Survivor III: Winners Versus Losers

[Utley]

Go **** yourself, Ted.

[TedLavie]

5 hours ago, Malfatron said:

@TedLavie @bcb1213

1. explain why you deserve to win the game

2. what was your biggest move in the game?

3. explain why your opponent should win the game. convince me.

 

questioning phase should happen for a couple days

1. As you very well know, I led or co led around half of the eliminations behind the scenes. I did a lot of work throughout the game to get to this point. Simply put, if I didn't play that game, I think the outcome would have been vastly different all-around. Plus I won the comps when it mattered (f4 and f3).

2. It's a small one, but it's a good introduction to Naz question. I think my biggest move was voting Shady and saving Utley in tribal 8 or something. Now I won't say it's was a rational or a good decision. It was pretty erratic. But I decided to save Utley because, while Shady was with bcb the person I trusted the most, the relationship I built was Utley was much less expected by others which could have worked in my favour. And it did in the end as Utley as the one who tipped me off that I was about to get voted out instead of Orca, which allowed to lobby myself to Touch, who was the last remaining voter, and then for the re-vote where I knew Utley would change his vote. It wasn't a Big Baller move or anything, but this vote for me changed the outcome of my game. If I had voted Utley, there would have been a tie and if Utley made it out, no way he would have warned me the way he did.

3. I think bcb was much more consistent than me. He had a simple game plan, bring me and Rags to the f3 and he succeeded. The all BDL f3 was not part of gameplan until very late. In fact, I planned to take Rags out instead of Utley (but he won the comp, credit to him) and I contemplated voting him out instead of Touch and you. Bcb got what he wanted because 1. he played well in comps and rarely was in danger in early council 2. he played a very consistent game with his allies. Not to mention that when I was going crazy about decisions in this game, bcb was there to calm me down and show me the way, which definitely helped.

5 hours ago, Nazgul said:

@bcb1213 and @TedLavie

Firstly, good job getting to the Final 2 as inferior players this season. The victory will almost certainly go un-remembered. 

To open up the questioning phrase that we will now be holding - I ask this:

At what point in this game did you feel most vulnerable? As in - you believed your torch would be snuffed? 
And what did you personally do to go from that position of weakness into one of power (escaping the vote / better positioning yourself)?

I think overall I lost control of the game between the Shady elimination and Orca's. I wasn't at the top of my game then. It culminated when Orca and I tied for votes. Actually this tie helped me to re-group and assess where I was. I knew I had the backing of Rags and bcb. I knew Touch or Malf also backed me up, while the other changed his vote later, so I could kinda trust them not too much. I knew Utley helped me, but I wasn't sure he were to be trusted. And I knew ET wasn't to be trusted. So then I went back to the drawing board, got ET out cause he had a relationship with Touch, Rags and Malf (though this wouldn't have happened if Malf wasn't willing to do it), grabbed an idol in the process, and from then I was almost certain to make it to f3.

5 hours ago, Nazgul said:

Also, I wish to know how you personally impacted this game. 

What did you do that the other didn't that should win you this game?
 

I also like a villain. Do you believe you were ever deceitful. And if so, when? And do you believe a bit of dishonesty should be forgiven?

I think out of the last 12 players, I didn't build a relationship with only 2 people, you and Orca. My social game gave me better reach to assess the relationships during the game and to take out people when I wanted to, even when I wasn't in the tribal councils (when Malf and I worked to get Fin out for example). Quite simply put, I don't think bcb would have got there without me. I'm not sure I would have without him but I had a better chance.

I lied plenty of time, to just about everyone aside from bcb and shady. But mainly because I didn't want to reveal that I was working with that person or that person. For example, Malf and I talked about taking Fin out when he got out, I had solid relationships with people like Mookie at that time, but I wasn't going to tell Malf I had already discussed this to Mookie to keep our relationship on the low. But overall, I didn't go crazy on the lies because in the end it usually backfires. And yes dishonesty is 100% part of a game like this so of course it should be forgiven

[TedLavie]

5 hours ago, The Orca said:

@TedLavie did you believe attempting to lie to me 2 times would give you an advantage when it came to the final vote?

@bcb1213 how many times did you vote me out this game?

I didn't. I genuinely thought ET would have been a better choice for me, but as soon as Utley told me there was a bw forming against me, I knew it was going to be me or you. And I sincerely didn't know who voted for / against me at the time. I had an idea of course but I learned two or three days ago that it was indeed Touch who saved me.

My plan coming to the f8 was (assuming gopher wouldn't show up which he didn't):

ET

you

Rags

Utley

Touch

Malf or bcb

3 hours ago, theuntouchable said:

I totally have to admit something but I’ll also tie in my question to both of them. 

