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It's hard decision but I believe the Chargers need to move on from Phillip Rivers this off-season

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16 hours ago, Classic said:

There can't be any more doubt left. He is playing like Peyton Manning circa 2015.

The problem is that we're not bad enough to get a guy like Burrows in the draft. Best strategy might be to shore up OL in the draft, maybe draft a potential successor in the 2nd or 3rd, and try to roll with Rivers again next year. Or try to trade the farm for Burrow and pray we get the right OL in FA. Or roll with Tyrod for a year as we rebuild and hope we get Lawrence in 2021. If you're going with the third option, maybe we should just clean house and get a new GM.

Edited by Xenos
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On 12/16/2019 at 2:16 PM, Xenos said:

The problem is that we're not bad enough to get a guy like Burrows in the draft. Best strategy might be to shore up OL in the draft, maybe draft a potential successor in the 2nd or 3rd, and try to roll with Rivers again next year. Or try to trade the farm for Burrow and pray we get the right OL in FA. Or roll with Tyrod for a year as we rebuild and hope we get Lawrence in 2021. If you're going with the third option, maybe we should just clean house and get a new GM.

I agree.

I think they will target Jalen Hurts just because Lynn really seems to want a QB who can run the ball. Depending on how the combine and workouts go I could see us going WR/CB first then going Hurts in the 2nd. Telesco is usually pretty easy to figure out with the first round pick always going to the position needed most... besides OL which has always been needed and the reason we are in the situation we are in. If this is the case I could see us rolling with Tyrod to implement a new offense while Hurts learns for a season. No way they bring Rivers back if the goal is an offense more in line with the Ravens.

I personally don't want that to happen but it just seems the most likely to me at the moment. 

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2 hours ago, Zappaz said:

I agree.

I think they will target Jalen Hurts just because Lynn really seems to want a QB who can run the ball. Depending on how the combine and workouts go I could see us going WR/CB first then going Hurts in the 2nd. Telesco is usually pretty easy to figure out with the first round pick always going to the position needed most... besides OL which has always been needed and the reason we are in the situation we are in. If this is the case I could see us rolling with Tyrod to implement a new offense while Hurts learns for a season. No way they bring Rivers back if the goal is an offense more in line with the Ravens.

I personally don't want that to happen but it just seems the most likely to me at the moment. 

I think OT is definitely a need after this year. In terms of what the Ravens are doing, not sure that is easy to replicate.

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8 hours ago, Xenos said:

I think OT is definitely a need after this year. In terms of what the Ravens are doing, not sure that is easy to replicate.

I think OT has been a need for a while now but it just never seems like TT is as concerned as most people are about the line.
I also agree that what the Ravens are doing isn't easy to replicate, it takes a special talent to pull it off, but I get the feeling that it is what Lynn wants to try. We'll see what happens but this offseason will best interesting to say the least.

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On 12/18/2019 at 2:51 AM, Zappaz said:

I think OT has been a need for a while now but it just never seems like TT is as concerned as most people are about the line.
I also agree that what the Ravens are doing isn't easy to replicate, it takes a special talent to pull it off, but I get the feeling that it is what Lynn wants to try. We'll see what happens but this offseason will best interesting to say the least.

They were concerned, but what rustles TT's jimmies to get him to trade up is really the question.  They were, by the accounts of the folks I still talk to that have some insider connections, all set to take Dillard in the 1st until up jumped Philly again (shades of Lane Johnson all over again).  And yet, for RB of all positions, when Gurley went off the board in the '14 draft TT got an itchy trigger finger and jumped to trade up to go get Gordon.  About the only thing I can confidently say, because we've never seen him do it, about TT in the 1st is that he doesn't trade back (granted, I've yet to hear of a situation where the team was offered a future 1st as part of a package, so that could be something that might move the needle).

At this point, I'll say something I never thought I'd say about Philip Rivers: He's shown that he's definitely capable of playing poorly enough to get the team in striking distance of the Top 3 picks (which is where you need to be to assure yourself a shot at the franchise caliber QB prospects, unless you unearth a diamond in the rough).  He's also shown that, barring name-value alone (and even then I could see a bluff being called because he's made it pretty clear he has no intention of uprooting his family, I could see his bluff being called), he's not producing at the level of high-end starting QB pay.  Come back on a very team-friendly deal and maybe there's justification for a 2-year extension.

