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JonStark

Aaron Donald's holdout

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On 8/17/2017 at 4:35 PM, NVRamsFan said:

Donald isn't going to hold out the whole year he has absolutely nothing to benefit from that. He has very little leverage in this matter to begin with. His agent is somebody known to squeeze everything he can out of negotiations so this could go down to he last minute. Personally I don't agree with holdouts, you signed a contract so honor it. You don't like the way the cab restricts your options? Take it up with your weak union, they're the ones that put you up to this. 

You must be furious on roster cutdown day

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36 minutes ago, ninerfanwheelz said:

You must be furious on roster cutdown day

Not at all but congrats on an apples to oranges comparison. 

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9 minutes ago, NVRamsFan said:

Not at all but congrats on an apples to oranges comparison. 

It's an apples to apples comparison. If a team doesn't like the player's performance, they terminate the contract. If the player isn't happy with his pay, he can refuse to play. There are penalties written into the CBA and contract for both.

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51 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

It's an apples to apples comparison. If a team doesn't like the player's performance, they terminate the contract. If the player isn't happy with his pay, he can refuse to play. There are penalties written into the CBA and contract for both.

Sorry not going to compare the contract situation of a guy signed to compete on the 90 man roster to a guy picked in the 1st round. 

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Just now, NVRamsFan said:

Sorry not going to compare the contract situation of a guy signed to compete on the 90 man roster to a guy picked in the 1st round. 

Why not? You think it's any easier for those guys to get cut?

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2 hours ago, jrry32 said:

Why not? You think it's any easier for those guys to get cut?

So now you're bringing the emotions of a player invited to camp into what I said? Forget it this discussion is ridiculous. 

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3 hours ago, jrry32 said:

It's an apples to apples comparison. If a team doesn't like the player's performance, they terminate the contract. If the player isn't happy with his pay, he can refuse to play. There are penalties written into the CBA and contract for both.

Except a teams penaltiy is just an imaginary cap calculation, and paying the remainder of the guaranteed money owed (their only commitment to a player) 

While a player commits to playing for the team under the contract signed. And is penalized not only pay, but fines on top of it. Followed quickly by losing a year of accrual in the league, there fore extending said players contract yet another year. 

All situations are different. I understand that Donald wants and deserves more money than he is getting paid. But that is a standard that was set by his Players Association. They decided that money to the veterans is more important than the money to Rookies. Sorry about what you think you deserve, that's how the system is set up, and once again I'll come back to he has no leverage. 

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1 hour ago, NVRamsFan said:

So now you're bringing the emotions of a player invited to camp into what I said? Forget it this discussion is ridiculous. 

Yes, I am. I'm not really sure why you'd think it is different. First round pick or camp body, both have contracts. If the team terminates the contract, they are ending the deal before its set expiration point. There are penalties for doing that. It's an apples to apples comparison. A team's remedy for a player underperforming the deal is termination of the contract. The player's remedy for outperforming a deal is holding out until he gets a better one. They're simply two sides of the same coin.

25 minutes ago, StLunatic88 said:

Except a teams penaltiy is just an imaginary cap calculation, and paying the remainder of the guaranteed money owed (their only commitment to a player) 

That penalty is every bit as real to a team as a fine is to the player.

Quote

While a player commits to playing for the team under the contract signed. And is penalized not only pay, but fines on top of it. Followed quickly by losing a year of accrual in the league, there fore extending said players contract yet another year. 

Cap penalties are a means of fining the team for early termination of the deal. Again, they are two sides of the same coin.

Quote

All situations are different. I understand that Donald wants and deserves more money than he is getting paid. But that is a standard that was set by his Players Association. They decided that money to the veterans is more important than the money to Rookies. Sorry about what you think you deserve, that's how the system is set up, and once again I'll come back to he has no leverage. 

Both sides agreed on a system. The system forces rookies to accept predetermined contracts. The system allows players to renegotiate their rookie deals starting after Year 3. Donald is going into Year 4. He is working within the system. If you have a problem with the system, take it up with the CBA.

You can come back to him having no leverage, but it still is wrong. If Donald had no leverage, he'd be practicing and preparing to play Week 1. Donald's value to the Rams gives him leverage. It's why the Rams are negotiating with him and taking this seriously. Cody Davis has no leverage. Aaron Donald has a crapload of leverage. Now, that doesn't guarantee a deal will get done. Both sides still have to fine that middle ground. Thus far, they haven't.

Edited by jrry32

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Just thinking the last time a player held out and didn't play when the regular season started was Cam Chancellor of the Seahawks. He missed Week 1 vs the Rams. It showed because TE Lance Kendricks scored the td to send the game into OT and the defender that fell I believe was the guy that was replacing Cam. The Rams won in OT by stopping Lynch on 4th down. The guy who made that stop was...Aaron Donald.

So fast forward a few seasons later and Aaron Donald is likely to miss Week 1 against the Colts. Luckily the Rams won't need him to beat Tolzien especially with them not even having their Center 1st round pick Kelly too. I expect the Rams defense to still play well enough to win. The Rams will NEED Donald Week 2 though against the Redskins. So let's hope things get done soon so he will be playing September 17th.

 

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Yeah this isn't good. I didn't see it dragging on this long. At what point does trading him become an option? (if at all). He made his point, but it's now time to show up to work. We've probably made our best offer possible this season, if it's not good enough then he will have to get paid next season.

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Question is, do we even have any room in the cap to change his contract for this year?  If so, how much?  Is this an impossible situation?  As in, is he asking for more then we even have cap room for this season?  

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1 hour ago, NVRamsFan said:

I'm over it. Go Tanziel Smart!!

Its what I have been saying from the beginning, he is asking for more than the leverage he holds. His agents have been known to do this.

It has nothing to do with what he deserves (he is not on the open market) it is about what he has the leverage to get. And as a rebuilding team, that is still 3 or 4 pieces away from being a legitimate threat, so missing him for some games this year isnt going to really hurt the franchise.

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Too lazy to find it again but Vinny's tweet today makes it sound like they're offering a very similar deal to Von Millers just with more total money.

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