I hadn’t sent in a single diary session because I was waiting until I could make the move that was my goal for this season. 

I was planning on playing with malf like I have before. I would still have my opinion on things and I knew I could trust him. 

Until the final three. And then I was going to crush him and take @Ragnarok to the final 2 and may the best man win. 

Ultimately, it was my hope that @SwAg could have made it to that spot. 

Which brings me to my question. 

@TedLavie how close were you to making your vote bcb? Or changing it in OT?

How worried were you when I told you that I still had my reward and that I was voting you?

@bcb1213

you and I spoke once I believe in this entire game. Then you message me telling me that I’m ultimately below the list of two other people still in the game and that I should vote off someone I knew I could trust at that point. Did you honestly expect me to willingly backstab someone at that point that would mean pretty much my guaranteed end before the final .......

did you honestly expect me to do that? 

That's why I didn't want Swag back. This is an instance where I lied for example @Nazgul. I told some people I would vote Swag back but there was no way I would do so since I didn't want to be stuck with a Rags-Touch-Swag-bcb quartet. And I tried to use that swag comeback bw to try to get back Shady (attempt which miserably failed of course).

Touch, there was no way I voted bcb out at that council. But I genuinely contemplated voting Rags.

At that point I thought Rags-Malf-you-me f4 was the worst scenario for me. I would have been exposed in the f4 and unlikely to be picked in the f3. You-malf-bcb-me gave me more upside for the 2 remaining councils, but the thing that precluded me from doing it is that I had a hard time telling hat was your relationship with Malf. I did think about it, which made bcb crazy, and I decided to vote against you once Malf told me his vote was in, as I knew that if I was taking out Rags then, Malf was needed.

I wasn't worried at all, I had an idol and I had already placed it on me a few hours before. I actually hoped you would use your item on me haha.

[TedLavie]

3 hours ago, Malfatron said:

i kinda figured that.

thats part of the reason et80 had to go. i was part of that. 

rag was supposed to go out in the f6, but he won

and i was going to take Ted to the F2 

in my opinion, Ted was the best player in the game this year

 

Thanks

2 hours ago, bcb1213 said:

You may not like the play with honor system and that's fine but it was then again here I am and there you are so maybe there's some merit to it 

By the time you finally went against me, why would I make it seem like I'd work with you again.  We were in last five and bdl had the numbers 

I've already openly admitted ted talked to more people this gm lol 

I also had to talk ted off the ledge multiple times from making dumb decisions that would have cost us pretty dearly.  I think he'll admit to that. 

I also turned him down when he offered to give me his Immunity idol cause that's who I am 

I confirm, you did talk me out of voting vs Rags in f5 and in f4

[TedLavie]

2 hours ago, Ragnarok said:

It was the only way to ensure you got booted next.

1.  I haven't voted yet, nor have I decided on my vote.
2.  We have played many games together, I think you know I am not the bitter type.
3.  I certainly wasn't aware of that agreement.  

That's a misunderstanding on my end. I clearly thought this was established, as you will read in my confessionals later. And looking back at our PMs, it's true we didn't mention it. Sorry about that

2 hours ago, Ragnarok said:

Fair.  But no, I am not voting based on that alone.  

Ted at least could have pretended to go back and forth to lube me up a bit.

You know me, it's not my style.

That being said, and again sorry for the misunderstanding, but I would have gone with anyone who finished second. It was agreed for bcb and I, and I thought you were in that too.

 

[Nazgul]

I personally believe that the play of the game was me making the jury despite you imbeciles eliminating me from the game before the jury portion. I went from a nobody into having power instantly, and I do plan on letting it go to my head with the voting.

Now with that knowledge, do you agree that this feat by me was remarkable. If not, what do you think (besides something you did) was the best play of the game?

Secondly, why not work with me over the other finalist? I have a history of being a very trusty ally (ask @Outpost31). Was your biggest mistake voting me out? If yes, I forgive you. If no, rot in hell.

[TedLavie]

7 hours ago, Malfatron said:

@TedLavie @bcb1213

1. explain why you deserve to win the game

2. what was your biggest move in the game?

3. explain why your opponent should win the game. convince me.

 

Also to dig a bit deeper in here.

The big moves I made that shaped the game overall were getting Pickle (bcb co-led with me) and Fin (co-led with Malf) early and ET (with Malf again) later in the game. I think it set us up nicely

[TedLavie]

1 hour ago, Nazgul said:

I personally believe that the play of the game was me making the jury despite you imbeciles eliminating me from the game before the jury portion. I went from a nobody into having power instantly, and I do plan on letting it go to my head with the voting.

Now with that knowledge, do you agree that this feat by me was remarkable. If not, what do you think (besides something you did) was the best play of the game?

