Time to Fire LaFleur, Gute, and Murphy And Burn The House Down

[pgwingman]

57 minutes ago, LLcheesehead12 said:

Wrong on all counts

1.  For every Rashaan Gary, Jaire Alexander and Christian Watson he drafts, he gives you 2 busts.  AWFUL!!!

 

2.  Sorta reckless?  His financial management is worse than every single goddamn politician in Washington.  Ridiculous!!!

 

3.  Only point I might find agreement with, or at least starting this next Sunday and closing out the season maybe.  I still think Love forces too many throws and is too inconsistent with his play, but yes I do want to see if he can continue improving and becoming a refined QB.  And at this point with the playoffs gone from us and Rodgers's injuries having taken their toll, Rodgers needs to be shutdown and Love given the reins for the remainder of the season so we can make a more informed decision on him.

 

4.  Sorry, but I'm done dealing with 1 off players like Rasul Douglas who have one year wonders and then just fall off.  Pretty much Eric Walden types that we don't need.

 

Anyway, Gute has wasted the last years of Aaron Rodgers, and his incompetence in building an offense will be a millstone dragging down Jordan Love in his prime if his butt isn't kicked outta here immediately!!!  Gute is responsible for this awful season and he must be fired for it.

Depending on what we decide to do with Love after this season, LaFleur should also be facing the likelihood of being fired.  If we opt to trade Rodgers and start Love next year, well LaFleur probably should stay, even if I don't like him because Love having to learn a new playbook and philosophy already at this point could set him back a bit.  But if Love gets traded or something, and we draft Caleb Williams or another guy, then fire LaFleur too.

1. My assertion still stands. I think the players he's drafted have shown talent, but this year the talent hasn't been schemed or coached well. Who have been his "busts" in his drafts? I'd say Josh Jackson, Oren Burks, Jace Sternberger, Josiah Deguara, Amari Rodgers. I don't think you can count busts in rounds 4-7, every team bats 10% from those selections

2. The financial moves he made were intentionally reckless. You might disagree, but the Packers wanted to go "All in" for Rodgers last remaining years as a Packer. Moving off of Rodgers will be painful, but there's certainly logic to it.

3. You agreed, so I'm not sure how I'm wrong on "all" counts

4. Rasul is not a "one off" player, he's arguably the best value in the secondary. He's paid $3M a year and has a pff score of 68. Jaire has been slightly better in most categories, but is paid 6x as much. Savage and Stokes have both struggled this year despite being 1st round picks. Amos looks toasted and makes $7M a year. Like it or not, GMs have to find lots of guys like Rasul: depth pieces that play for decent wages.

And I think you should temper your rage towards Lafluer a bit. Firing coaches who have one bad season after 3 good ones is what terrible organizations do. 

Edited November 28, 2022 by pgwingman

[incognito_man]

48 minutes ago, LLcheesehead12 said:

Wrong on all counts

1.  For every Rashaan Gary, Jaire Alexander and Christian Watson he drafts, he gives you 2 busts.  AWFUL!!!

 

2.  Sorta reckless?  His financial management is worse than every single goddamn politician in Washington.  Ridiculous!!!

 

3.  Only point I might find agreement with, or at least starting this next Sunday and closing out the season maybe.  I still think Love forces too many throws and is too inconsistent with his play, but yes I do want to see if he can continue improving and becoming a refined QB.  And at this point with the playoffs gone from us and Rodgers's injuries having taken their toll, Rodgers needs to be shutdown and Love given the reins for the remainder of the season so we can make a more informed decision on him.

 

4.  Sorry, but I'm done dealing with 1 off players like Rasul Douglas who have one year wonders and then just fall off.  Pretty much Eric Walden types that we don't need.

 

Anyway, Gute has wasted the last years of Aaron Rodgers, and his incompetence in building an offense will be a millstone dragging down Jordan Love in his prime if his butt isn't kicked outta here immediately!!!  Gute is responsible for this awful season and he must be fired for it.

Depending on what we decide to do with Love after this season, LaFleur should also be facing the likelihood of being fired.  If we opt to trade Rodgers and start Love next year, well LaFleur probably should stay, even if I don't like him because Love having to learn a new playbook and philosophy already at this point could set him back a bit.  But if Love gets traded or something, and we draft Caleb Williams or another guy, then fire LaFleur too.

