Aztec Hammer Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 11 minutes ago, buno67 said: The browns don’t need draft wealthy or top tier draft capital. They need top tier talent. Plain and simple. We complain every year about the GM trying to our smart everyone and win the draft with trades and deals. It be great for once that the browns did the obvious thing like taking the best defensive player and winning the draft because they took top tier talent We complain every year about the GM passing on the QB. The entire reason we even have a chance to take what you consider to be the best defensive player is because we were smart and made trades and deals. There’s a balance to be found as far as I’m concerned. I’m not trading down just for the sake of trading down. But if it’s Chubb or 12, 22 and a 2019 1st, I’m doing it in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 hour ago, buno67 said: The browns don’t need draft wealthy or top tier draft capital. This is idiocy, plain and simple. Every team needs as much draft capital as they can get. Show me a team that had too much in the way of positive assets. I’ll wait. 1 hour ago, buno67 said: They need top tier talent. Plain and simple. We complain every year about the GM trying to our smart everyone and win the draft with trades and deals. For every trade down that hasn’t worked is a top 10 pick that hasn’t worked. 1 hour ago, buno67 said: It be great for once that the browns did the obvious thing like taking the best defensive player and winning the draft because they took top tier talent This has been beat to death buno, top picks bust too. The odds of Chubb being the best player in this class defensively when people look back 10-15 years from now aren’t great. Do you fail to realize the teams that are consistently good rarely pick in the top 10, and yet they have plenty of talent to win. How’s that work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 52 minutes ago, Aztec Hammer said: The entire reason we even have a chance to take what you consider to be the best defensive player is because we were smart and made trades and deals. This fact is obviously lost on a number of folks here. 52 minutes ago, Aztec Hammer said: There’s a balance to be found as far as I’m concerned. I’m not trading down just for the sake of trading down. But if it’s Chubb or 12, 22 and a 2019 1st, I’m doing it in a heartbeat. This. 3 top 25 picks vs Chubb, I’ll take the picks. Hell everyone complained about the trade down last year and passing on elite talent. Who would give back 4 and Peppers for Malik Hooker (which is who Hue and the coaches apparently wanted)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBrownsman Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 35 minutes ago, Aztec Hammer said: We complain every year about the GM passing on the QB. The entire reason we even have a chance to take what you consider to be the best defensive player is because we were smart and made trades and deals. There’s a balance to be found as far as I’m concerned. I’m not trading down just for the sake of trading down. But if it’s Chubb or 12, 22 and a 2019 1st, I’m doing it in a heartbeat. I've said this before and I'm happy to keep repeating it. It's not like we are trading a 1st for a bunch of 2nd's and 3rd's. I love Bradley Chubb, and if we pick at 4 I definitely want him. But if you trade away 4 and can pick only 8 spots lower gaining 2 extra 1st round picks, I don't understand how you don't do that... The NFL is not just about having 1 or 2 blue chip players, its about having a deep and talented roster. Looking at the Steelers just as an example, their best players, Antonio Brown (taken 195 overall in 2010), LaVeon Bell (taken 48th overall), Ben Roethlisberger (taken 11th overall), Cameron Heyward (taken 31st overall), David DeCastro (taken 24th overall), Maurkice Pouncy (Taken 18th overall), Stephon Tuitt (taken 46th overall), the list could go on and on but I don't need to. A lot of first and second round guys, yes, but none of the top 5 guys in the drafts and they are perennially good.... Even looking at a team who hasn't been great but who has really turned it on lately, why not look at the Rams. Yes Jared Goff was taken 1st overall, but Todd Gurley was 10th overall, Aaron Donald was 13th overall, Lemarcus Joyner was 41st overall, Trumaine Johnson was 65th overall, Roger Saffold was 33rd overall, Robert Woods was 41st overall. How about Jacksonville. They have been terrible for a long time before finally becoming good, so you would think all their best players are blue chip prospects and their top 10 picks in the draft right? Give them credit for hitting on Jaylen Ramsey at 5th overall, and Leonard Fournette at 4th ovearll, but AJ Bouye was undrafted, Barry Church, undrafted, Tashaun Gipson Undrafted, Myles Jack 36th overall, Marquis Lee was 36th overall, Allen Robinson 61st overall, Calais Campbell was 50th overall, Malik Jackson was 157th overall, Telvin Smith was 144th overall, Yannick Ngakoue was 69th overall. So yeah, did they have a few top picks in the draft? sure! but is anyone going to argue to me that Donte Fowler, and Blake Bortles are the best players on their team? I know everyone thinks the top of the draft is a sure thing and guarantees a great player, but it REALLY doesn't. Even good players have injury issues, and some don't pan out, so many things could go wrong when you talk 1 top draft pick vs many possible first rounders. Were not talking about trading all our picks away, were talking about picking up 3 first rounders for 1....WHILE STILL GETTING THE FIRST OVERALL PICK AND BEST QB IN THE DRAFT. I would trade down 100 times out of 100 if I'm offered #12, #22 and a 2019 first round pick for #4...we could turn that into 3 potential starters and stars on our team, but even if we cant, it gives us a MUCH better chance on getting at least 1.