big poppa pump Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 21 hours ago, Kiwibrown said: Dorsey replaced Ogbah and Nassib, two youngish browns players with Vernon and Chad Thomas. Vernon and Chad played 26 games and had 7.5 sacks and 15 QB hits between them, note that all of Chads hits were sacks. Ogbah had 5.5 sacks and 11 hits in 10 games Carl had 6 sacks and 11 hits in 14 games. If we kept ogbah and carl we get more, sacks, hits, less games played, and Zeitler, hell could of still had Chad too. f dorsey. Let's not act like this isn't the most talented roster we have seen since our return. Most of that credit needs to go to the man you are complaining about. Let's see what the new regime does with adding talent to this team. Or will they strip it away, by trading talented players like OBJ, and Landry for future picks, and try to sell us on a rebuild? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Just now, big poppa pump said: Let's not act like this isn't the most talented roster we have seen since our return. Most of that credit needs to go to the man you are complaining about. As well it should be though, it was set up for that. Dorsey inherited a TON and spent a TON. Just now, big poppa pump said: Let's see what the new regime does with adding talent to this team. Definitely remains to be seen. Just now, big poppa pump said: Or will they strip it away, by trading talented players like OBJ, and Landry for future picks, and try to sell us on a rebuild? Are you under the impression that every nerd run FO is just looking to rebuild? When they took over we had no money and no talent, so they ranked to clear the books, add young talent, and stockpile a ton of cash and assets. This situation ain’t that one. Obviously just a guess, but I think we do see the cap cleaned up a bit. Guys like Hubbard, Kirksey, and Carrie are likely gone, they simply don’t play up to their salary. Guys like Vernon, Randall, Robinson, and Burnett are 50/50 imo. Robinson and Randall based on cost, Vernon and Burnett based on whether they can find a suitable replacement for less. Dorsey spent like a drunk sailor, but none of it was awful or had long term ramifications. He blew through some reserves, but this was supposed to be “our window” so he made a push. No harm there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 The only capital that can’t be redeemed is Austin Corbett. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, candyman93 said: The only capital that can’t be redeemed is Austin Corbett. More or less. He did what John Dorsey has always done and pay vets some questionable salaries, but he fields a competitive team. There’s a reason he’s been fired from 2 jobs in 3 years though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big poppa pump Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: As well it should be though, it was set up for that. Dorsey inherited a TON and spent a TON. Definitely remains to be seen. Are you under the impression that every nerd run FO is just looking to rebuild? When they took over we had no money and no talent, so they ranked to clear the books, add young talent, and stockpile a ton of cash and assets. This situation ain’t that one. Obviously just a guess, but I think we do see the cap cleaned up a bit. Guys like Hubbard, Kirksey, and Carrie are likely gone, they simply don’t play up to their salary. Guys like Vernon, Randall, Robinson, and Burnett are 50/50 imo. Robinson and Randall based on cost, Vernon and Burnett based on whether they can find a suitable replacement for less. Dorsey spent like a drunk sailor, but none of it was awful or had long term ramifications. He blew through some reserves, but this was supposed to be “our window” so he made a push. No harm there. The answer to the above question is no, I don't necessarily believe that every nerd (or non nerd) regime will AUTOMATICALLY go to a rebuild mode. What I do know is that MOST regimes want to have their "type" of player on their team, and while OBJ, and Landry would seemingly be a fit for any coach/gm, I have my doubts about how THEY will respond to the new coach. By all accounts Stefanski is well liked, and considered a leader by those that played for him. I think the same can be said for Freddie, Hue, or insert any other named coach that has failed here. Everything remains to be seen, but it would not surprise me in the least to see talented players traded for draft capital. To your point about Dorsey wasting the picks and money that was afforded him by Sashi...... I will say he had some misses for sure...like every gm but I still feel better about what he did with those picks/trades/free agency than the previous regimes Don't need to get into the *** for tat about the savior sashi who passed on almost every QB that is, or was in the playoffs this year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: The answer to the above question is no, I don't necessarily believe that every nerd (or non nerd) regime will AUTOMATICALLY go to a rebuild mode. What I do know is that MOST regimes want to have their "type" of player on their team, and while OBJ, and Landry would seemingly be a fit for any coach/gm, I have my doubts about how THEY will respond to the new coach. By all accounts Stefanski is well liked, and considered a leader by those that played for him. I think the same can be said for Freddie, Hue, or insert any other named coach that has failed here. Everything remains to be seen, but it would not surprise me in the least to see talented players traded for draft capital. I think the issue is winning. If we win, players fall in line and everything is fine. Losing breeds fruition and eventually contempt. Bad/dumb decision only add fuel to those fires. 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: To your point about Dorsey wasting the picks and money that was afforded him by Sashi..... Not wasted, spent. He came in ready to win something and made some moves to put a competitive team on the field. No issues there. The only thing I would have done remarkably different is I would have traded down from 4 (instead of taking Ward) for a future 1. Oh, and not drafted Corbett. That’s without benefit of hindsight. 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: I will say he had some misses for sure...like every gm For sure, nobody is perfect. 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: but I still feel better about what he did with those picks/trades/free agency than the previous regimes I like Dorsey running draft. Short of OL, I think he’s as good at spotting talent as anyone (although I don’t really subscribe to the concept). His best role imo is as a head of personnel, but not a GM. He simply is too power hungry, 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: Don't need to get into the *** for tat about the savior sashi who passed on almost every QB that is, or was in the playoffs this year Agreed. We’ll never know who was the driver behind passing on all those guys, Sashi, Berry or Hue. I still give them a pass for Wentz as we sucked and he’d have been ruined here imo. Rumor was we loved Mahomes, but Reid sniped us. Kudos to him. Why we passed on Watson is the question really imo. Not mad to have Baker though. I think with an OL in front of him he can be as good as any of them (maybe not Mahomes). