Antonio Pierce named HC

[bucksavage1]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

The success rate of former players turned head coaches is meh and interim coaches turned full time coaches is also terrible.

You just said that list had no SB winners of ex players turned to coaches . So we’re trust your fuzzy success rate math?

 

[big_palooka]

3 hours ago, Styrian Raider said:

I thought it's the responsibility of the HC to build the staff? So when Ben Johnson is building the offensive staff in Detroit, then AP "just" needs a veteran OC, who has those connections, right?
I don't even see the connection Johnson has to the rest of the Lions staff (except for Dan Campbell, who has hired him). So obviously you can build a staff without connections to the whole league.

Of course you can build a staff that way, but is that the best way? That's how you end up with a re-tread throw away OC most the time. 

It's personal preference. Personally, I like the McVey/Shanahan route. On the cutting edge, working with dynamic thought leaders and growing coaches. As an example, Demeco Ryans a DC for the 49ers, hiring Slowik a young up and comer on their offensive staff to run his offense. 

So sure, AP can build a staff but it's a little bit different being around the block identifying guys who can be good teachers and just relying on referrals and guys your GM might know. 

[big_palooka]

2 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Players become coaches sometimes also I wonder how long before the mannings get into coaching?

 

That is not what I asked. You're deflecting.

And never. 

 

Edited December 19, 2023 by big_palooka

[NCOUGHMAN]

46 minutes ago, Nightmare said:

Why do you think the Mannings would want that headache?

They’ve got a nice TV gig which will pay them very well (plus endorsements), for a fraction of the time/effort/work.

They do a lot with hs qbs a college qbs just curious 

[NCOUGHMAN]

13 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

That is not what I asked. You're deflecting.

And never. 

 

Ooooookay lol

[NYRaider]

1 hour ago, bucksavage1 said:

You just said that list had no SB winners of ex players turned to coaches . So we’re trust your fuzzy success rate math?

 

AP is not him brother, he is getting whooped on Christmas and then getting fired.

[big_palooka]

3 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Ooooookay lol

So you can't answer it? 

[Darbsk]

3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

AP is not him brother, he is getting whooped on Christmas and then getting fired.

What?!?! You think if we lose to the Chiefs, Pierce then gets fired without finishing out the season???

No way is that happening regardless of the score.

[NCOUGHMAN]

35 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

So you can't answer it? 

Why does the former player have to be a coach to be a resource?

[NJ Raider]

When you root for a team with so much turnover, speculation becomes both a hobby and a habit. With Pierce having little nfl coaching experience, it's only natural to make connections to former teammates. We have no idea what sort of relationship these players had or have, but Chad Morton played with Pierce in Washington and is the current RB Coach/Run Game Coordinator in Seattle. Not saying it's going to happen, but Seattle is always pretty good at running the ball, and that's what Pierce wants. He's actually been coaching in the NFL for over ten years and has worked for two classy organizations in Green Bay and Seattle. With coaching candidates, I want guys from winning organizations. I'm not saying this is going to happen, nor would it be a splash hire, but it could be worse. I'm sure he's learned from Carroll, Canales, and Waldron. The Pete Carroll tree is actually a thing.

[NYRaider]

2 hours ago, Darbsk said:

What?!?! You think if we lose to the Chiefs, Pierce then gets fired without finishing out the season???

No way is that happening regardless of the score.

We can only pray my brother.

[Styrian Raider]

11 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Of course you can build a staff that way, but is that the best way? That's how you end up with a re-tread throw away OC most the time. 

It's personal preference. Personally, I like the McVey/Shanahan route. On the cutting edge, working with dynamic thought leaders and growing coaches. As an example, Demeco Ryans a DC for the 49ers, hiring Slowik a young up and comer on their offensive staff to run his offense. 

So sure, AP can build a staff but it's a little bit different being around the block identifying guys who can be good teachers and just relying on referrals and guys your GM might know. 

Not saying that's the best way. I'm just thinking about the possibilities there are and trying to analize them with a neutral point of view.

And Ben Johnson has no way more experience in hiring staff than AP has. Johnson is for sure a rising star on the offense side of the ball, but we also often see these rising stars fall, when they have to form their own vision of the whole team. Doesn't mean Johnson will fail, but he is also not a surefire star HC.

AP does a good job, considering the circumstances he's in (Rookie 4th round QB or Jimmy G - Rookie OC & Play caller with the shatters of a JMD playbook). Should he get handed the HC position without any further search? No.
But he at least has earned the chance for an interview (already) and put forward was his plans are for QBOTF, the offense and the defense (for the defense I don't expect that much changes from AP but it has to be mentioned).

And if Mark or even better the new GM is conviced that this the right way, then give him the HC position.

Personally think it's either AP or Frank Smith that's getting the job, since I'm convinced that Champ Kelly get's the fulltime GM job and Frank Smith has ties to both Kelly and the Raiders.
 

[big_palooka]

10 hours ago, NJ Raider said:

When you root for a team with so much turnover, speculation becomes both a hobby and a habit. With Pierce having little nfl coaching experience, it's only natural to make connections to former teammates. We have no idea what sort of relationship these players had or have, but Chad Morton played with Pierce in Washington and is the current RB Coach/Run Game Coordinator in Seattle. Not saying it's going to happen, but Seattle is always pretty good at running the ball, and that's what Pierce wants. He's actually been coaching in the NFL for over ten years and has worked for two classy organizations in Green Bay and Seattle. With coaching candidates, I want guys from winning organizations. I'm not saying this is going to happen, nor would it be a splash hire, but it could be worse. I'm sure he's learned from Carroll, Canales, and Waldron. The Pete Carroll tree is actually a thing.

Then just hire Shane Waldron who's got a the resume, worked with Pete Carroll and Mcvey before that and is viewed as an up and coming HC candidate. 

[big_palooka]

4 hours ago, Styrian Raider said:

And Ben Johnson has no way more experience in hiring staff than AP has. Johnson is for sure a rising star on the offense side of the ball, but we also often see these rising stars fall, when they have to form their own vision of the whole team. Doesn't mean Johnson will fail, but he is also not a surefire star HC.

Answer this. You're an owner, would you rather have Ben Johnson with a decade plus resume coaching in the NFL. Currently running one of the best offenses in football. Or Pierce, a LB coach with < 2 years NFL coaching experience? Who's the guy you trust with your QB position that you're rebuilding?

4 hours ago, Styrian Raider said:

AP does a good job, considering the circumstances he's in (Rookie 4th round QB or Jimmy G - Rookie OC & Play caller with the shatters of a JMD playbook). Should he get handed the HC position without any further search? No.
But he at least has earned the chance for an interview (already) and put forward was his plans are for QBOTF, the offense and the defense (for the defense I don't expect that much changes from AP but it has to be mentioned).

He's already getting an interview. That's what being an interim coach is. And sure, he should get an opportunity to lay out his plan. 

But outside getting guys motivated to play, which they never quit in the first place, what is he excelling at? His in game decision making and clock management are horrible.

4 hours ago, Styrian Raider said:

Personally think it's either AP or Frank Smith that's getting the job, since I'm convinced that Champ Kelly get's the fulltime GM job and Frank Smith has ties to both Kelly and the Raiders.

I'm convinced Mark hires Kelly as well, which I'm not a huge fan of. Frank Smith would make sense, but don't dismiss the Chargers in hiring him. He has ties there as well and that is a more attractive job given QB. 

[Rolni]

We like to forget that not only our HC gig will be open!

There will be mulitple openings and ours is definately not the best one.