The smart decision-making says, if Tua falls you take him (it sucks if the health stuff derails his career and that burns a Top 10 pick, but he at least has the ceiling/floor combination to justify giving it a shot - and if his health does burn the team, it likely hits them so badly they end up with another Top 5-10 pick in short fashion).  Herbert doesn't have the intangibles that TT and the front office staff seem to covet - so that may really depend on if Lynn falls for him and thinks he can coach around it.  But Herbert's not an alpha personality and going from Rivers to him would be a drastic culture shock for the rest of the offensive personnel.

If they're learning anything from the Baltimore model (someone is going to make an effort to copycat them, I'm not sold it'll be Lynn), it's to build the OL first so that you're in the best position to be able to take a chance on a different-from-the-norm QB prospect and crafting the offensive scheme around him.

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It’s mind boggling how poor our offensive line has been over the past decade.  You would think the onus would be on that unit above all else considering Rivers is completely immobile and relies on that protection probably moreso than any QB in the league.  Not sure how many times it’s been said that football is won in the trenches, and we got exposed against the Patriots again on both sides of the line. Then promptly run the same unit (only worse due to injuries) out there this year and expect different results.  

As far as the draft goes, I could get on board with Tua as long as our staff is comfortable with the medicals. The talent is worth the risk in my opinion.  I don’t see it with Herbert, that kid just doesn’t have it in my opinion.  I actually think Love has a lot of promise, but he’s young (20) and the recent marijuana arrest probably takes him off our board.  Outside of QB, you could make a case for a lot of guys with our first picks - Wills, Simmons, Okudah, Thomas, Wirfs, Ruggs...there’s a lot of guys that make sense to me

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12 hours ago, The LBC said:

They were concerned, but what rustles TT's jimmies to get him to trade up is really the question.  They were, by the accounts of the folks I still talk to that have some insider connections, all set to take Dillard in the 1st until up jumped Philly again (shades of Lane Johnson all over again).  And yet, for RB of all positions, when Gurley went off the board in the '14 draft TT got an itchy trigger finger and jumped to trade up to go get Gordon.  About the only thing I can confidently say, because we've never seen him do it, about TT in the 1st is that he doesn't trade back (granted, I've yet to hear of a situation where the team was offered a future 1st as part of a package, so that could be something that might move the needle).

At this point, I'll say something I never thought I'd say about Philip Rivers: He's shown that he's definitely capable of playing poorly enough to get the team in striking distance of the Top 3 picks (which is where you need to be to assure yourself a shot at the franchise caliber QB prospects, unless you unearth a diamond in the rough).  He's also shown that, barring name-value alone (and even then I could see a bluff being called because he's made it pretty clear he has no intention of uprooting his family, I could see his bluff being called), he's not producing at the level of high-end starting QB pay.  Come back on a very team-friendly deal and maybe there's justification for a 2-year extension.

The smart decision-making says, if Tua falls you take him (it sucks if the health stuff derails his career and that burns a Top 10 pick, but he at least has the ceiling/floor combination to justify giving it a shot - and if his health does burn the team, it likely hits them so badly they end up with another Top 5-10 pick in short fashion).  Herbert doesn't have the intangibles that TT and the front office staff seem to covet - so that may really depend on if Lynn falls for him and thinks he can coach around it.  But Herbert's not an alpha personality and going from Rivers to him would be a drastic culture shock for the rest of the offensive personnel.

If they're learning anything from the Baltimore model (someone is going to make an effort to copycat them, I'm not sold it'll be Lynn), it's to build the OL first so that you're in the best position to be able to take a chance on a different-from-the-norm QB prospect and crafting the offensive scheme around him.

Just wanted to comment on the bolded part. Last time that TT ever traded up. Personally, I was glad that nonsense stopped after the 2015 season. I would have liked to see TT actually trade down more though.

In terms of QBs, no one actually stands out to me in the first round outside of Burrows. BPA at position of need is left tackle in the first round. They definitely need a franchise LT after what happened to Okung (who may or may not be back after this season).