Secondly, why not work with me over the other finalist? I have a history of being a very trusty ally (ask @Outpost31). Was your biggest mistake voting me out? If yes, I forgive you. If no, rot in hell.

I think the best play of the game besides something I did was getting Swag out. Swag would have been a fierce competitor and he had ties with a lot of people. Voting him out early was a very smart play by Orca and Malf (I think).

Technically I didn't vote you out and your eviction was one of the few councils which I wasn't a big part of. Had you stay in I think we could have work together. You were Malf trustee as bcb was mine, so maybe we could have done something together. But the way the game shaped out, I think it would have likely end at f6.

[Nazgul]

Neither of you are talking about me enough. Very disappointed. 

[Nazgul]

On 1/23/2019 at 1:10 PM, TedLavie said:

Speaking of flames, I will watch the person that voted me out burn with great joy. @Nazgul

I also want to bring attention back to this @TedLavie. 
I'm cool with a public lynching - they can prove to be quite successful if done properly.

However, this one seemed odd and erratic to me. I'm merely curious on the intel you received that made you believe this was me.

[Nazgul]

4 hours ago, TedLavie said:

I lied plenty of time, to just about everyone aside from bcb and shady. But mainly because I didn't want to reveal that I was working with that person or that person. For example, Malf and I talked about taking Fin out when he got out, I had solid relationships with people like Mookie at that time, but I wasn't going to tell Malf I had already discussed this to Mookie to keep our relationship on the low. But overall, I didn't go crazy on the lies because in the end it usually backfires. And yes dishonesty is 100% part of a game like this so of course it should be forgiven

I know some jury members who are going to hate you...
For the record - lying is the best. We should all do it more often.
It's why I've been playing Mafia more and more. Getting some lying practice in.

[theuntouchable]

4 hours ago, TedLavie said:

I didn't. I genuinely thought ET would have been a better choice for me, but as soon as Utley told me there was a bw forming against me, I knew it was going to be me or you. And I sincerely didn't know who voted for / against me at the time. I had an idea of course but I learned two or three days ago that it was indeed Touch who saved me.

My plan coming to the f8 was (assuming gopher wouldn't show up which he didn't):

ET

you

Rags

Utley

Touch

Malf or bcb

That's why I didn't want Swag back. This is an instance where I lied for example @Nazgul. I told some people I would vote Swag back but there was no way I would do so since I didn't want to be stuck with a Rags-Touch-Swag-bcb quartet. And I tried to use that swag comeback bw to try to get back Shady (attempt which miserably failed of course).

Touch, there was no way I voted bcb out at that council. But I genuinely contemplated voting Rags.

At that point I thought Rags-Malf-you-me f4 was the worst scenario for me. I would have been exposed in the f4 and unlikely to be picked in the f3. You-malf-bcb-me gave me more upside for the 2 remaining councils, but the thing that precluded me from doing it is that I had a hard time telling hat was your relationship with Malf. I did think about it, which made bcb crazy, and I decided to vote against you once Malf told me his vote was in, as I knew that if I was taking out Rags then, Malf was needed.

I wasn't worried at all, I had an idol and I had already placed it on me a few hours before. I actually hoped you would use your item on me haha.

I wouldn’t have voted rags. I would have voted malf out however. 

Malf also waited quite a while to actually submit his vote. He had told me rags was probably my best bet to get you to vote with. 

And yes it was my vote that saved you. 

[bcb1213]

7 hours ago, Ragnarok said:

@bcb1213, were you lying to me when you said that you would be legitimately mad at me for a very long time if I 'turned on you now' and didn't vote for touch?

I would have indeed been mad.  I spent a lot of the fame longing you when we were up for it comp and the not 

If people want to kno my biggest move if the non move doesn't meet your fancy.  It's probably convincing rags that by getting rid of me, ted would become more a wild card and by keeping me we'd basically get final three 

[bcb1213]

7 hours ago, Malfatron said:

Until it runs into a Nick Foles

Bad analogy.  Nick foles doesn't play defense 

[bcb1213]

8 hours ago, Malfatron said:

@bcb1213 explain in detail the grave mistakes Ted was going to make in the game, and how you stopped him from making them.

We need to hear more of what you did behind the scenes, because many of us have had miminal contact with you.

 

I unfortunately deleted the pms from pre jury portion but since the jury section, he wanted to lead a vote on non active gopher instead of letting gopher time out 

On the vote that he was almost gone in, he wanted gopher then et then Orca. Had he gone with what he wanted originally instead of going with my Orca push, he wouldn't be here right now 

He wanted to vote rags out at the five instead of touch for reasons I'll never understand which would have lost us our majority and likely led to you and touch vs me and Ted instead of 3 v1

For a short time he wanted to vote for Rags instead of you in the four and we all know you can do these post a hand every so often comp better than anyone