2018 Draft Thread I

[Forge]

15 minutes ago, oldman9er said:

I don't know who or what is being debated, if it's not about whether R Smith would play at MLB or WLB. I thought you were saying Smith could not play MLB, and would be forced to play WLB, thereby making other dude useless. 

That's what I thought was being discussed, but if I'm wrong, my bad.. no prob. Been a busy and chaotic morning for me. 

edit:

had a moment to go back and read... and like I thought.. this stood out in your post:

IF we draft Roquan, that will basically mean that Malcolm Smith is a complete waste of money for three years though. Neither one of them should be playing anywhere other than the WILL spot. Not saying that we shouldn't draft Roquan because of that, but it's true. 

And I stand by that. We aren't going to put either at MIKE with Foster...that leaves Will and SAM, the two of which are completely different and has nothing to do with being a 3-4 ILB. Neither of them should be playing the SAM role...and I think you'll struggle to find anyone who thinks that Roquan should be playing SAM at the next level. Would be a huge waste of a lot of his skill set. 

[oldman9er]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

And I stand by that. We aren't going to put either at MIKE with Foster...that leaves Will and SAM, the two of which are completely different and has nothing to do with being a 3-4 ILB. Neither of them should be playing the SAM role...and I think you'll struggle to find anyone who thinks that Roquan should be playing SAM at the next level. Would be a huge waste of a lot of his skill set. 

I added more to that above post for perhaps better clarity.

I am not counting on Foster for anything, at this point... and no. Neither Smith or Smith is ideal for SAM. 

[Forge]

Just now, oldman9er said:

I added more to that above post for perhaps better clarity.

I am not counting on Foster for anything, at this point... and no. Neither Smith or Smith is ideal for SAM. 

Oh, if we are chucking Foster out the window (well, you know what I mean...not chucking him out the window, but as you said, not counting on him lol), then yeah, I don't mind giving Roquan a shot at the MIKE spot. 

[Forge]

1 hour ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

 

Anyways, Kiper released his latest mock draft today and has Rosen falling to #11. That would be GREAT for us as a team like the Bills would likely to want to move up and take him. We could probably get around the same level of player at 21 in this draft than at 9 or 10. And we would probably get both their 1st rounders this year or at least a 1st and a 1st in 2019.

I really hope that is the case. That would be pretty huge. I think at that point we can expect both of Buffalo's first round picks to be honest, because I think it would be high demand. I've been reticent to think that we could get both firsts in the past (though I really shouldn't doubt Paraag's ability in this regard). 

[NcFinest9erFan]

So where would we play Edumonds? 

 

9. San Francisco: Tremaine Edmunds, LB, Virginia Tech
Edmunds came on my radar late in the season. He’s a freak, built for the K.J. Wright/De’Vondre Campbell role in the Niners’ Seattle-style scheme. 

-Albert Beer's mock. 

[NcFinest9erFan]

11 minutes ago, Forge said:

I really hope that is the case. That would be pretty huge. I think at that point we can expect both of Buffalo's first round picks to be honest, because I think it would be high demand. I've been reticent to think that we could get both firsts in the past (though I really shouldn't doubt Paraag's ability in this regard). 

and possibly squeeze out another pick? a 2019 pick?

[NcFinest9erFan]

https://ninerswire.usatoday.com/2018/02/21/49ers-trade-back-for-iowa-cornerback-josh-jackson-in-mock-nfl-draft/4/

[Forge]

50 minutes ago, NcFinest9erFan said:

So where would we play Edumonds? 

 

9. San Francisco: Tremaine Edmunds, LB, Virginia Tech
Edmunds came on my radar late in the season. He’s a freak, built for the K.J. Wright/De’Vondre Campbell role in the Niners’ Seattle-style scheme. 

-Albert Beer's mock. 

He can play any of the three positions, or should be able to in time, but I don't love his instincts for the MIKE role yet. That would be something I would groom him into. I've been advocating that he would start out at SAM (and thus let Malcolm Smith stay at WILL) though he's not perfect in coverage. Still, long athlete, should be able to blitz from there, is athletic enough to cover, etc. He's got a lot of growing to do though

[NcFinest9erFan]

8 minutes ago, Forge said:

He can play any of the three positions, or should be able to in time, but I don't love his instincts for the MIKE role yet. That would be something I would groom him into. I've been advocating that he would start out at SAM (and thus let Malcolm Smith stay at WILL) though he's not perfect in coverage. Still, long athlete, should be able to blitz from there, is athletic enough to cover, etc. He's got a lot of growing to do though

Yeah that's one thing that scares me about him is that he's really athletic and may rely on that solely. Although I guess that would be fine when you look at someone like Shazier? probably not the most fundamentally sound LB but bc he's so athletic that he's able to make up for it 

[big9erfan]