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10 hours ago, BoltsFan937 said:

It’s mind boggling how poor our offensive line has been over the past decade.  You would think the onus would be on that unit above all else considering Rivers is completely immobile and relies on that protection probably moreso than any QB in the league.  Not sure how many times it’s been said that football is won in the trenches, and we got exposed against the Patriots again on both sides of the line. Then promptly run the same unit (only worse due to injuries) out there this year and expect different results.  

As far as the draft goes, I could get on board with Tua as long as our staff is comfortable with the medicals. The talent is worth the risk in my opinion.  I don’t see it with Herbert, that kid just doesn’t have it in my opinion.  I actually think Love has a lot of promise, but he’s young (20) and the recent marijuana arrest probably takes him off our board.  Outside of QB, you could make a case for a lot of guys with our first picks - Wills, Simmons, Okudah, Thomas, Wirfs, Ruggs...there’s a lot of guys that make sense to me

A lot of it has been bad luck and injuries though. And it's not like TT has not tried to invest heavily in getting OL (whether through the draft or FA). It's just for whatever reason, things have not worked out for this team and Rivers. But needless to say, the years that the OL were at least healthy and average, Rivers has shined ie. 2013, 2017, and most of 2018.

Edited by Xenos
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Hey we’re climbng up the draft board! Currently picking 7 and I can’t see dropping after getting our doors blown off next week at Arrowhead. 

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15 hours ago, BoltsFan937 said:

Hey we’re climbng up the draft board! Currently picking 7 and I can’t see dropping after getting our doors blown off next week at Arrowhead. 

No, but you guys need help to rise further.  The Jags look like the only team that could potentially fall below you based off the Week 17 matchups, though some surprises could happen.

Thomas and Wirfs are within striking distance.  There are, however, at least 3 teams picking ahead of the Chargers that could be threats to go OT and another 2 or so picking later in the Top 10 who would be threats to trade up for one (2 more if you stretch that to the Top 12, because I very much consider Denver and the Browns to be in the OT market).

 

 

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I’d roll with Rivers again next year and maybe even 2021 as I honestly believe he gives us the best shot at winning in either of those two seasons. He’s gone though. His post game interview was not the same QB that has always tied the company line. Rivers admitted to the press that Spanos sucks and they have no fans. There’s no repairing that. Spanos will can him now because he is no longer selling the company propaganda daggumit. 
 

https://twitter.com/latimesfarmer/status/1208920773114511360?s=21

 

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22 hours ago, Boltstrikes said:

I’d roll with Rivers again next year and maybe even 2021 as I honestly believe he gives us the best shot at winning in either of those two seasons. He’s gone though. His post game interview was not the same QB that has always tied the company line. Rivers admitted to the press that Spanos sucks and they have no fans. There’s no repairing that. Spanos will can him now because he is no longer selling the company propaganda daggumit. 
 

https://twitter.com/latimesfarmer/status/1208920773114511360?s=21

 

As a Chiefs fan, I come in peace!

Good for Rivers for speaking out. It needs to be said and hopefully some positive change can come from it.

If I were your GM, I would try to trade Rivers for a mid round pick (escalating for Championship/Superbowl appearance) to a potential contender (Colts, Bears, Titans, etc). I'm playing Tyrod Taylor or a mid-late round 2020 QB. In the draft. Then, I'm taking OL in the first and maybe second, then focusing on gaining more picks for 2021 to try and get Lawrence. I'd try trading injury prone guys such as Allen, Pouncey, and Okung. Guys such as Bosa and Ward I would consider to be untouchable. However, if a Khalil Mack type trade is offered, I take it and run. As good as Bosa is, you haven't been winning with him. If you're smart and don't have glaring/reaching needs, trade those firsts for even more picks.

The Chargers don't need a full on rebuild but there needs to be a year or two of resetting and building for the future and not just today.

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23 hours ago, Boltstrikes said:

I’d roll with Rivers again next year and maybe even 2021 as I honestly believe he gives us the best shot at winning in either of those two seasons. He’s gone though. His post game interview was not the same QB that has always tied the company line. Rivers admitted to the press that Spanos sucks and they have no fans. There’s no repairing that. Spanos will can him now because he is no longer selling the company propaganda daggumit. 
 

https://twitter.com/latimesfarmer/status/1208920773114511360?s=21

 

Just means that he'll be tagged now.

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