RuskieTitan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 30+ pages and 3 weeks to get keepers in. He was slobbering all over Donald as per usual. Then he doesn't tag him. That's on the owner IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khodder Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 7 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: 30+ pages and 3 weeks to get keepers in. He was slobbering all over Donald as per usual. Then he doesn't tag him. That's on the owner IMO. This. 100% this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 7 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: If it ain't broke... Clearly at least 4 people think it is broke... so.... 8 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: You want to risk for the future, by all means, go for it, but why should the rules be changed to benefit a team such as yourself with young talent? How am I asking this? I’m stating that situations where players are tested and then moved because they don’t work shouldn’t be treated like Harper is. It doesn’t matter if it’s two young players, Josh Gordon, Nick Foles, or whoever. 11 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: As far as JJ Watt is concerned, IMO 3-4 DEs and 4-3 DTs are interchangeable. If someone shifted Watt to utilize him as a 4-3 DE to pass rush more, then they should pay the keeper price. It sort of stinks for Flux in the sense that he didn't have a hand in that initial decision, but as Nacho pointed out, once a player gets 'paid' a certain keeper level, they want to continue to get paid that level. And again, this is a very specific situation for one particular player. 99% of the league does not require any sort of discussion about this, as we all understand the rules and there's minimal or no owner turnover. I just don't see why we should be changing how things are done simply to account for the periodic 1% difference. Olivier Vernon JJ Watt Kelechi Osemele Justin Houston Ryan Kerrigan All 5 are this season where at tag issue has come up. The first four are all at 3 tags where their owner had wanted to move them to 2, the last is someone who wanted to test a player at 3 tags but knew if it didn’t work, they were losing the player long term. This is way more than a 1% issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuskieTitan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 1 minute ago, iPwn said: Olivier Vernon JJ Watt Kelechi Osemele Justin Houston Ryan Kerrigan All 5 are this season where at tag issue has come up. The first four are all at 3 tags where their owner had wanted to move them to 2, the last is someone who wanted to test a player at 3 tags but knew if it didn’t work, they were losing the player long term. This is way more than a 1% issue. Each roster has 13 offensive starting positions, 11 defensive, 6 K/P & coaches, and then 5 practice squad spots, for a total of 35 players and coaches. 35 times 16 teams is a total of 560 eligible keeper players and coaches 5 players listed comes out to 0.89%, or effectively 1%. I do believe the math shows it is not 'way more' than a 1% issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 16 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: There is literally no reason every single owner can't come in the moment Nacho notified them this thread was up for the current season, and set their keepers right then and there. You can always change them before the deadline and make trades, but you won't end up missing any deadlines or holding the league up. It was weeks ago that Nacho notified us of the thread and the deadlines were posted. The one owner who still hasn't done his and another who missed a player on his roster are mistakes that those owners need to live with. If they didn't like it, they had plenty of time like the rest of us to have that in. If it wasn't Aaron Donald, I don't think Nacho would have made that comment with regards to Rammy. Strongly agree. And it’s pretty obvious it was because it was Donald. SC not getting an extension to set his tags makes it clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuskieTitan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Look, I've had to make tough calls in the past myself because of keepers. I didn't feel Justin Houston was worth keeping around at 3 tags back when all DE and OLB were the same price (and I had been running a 4-3). I used Houston at 4-3 DE for 4 games and a playoff game, and felt the production I got out of him in that scheme wasn't worth the keeper price, so I traded him away (for Orakpo, a better fit). It wasn't ideal and I had a very limited window of seeing what my player was going to produce, but I had to make a call based on the rules and figure it out. Just because the rules restrict you from being able to do something doesn't mean you turn around and make exceptions or discussions or committees to accommodate that, it just means you need to figure out a way to make it work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuskieTitan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 But at the end of the day I suppose we can agree to disagree. Nothing personal, I enjoyed having this discussion and being able to lay out my perspectives as an owner, and I more than welcome others to also join in with their opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 1 minute ago, RuskieTitan said: Each roster has 13 offensive starting positions, 11 defensive, 6 K/P & coaches, and then 5 practice squad spots, for a total of 35 players and coaches. 35 times 16 teams is a total of 560 eligible keeper players and coaches 5 players listed comes out to 0.89%, or effectively 1%. I do believe the math shows it is not 'way more' than a 1% issue. Why are you basing your numbers on all players when we’re only discussing the ones that end up tagged? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: Look, I've had to make tough calls in the past myself because of keepers. I didn't feel Justin Houston was worth keeping around at 3 tags back when all DE and OLB were the same price (and I had been running a 4-3). I used Houston at 4-3 DE for 4 games and a playoff game, and felt the production I got out of him in that scheme wasn't worth the keeper price, so I traded him away (for Orakpo, a better fit). It wasn't ideal and I had a very limited window of seeing what my player was going to produce, but I had to make a call based on the rules and figure it out. Just because the rules restrict you from being able to do something doesn't mean you turn around and make exceptions or discussions or committees to accommodate that, it just means you need to figure out a way to make it work. I just don’t think that “this is the way it’s always been” is a good enough reason to justify shutting down the idea of change. Even if they don’t change here, I’d like to at least discuss the merits of making adaptations. I do want to do that second league, and at the very least, if we can have a discussion beyond appealing to history, it would benefit that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 leave it as is.. If you guys wan't free ones just dm Gmen and Psid. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuskieTitan Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 1 minute ago, iPwn said: 6 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: Each roster has 13 offensive starting positions, 11 defensive, 6 K/P & coaches, and then 5 practice squad spots, for a total of 35 players and coaches. 35 times 16 teams is a total of 560 eligible keeper players and coaches 5 players listed comes out to 0.89%, or effectively 1%. I do believe the math shows it is not 'way more' than a 1% issue. Why are you basing your numbers on all players when we’re only discussing the ones that end up tagged? All 560 are eligible for being tagged. One team could potentially tag 5 PS who never played, 2 rookies who played for 7 total tags, then a premier 3, 5 twos for a total of 13 keepers, vs a team that used 4 on a QB, 15 on 5 players costing 3 each and a PS for a total of 7 players. Can't anticipate how many keepers each team has, so just going off the whole pool of eligible players and coaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scalamania Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 @TheKillerNacho please move my defense to a 3-4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Pwns been here for all of what 2 seasons hasn't won poop? Yet the dude want's to repaint the mona lisa? Nacho already blessed dudes with rookies costing one tag. Don't bite the hand that feeds you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwny Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 1 minute ago, El ramster said: Pwns been here for all of what 2 seasons hasn't won poop? Yet the dude want's to repaint the mona lisa? Nacho already blessed dudes with rookies costing one tag. Don't bite the hand that feeds you. I’ve been here for 6 seasons. Further, why does tenure matter when opening up a dialogue about potential changes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Just now, iPwn said: I’ve been here for 6 seasons. Further, why does tenure matter when opening up a dialogue about potential changes. Because it's not broken... What i'll be behind you is the nerf system.. But that's it. 20 Tags are more than enough.. You can keep trading and stock piling up tags ala what ruskie does and trade 1+2 for 5 tags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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