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie man Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 hour ago, buno67 said: The browns don’t need draft wealthy or top tier draft capital. They need top tier talent. Plain and simple. We complain every year about the GM trying to our smart everyone and win the draft with trades and deals. It be great for once that the browns did the obvious thing like taking the best defensive player and winning the draft because they took top tier talent Nah man this is different if a team is trading up for a QB that takes all the other stuff outta the picture Buffalo is a great trade partner look at it this way Best offensive player in the league right now = Odell who was taken at pick 12 Best defensive player in the league right now = Aaron Donald taken at pick 11 Defensive Rookie of the year = Marshon Lattimore was taken at pick 11 trading down to 12 does not take us out of the elite talent area. Especially if it gets us 22 and a 2019 first or their 2nd and 65 and a 2019 first thats extremely valuable and continuing to add top players to this team. Gotta take advantage when teams want QBs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Aztec Hammer said: We complain every year about the GM passing on the QB. The entire reason we even have a chance to take what you consider to be the best defensive player is because we were smart and made trades and deals. There’s a balance to be found as far as I’m concerned. I’m not trading down just for the sake of trading down. But if it’s Chubb or 12, 22 and a 2019 1st, I’m doing it in a heartbeat. Actually if the browns took the QB last year they would still be in position for the best defensive player. Instead of pairing Chubb with Darnold it’s pairing Watson with Chubb. Also you talk about these smart trades. Actually the trade that started those whole thing looks extremely dumb because the browns could of had their franchise QB in wentz but they just didn’t like I’m enough or didn’t want to risk their jobs on him. I’m not doing that in a heart beat cause I think Chubb is going to be that good. We also have no idea how good the bills could be. No guarantee that it will be a top5 pick from them. Yeah the bills play against the pats twice a year but also gave the jets and dolphins. That’s potentially 4-2 right there. I just like the idea of drafting one of the best players in the draft this year then settling for the #2 and #3/4 player at their position group later on. If Chubb is there you take him, if not trade down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 10 minutes ago, buno67 said: Actually if the browns took the QB last year they would still be in position for the best defensive player. Instead of pairing Chubb with Darnold it’s pairing Watson with Chubb. Also you talk about these smart trades. Actually the trade that started those whole thing looks extremely dumb because the browns could of had their franchise QB in wentz but they just didn’t like I’m enough or didn’t want to risk their jobs on him. I’m not doing that in a heart beat cause I think Chubb is going to be that good. We also have no idea how good the bills could be. No guarantee that it will be a top5 pick from them. Yeah the bills play against the pats twice a year but also gave the jets and dolphins. That’s potentially 4-2 right there. I just like the idea of drafting one of the best players in the draft this year then settling for the #2 and #3/4 player at their position group later on. If Chubb is there you take him, if not trade down Watson coming off his 2nd ACL? Eh I don’t know. You’re also working with hindsight. There were very few people on this board that wanted Watson. MWil23 I think is the only guy I can think of. In your scenario, we take Watson last year and Chubb this year with our only first rounder. I hated going 0-16, but I’d rather have Darnold out of that pain, and the freedom to take the draft as it comes to me at the 4th pick. As well as Jabrill Peppers who still has the chance to be good if we just play the man in his actual position doing things he has actually good at. Even if the Bills pick ended up being 15th, I’d take that deal in a heartbeat. 