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 @big poppa pump contrary to what you may think, I didnt hate Dorsey (until the stories started leaking anyway). His drafts were fine imo, he identified a QB (still bullish on Baker) and gave us more wins than any GM in a long time. None of the money spent had long reaching consequences. I don’t blame him for Freddie either as I thought he was in a now win situation. You COULDN’T not hire Freddie after what he had that offense doing in ‘18 with a rookie QB. He gambled and lost. I’m cool with that. Where he crapped the bed is ignoring analytics, mostly because he didn’t want to share the spotlight it seems, seemingly allowed for a little to chaotic of a locker room, and still backing Freddie after the season. If the rumors about telling the coaches who to play, manipulating the roster to get “his guys” reps, trashing the DePodesta binder, etc are true, those are fireable offenses on their own imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big poppa pump Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: @big poppa pump contrary to what you may think, I didnt hate Dorsey (until the stories started leaking anyway). His drafts were fine imo, he identified a QB (still bullish on Baker) and gave us more wins than any GM in a long time. None of the money spent had long reaching consequences. I don’t blame him for Freddie either as I thought he was in a now win situation. You COULDN’T not hire Freddie after what he had that offense doing in ‘18 with a rookie QB. He gambled and lost. I’m cool with that. Where he crapped the bed is ignoring analytics, mostly because he didn’t want to share the spotlight it seems, seemingly allowed for a little to chaotic of a locker room, and still backing Freddie after the season. If the rumors about telling the coaches who to play, manipulating the roster to get “his guys” reps, trashing the DePodesta binder, etc are true, those are fireable offenses on their own imo. I didn't think that you hated Dorsey, and I don't feel like I necessarily need to defend him. When people talk about how he missed here and there, I get it. I also know that people are quick to say good riddance, when they don't know what the future regime will do. Dorsey, imo, hit on alot of what he did. I am bullish too on Baker, and really don't feel any worry about him going forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, big poppa pump said: I didn't think that you hated Dorsey, and I don't feel like I necessarily need to defend him. When people talk about how he missed here and there, I get it. Fair enough. 3 minutes ago, big poppa pump said: I also know that people are quick to say good riddance, when they don't know what the future regime will do. I’m happy to say good riddance, but mostly because I don’t care for his “Dorsey centric” approach. 3 minutes ago, big poppa pump said: Dorsey, imo, hit on alot of what he did. I am bullish too on Baker, and really don't feel any worry about him going forward. Me either. I think he regressed for a few reasons that are correctable and will take a big step forward next hear. Maybe he isn’t the next Brady, Mahomes or A-A-Ron, but he’s a guy who you can win with imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big poppa pump Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 (edited) 32 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Fair enough. I’m happy to say good riddance, but mostly because I don’t care for his “Dorsey centric” approach. Me either. I think he regressed for a few reasons that are correctable and will take a big step forward next hear. Maybe he isn’t the next Brady, Mahomes or A-A-Ron, but he’s a guy who you can win with imo. In the above bolded....all I can say is be careful what you wish for. If Berry gets the gig, and his picks or FA's don't pan out???? In a make or break year, where we appear to be close???? I don't think they will get....(nor should they) too much slack. Edited January 13, 2020 by big poppa pump meaning the pitchforks will be out quick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: In the above bolded....all I can say is be careful what you wish for. If Berry gets the gig, and his picks or FA's don't pan out???? In a make or break year, where we appear to be close???? I don't think they will get....(nor should they) too much slack. Somebody has to get some slack, no? At what point is hiring and firing every 2 years going to be identified as a potential problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big poppa pump Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 (edited) 21 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Somebody has to get some slack, no? At what point is hiring and firing every 2 years going to be identified as a potential problem? I'm not advocating firing ANY of these guys if expectations aren't met. I am just concerned about how this off-season looks, in terms of talent acquisition, and how that translates to the field. Edited January 13, 2020 by big poppa pump and those pitchforks will be warranted if we have another losing season Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 1 minute ago, big poppa pump said: I'm not advocating firing ANY of these guys if expectations aren't met. I am just concerned about how this off-season looks, in terms of talent acquisition, and how that translates to the field. Ah ok. I’d expect a lot of turnover. Partially because of it being a new FO (we all know the drill there) and because a number of vets aren’t worth paying and this is the out year in their deal. I think if we can simply solidify the OL and get our offense to where it could be described as “well coached”, we’ll be just fine. The defense is gonna have some holes, can’t fix everything, but we should have a potent, potent offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buno67 Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 Great thing is all those contracts Dorsey gave out can be cut with minimal dead cap hit this year and the money can be recoup to a decent amount. I wonder if they move Landry and OBJ, yeah their talented but the analytics have to show paying that much money to two WRs and having that kind of investment into that position group when you will be a run heavy team doesn’t make sense. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Roshi Posted January 13, 2020 Share Posted January 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, buno67 said: Great thing is all those contracts Dorsey gave out can be cut with minimal dead cap hit this year and the money can be recoup to a decent amount. I wonder if they move Landry and OBJ, yeah their talented but the analytics have to show paying that much money to two WRs and having that kind of investment into that position group when you will be a run heavy team doesn’t make sense. What would we get in return though? I can't see us getting better by trading them at this point. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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