difference between him and Jamin Davis is that one of them eventually got to play next to Roquan Smith and one of them got to play next to Cody Barton. All of this speaks to a problem that I’ve been referencing for a while. There just aren’t many players out there in the world who can do everything you need from a 4-3 MLB — run with TEs and slots, run sideline to sideline, blitz the A gaps, take on blocks in the run game, and (perhaps most importantly), be the QB on defense. There is just a very small number of humans with the requisite speed and quickness, size and strength, and IQ/leadership. This scarcity is how you see a guy like Jack Campbell come off the board in the top 20 picks, to the surprise of all the draftniks. That’s a big reason why I’d like to see them consider a 3-4 defensive coach. Finding a true MLB and two true 4-3 DEs, to me, has become more difficult than finding the specific personnel parts for the 3-4. Having two ILBs shrinks the field for both of them, condenses their gap responsibilities, allows them to line up more clearly over TEs, etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 7 minutes ago, e16bball said: I think we need a defensive coordinator and to know the scheme before we really dig into specific player fits. I don’t know anything about Edgerrin Cooper. But I’ve watched plenty of Patrick Queen, and I think the primary difference between him and Jamin Davis is that one of them eventually got to play next to Roquan Smith and one of them got to play next to Cody Barton. All of this speaks to a problem that I’ve been referencing for a while. There just aren’t many players out there in the world who can do everything you need from a 4-3 MLB — run with TEs and slots, run sideline to sideline, blitz the A gaps, take on blocks in the run game, and (perhaps most importantly), be the QB on defense. There is just a very small number of humans with the requisite speed and quickness, size and strength, and IQ/leadership. This scarcity is how you see a guy like Jack Campbell come off the board in the top 20 picks, to the surprise of all the draftniks. That’s a big reason why I’d like to see them consider a 3-4 defensive coach. Finding a true MLB and two true 4-3 DEs, to me, has become more difficult than finding the specific personnel parts for the 3-4. Having two ILBs shrinks the field for both of them, condenses their gap responsibilities, allows them to line up more clearly over TEs, etc. Hopefully Adam can find our Fred Warner! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Are most fanbases like this fanbase? Its not even just particularly this site but its everywhere that I read. The obsession with trading back and taking somebody other than one of the best two QBs in this draft. Why is this fanbase so terrified of taking a QB that would take us to different heights potentially but are so willing and happy to roll with a Heinicke? And I guess a Howell for that matter after the season he had? And I love Sam. Everyone here knows I do but Maye is clearly more gifted. I totally understand it if we're picking 4th or beyond but we have the second pick in this draft with a guy who has been the CLEAR choice for this pick for two years now and fans would rather trade it away and draft a Spencer Rattler or something. I see Bears fans on their forums basically begging Poles to take Williams and we want to trade off of Maye and take an OL that is basically available in every single draft. I mean, am I the crazy one here who thinks this is like the easiest draft choice we've had in years? We don't have to trade up, we get to keep all of our resources to build around him and fans would rather trade back for a lesser talent. Again, I could be totally off-base here but I just have no clue why this fanbase is so scared of just picking the QB that was gifted to us? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 3 hours ago, Slappy Mc said: Both Queen and Cooper are 230 lbs... I'm really not seeing what the problem is. Hell for that matter Jamin Davis is 230+ lbs. It isn't Queen's size, he was completely lost at MLB before Roquan Smith showed up. Queen is not what we need a linebacker. We need someone smart who can call the defense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 2 hours ago, e16bball said: I think we need a defensive coordinator and to know the scheme before we really dig into specific player fits. I don’t know anything about Edgerrin Cooper. But I’ve watched plenty of Patrick Queen, and I think the primary difference between him and Jamin Davis is that one of them eventually got to play next to Roquan Smith and one of them got to play next to Cody Barton. All of this speaks to a problem that I’ve been referencing for a while. There just aren’t many players out there in the world who can do everything you need from a 4-3 MLB — run with TEs and slots, run sideline to sideline, blitz the A gaps, take on blocks in the run game, and (perhaps most importantly), be the QB on defense. There is just a very small number of humans with the requisite speed and quickness, size and strength, and IQ/leadership. This scarcity is how you see a guy like Jack Campbell come off the board in the top 20 picks, to the surprise of all the draftniks. That’s a big reason why I’d like to see them consider a 3-4 defensive coach. Finding a true MLB and two true 4-3 DEs, to me, has become more difficult than finding the specific personnel parts for the 3-4. Having two ILBs shrinks the field for both of them, condenses their gap responsibilities, allows them to line up more clearly over TEs, etc. 60%+ of the time the defense will be out of the nickel anyways. Idk if the base scheme matters. Regardless of the scheme you need a legit MLB who can run the defense and physically make all of the plays. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 1 hour ago, lavar703 said: Why is this fanbase so terrified of taking a QB that would take us to different heights potentially If this were true, I would feel the same as you, I just don't think any of these QBs are it. However, there is a WR, 2 OTs, and a TE that are easily can't miss prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 4 minutes ago, MKnight82 said: It isn't Queen's size, he was completely lost at MLB before Roquan Smith showed up. Queen is not what we need a linebacker. We need someone smart who can call the defense. We will agree to disagree. I think Roquan helped Patrick develop and take the next step. I hope that we pursue Queen if he makes it to FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 2 hours ago, lavar703 said: Are most fanbases like this fanbase? Its not even just particularly this site but its everywhere that I read. The obsession with trading back and taking somebody other than one of the best two QBs in this draft. Why is this fanbase so terrified of taking a QB that would take us to different heights potentially but are so willing and happy to roll with a Heinicke? And I guess a Howell for that matter after the season he had? And I love Sam. Everyone here knows I do but Maye is clearly more gifted. I totally understand it if we're picking 4th or beyond but we have the second pick in this draft with a guy who has been the CLEAR choice for this pick for two years now and fans would rather trade it away and draft a Spencer Rattler or something. I see Bears fans on their forums basically begging Poles to take Williams and we want to trade off of Maye and take an OL that is basically available in every single draft. I mean, am I the crazy one here who thinks this is like the easiest draft choice we've had in years? We don't have to trade up, we get to keep all of our resources to build around him and fans would rather trade back for a lesser talent. Again, I could be totally off-base here but I just have no clue why this fanbase is so scared of just picking the QB that was gifted to us? Its months away from the draft and we don't even know what our coaching staff is. Everyone is just speculating at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 3 hours ago, ARTMONK HOF said: Hopefully Adam can find our Fred Warner! I don't know Cooper’s personality but after reading up on him there's a chance @Slappy Mc is on to something with him. Cooper is 6’3, 230 which is the same size as Fred Warner. On NFL draft buzz they suggested maybe he could be a MLB despite not really having the size you want for the position but, he is faster than Warner. Cooper is projected to run in the 4.5s in the 40 while Warner ran a 4.64. https://www.nfldraftbuzz.com/Player/Edgerrin-Cooper-LB-TexasAANDM Cooper chases well in pursuit, and Cooper has the athleticism to play in space if asked to drop into coverage. He’s very good in coverage when looking into the backfield in zone coverage. Shows toughness to get under the pads of tackles to bull them, club them upfield to get the inside lane, or fight through blocks for secondary rush when the passer steps up. He’s rangy and instinctive when he’s looking into the backfield as a zone defender. Gets pressures on inside stunts and was too explosive for college guards to handle. A bit stiff but makes the clean open-field tackle. Good effort in pursuit.“ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 https://x.com/justinm_nfl/status/1747281338892275854?s=46&t=2t2xRNrO1QNClepTGhzBVg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 1 hour ago, Slappy Mc said: We will agree to disagree. I think Roquan helped Patrick develop and take the next step. I hope that we pursue Queen if he makes it to FA. Thinking and knowing are two different things. I hope that's true. I trust Peters & our next HC to do their homework on Queen and/or Cooper to Determine if they can handle being the alpha male leader and play caller on D on top of just evaluating if they can actually be a Mlb or if they're better off staying at OLB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted January 17 Share Posted January 17 (edited) @Slappy Mc I just have to point this out to everyone. When Lynch, Peters & Kyle got to the 49ers, in their first draft in 2017, they overthought the Qbs prospects in that draft and drafted a bust in Soloman Thomas while passing on Qbs like Patrick Mahomes & DeShaun Watson. He needs to not overthink it and take the QB he likes the best. Edited January 17 by turtle28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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