12, 22 and 15. No question. Considering they are playing either a rookie or a QB that has only played like two career games and have a rubbish roster, I’ll take my chances. Yeah we should’ve taken Wentz. That one I agree with. Knowing what we know now. But again it’s working with hindsight. And it’s another dude with an ACL. We need to pump the brakes a bit with the revisionist history. He’s a 61% passer, albeit a clearly good one, on a loaded team. Maybe the most loaded team in the league. It’s not like this board was desperate for Wentz. Many recognised we had an all-time bad roster at the time though so it is what it is. If we took Wentz, what would our roster look like now without those dumb trades, and all those picks we’ve got even this year because of them? I doubt Wentz would’ve had the same success. Yeah it sucked we had to sit through 1-31, but we’re here now and we have a strong dose of talent already (because of those dumb trades) as well as Sam Darnold who I personally have graded as a prospect as higher than Wentz and Watson, in the palm of our hands. And a 4th overall pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 31 minutes ago, brownie man said: Nah man this is different if a team is trading up for a QB that takes all the other stuff outta the picture Buffalo is a great trade partner look at it this way Best offensive player in the league right now = Odell who was taken at pick 12 Best defensive player in the league right now = Aaron Donald taken at pick 11 Defensive Rookie of the year = Marshon Lattimore was taken at pick 11 trading down to 12 does not take us out of the elite talent area. Especially if it gets us 22 and a 2019 first or their 2nd and 65 and a 2019 first thats extremely valuable and continuing to add top players to this team. Gotta take advantage when teams want QBs I don’t know about you but the OBJ isn’t the best offensive player. Donald isn’t the best defensive player. Lattimore was only a #11 pick because he had injury history tied to him. Hell if that is the thought process. Best QB was a 6th rd pick, we should just trade out of the #1 spot. Draft position has no correlation to success. You also look at those picks you named off, those guys went to solid teams. Teams that weren’t in full rebuild like the Saints and Giants. Browns are in a rebuild, be it looks great on paper right now but we have no idea how it’s going to turn out. Im sorry I see Chubb being at the level of Bosa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztec Hammer Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 1 minute ago, buno67 said: I don’t know about you but the OBJ isn’t the best offensive player. Donald isn’t the best defensive player. Lattimore was only a #11 pick because he had injury history tied to him. Hell if that is the thought process. Best QB was a 6th rd pick, we should just trade out of the #1 spot. Draft position has no correlation to success. You also look at those picks you named off, those guys went to solid teams. Teams that weren’t in full rebuild like the Saints and Giants. Browns are in a rebuild, be it looks great on paper right now but we have no idea how it’s going to turn out. Im sorry I see Chubb being at the level of Bosa Question. If you were the Bills, would you trade 12, 22 and 15 for Chubb? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie man Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 24 minutes ago, buno67 said: I don’t know about you but the OBJ isn’t the best offensive player. Donald isn’t the best defensive player. Lattimore was only a #11 pick because he had injury history tied to him. Hell if that is the thought process. Best QB was a 6th rd pick, we should just trade out of the #1 spot. Draft position has no correlation to success. You also look at those picks you named off, those guys went to solid teams. Teams that weren’t in full rebuild like the Saints and Giants. Browns are in a rebuild, be it looks great on paper right now but we have no idea how it’s going to turn out. Im sorry I see Chubb being at the level of Bosa Lol ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted March 30, 2018 Share Posted March 30, 2018 Just now, brownie man said: Lol ? What? You said picking at 11 or 12 or whatever means the browns could get a good player. We have no idea who is going to be there at those picks. So picking at those spots mean nothing to me. To me my comment was made with the thought of I know who I want at 4 cause there is a great chance he is going to be there. We have no idea who is going to be there at other picks. Browns can easily predict who will be at 4 then anyone outside the top10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted March 31, 2018 Share Posted March 31, 2018 I really think we want Chubb. There’s too much smoke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted March 31, 2018 Share Posted March 31, 2018 8 minutes ago, candyman93 said: I really think we want Chubb. There’s too much smoke. That will be very shortsighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duke2056 Posted March 31, 2018 Share Posted March 31, 2018 I don't think there is much of a chance Buffalo gives us 12/22 and future 1st for pick 4.................but oh my god I would break my cheek bones pressing the phone up against my face as hard as I could yelling "ACCEPT ACCEPT ACCEPT" if they offered it. I don't care who is available at 4. Easiest trade decision ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted March 31, 2018 Share Posted March 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, duke2056 said: I don't think there is much of a chance Buffalo gives us 12/22 and future 1st for pick 4.................but oh my god I would break my cheek bones pressing the phone up against my face as hard as I could yelling "ACCEPT ACCEPT ACCEPT" if they offered it. I don't care who is available at 4. Easiest trade decision ever. Yup. But I would be just as pleased with 12 and a 3rd this year, a 2019 1st and a 2020 2nd, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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