I get all the talk about where a guy  an play.  I just have this notion, silly though it might be, that the game has changed enough in just the past few years and is stil changing, to the extent that it matters less than it used to. Defenses are much more flexible than they used to be. Guys that used to line up only on the edge now rush from the middle, or loop way more than they used to. The "best" pass rusher on a team now rushes from both sides of the line; some guys ever more from the defensive left side thant he right side. Safeties are sometimes indistinguishable from linebackers. At the very same time it's more important than ever for both safeties to be able to  cover well. And linebacker roles seem to have changed as well. Guys now rush when from spots where they would not have, or only rarely so, in the past. So many receivers are in the game and moving around so much that almost every lienbacker needs to cover guys. The "strong side" of the line changes so much, and so late in the pre-snap process,  that it is really awkward for LBs to have to adjust to last minute motion from the TE or an H-back. Then there's a lot of heavy 2-TE sets where there is not "strong" side. While there are theoretical, and even practical, reasons why one particular LB spot should have a slightly different skill set than another, I think that distinction is more blurred than ever - and it's likely to be more so in the future, not less so.

[Forge]

10 minutes ago, big9erfan said:

I get all the talk about where a guy  an play.  I just have this notion, silly though it might be, that the game has changed enough in just the past few years and is stil changing, to the extent that it matters less than it used to. Defenses are much more flexible than they used to be. Guys that used to line up only on the edge now rush from the middle, or loop way more than they used to. The "best" pass rusher on a team now rushes from both sides of the line; some guys ever more from the defensive left side thant he right side. Safeties are sometimes indistinguishable from linebackers. At the very same time it's more important than ever for both safeties to be able to  cover well. And linebacker roles seem to have changed as well. Guys now rush when from spots where they would not have, or only rarely so, in the past. So many receivers are in the game and moving around so much that almost every lienbacker needs to cover guys. The "strong side" of the line changes so much, and so late in the pre-snap process,  that it is really awkward for LBs to have to adjust to last minute motion from the TE or an H-back. Then there's a lot of heavy 2-TE sets where there is not "strong" side. While there are theoretical, and even practical, reasons why one particular LB spot should have a slightly different skill set than another, I think that distinction is more blurred than ever - and it's likely to be more so in the future, not less so.

Yet people still struggle with scheme fits all the time. Malcolm Smith was fine in Seattle. Awful in Oakland. Mark Barron couldn't play safety - lights out as a WILL. Tank Carradine's development was completely destroyed because we couldn't figure out what to do with him. Jerry Hughes is extremely notable for having far more success in a scheme specific change. Arik Armstead. Scheme fit / role fit can still be extremely important. 

It's probably muted some because teams are in nickel and dime packages quite a bit with the proliferation of passing in the NFL, but again, that may change your entire personnel. Your SAM backer may not be on the field for that, you may drop 3 safeties in there, may pull your MLB. Depends on the defense and what you are doing. If you want the guy to blitz out of your nickel package, you may go one LB over another, whereas if you want him to cover a tight end, you may go with the other. In a 2 TE set, you're probably not changing your base personnel overly much, but how they are placed on the field would definitely depend on how they are stacked at the line. 

[GW21]

7 hours ago, Forge said:

He can play any of the three positions, or should be able to in time, but I don't love his instincts for the MIKE role yet. That would be something I would groom him into. I've been advocating that he would start out at SAM (and thus let Malcolm Smith stay at WILL) though he's not perfect in coverage. Still, long athlete, should be able to blitz from there, is athletic enough to cover, etc. He's got a lot of growing to do though

I think he’s an ideal fit for SAM in our system. I would not at all be upset if we landed him to upgrade over Eli Harold. The good thing about being 19 is you have time to grow. I’m excited to see what this dude turns into when he’s fully grown into himself. 

[NcFinest9erFan]

https://www.fourthandnine.co/single-post/2018/02/19/Profiling-49ers-2018-draft-options-Minkah-Fitzpatrick-DB-Alabama

 

Thoughts?

[big9erfan]

On 2/21/2018 at 10:06 AM, NcFinest9erFan said:

and possibly squeeze out another pick? a 2019 pick?

Just saw a site that was suggesting the exact opposite.  They were suggesting our first plus number 74 for 21 and 22.  I'm probably on board with 9 or 10 even up for 21 and 22, but not at all on board with adding in 74. There are three guys who will likely be available at 9 or 10 (Ward, Smith and possibly Nelson depending on how mnay QBs go top 8) that I think are "can't miss" types. I see their floor as good NFL starter and a decent chance at pro bowl.  At 21/22 there are a number of guys I like, but none that I think are "can't miss" types. I'm not willing to give a way a high third inaddition to 9 or 10 to get two guys like that.

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 hour ago, NcFinest9erFan said:

https://www.fourthandnine.co/single-post/2018/02/19/Profiling-49ers-2018-draft-options-Minkah-Fitzpatrick-DB-Alabama

 

Thoughts?

Like him a lot more than I did earlier in the season. Just have to be open minded and use him all over the field. Can't just stick him in the slot or outside, use him everywhere. He's a stud.