[vegas492]

A lot of folks are pretty fed up with Gute.  Or MLF.  Or Rodgers.  Or all of them.

Let's just face it.  It's a bad year.  This didn't happen overnight.  It probably started when complacency set into the team.  Maybe it was training camp.  Maybe it was last year.  Maybe it was guys thinking that we win 10 games just by having Rodgers under center, so that next workout in the off-season isn't really that important.

But...there is the upside to this.  Humility. 

I now watch the games to see who is still fighting hard out there.  And I'm loving seeing the development out of some of our guys.

This is the roller coaster going down.  But, there will be a few ups in there as well.  Yah just gotta find them.

Watson.  Nixon.  Ford.  (God I love putting those two next to each other in a sentence.)  Engbare.  Yosh. 

[Norm]

1 hour ago, incognito_man said:

You're way late here lol

Edit: I just read that whole post lol. Oh my ****

 

Edited November 28, 2022 by Norm

[chefj85]

5 hours ago, vegas492 said:

A lot of folks are pretty fed up with Gute.  Or MLF.  Or Rodgers.  Or all of them.

Let's just face it.  It's a bad year.  This didn't happen overnight.  It probably started when complacency set into the team.  Maybe it was training camp.  Maybe it was last year.  Maybe it was guys thinking that we win 10 games just by having Rodgers under center, so that next workout in the off-season isn't really that important.

But...there is the upside to this.  Humility. 

I now watch the games to see who is still fighting hard out there.  And I'm loving seeing the development out of some of our guys.

This is the roller coaster going down.  But, there will be a few ups in there as well.  Yah just gotta find them.

Watson.  Nixon.  Ford.  (God I love putting those two next to each other in a sentence.)  Engbare.  Yosh. 

The team is an absolute disaster right now for sure, but there’s no quit in this team. I’ll give them that.

im just not sure how you try to put it back together next year.

[squire12]

25 minutes ago, chefj85 said:

The team is an absolute disaster right now for sure, but there’s no quit in this team. I’ll give them that.

im just not sure how you try to put it back together next year.

Offense should be decent enough with improved OL play and Rodgers being more comfortable with the WR group.

Decision on Jenkins and Tonyan need to be made  with limited cap space at the present.

Defense should be better with a replacement of the DC and players buying more into the scheme and philosophy.  Need to upgrade Safety and add some things to the DL

High draft picks should help fill some holes.

[Striker]

24 minutes ago, chefj85 said:

The team is an absolute disaster right now for sure, but there’s no quit in this team. I’ll give them that.

im just not sure how you try to put it back together next year.

-Get healthy, stay healthy
-Hit on a few draft picks 
-Don't suffer massive regression in performance from most of your starters
-Coach better

 

[Sandy]

19 hours ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

You don't think his contract makes him untradeable ?

You can trade him as long as you don't exercise the option first.

The hard part is clearing the cap space to fit his contract without the option, but pushing out the roughly $36m you need from Jones, Smith, Jaire and Clark seems somehow more cap-responsible than keeping Rodgers for another "all-in" year.

[chefj85]

11 hours ago, Striker said:

-Get healthy, stay healthy
-Hit on a few draft picks 
-Don't suffer massive regression in performance from most of your starters
-Coach better

 

Yeah there's all that, but also some major questions concerning $$. 

[chefj85]

11 hours ago, squire12 said:

Offense should be decent enough with improved OL play and Rodgers being more comfortable with the WR group.

Decision on Jenkins and Tonyan need to be made  with limited cap space at the present.

Defense should be better with a replacement of the DC and players buying more into the scheme and philosophy.  Need to upgrade Safety and add some things to the DL

High draft picks should help fill some holes.

I wonder about the Online. Was supposedly one of the strengths of the team going into the year. Honestly, with all the changes in the rotation with injuries and whatnot, I can't even keep up with who our starting 5 is and what combination has produced the best results. 

We assume that we're going to fire the DC. I hope that's true, but it won't surprise me if we don't. And yeah, it's easy to say that we'll be better with a new DC... but who are we going to hire? Given the names involved this last time I don't recall any of them being particularly impressive. Hope we've got a better crop to choose from next time. 

High draft picks are great, but they don't generally start paying dividends until at least year 2. Look at Gary. Sometimes it takes a while to really make the jump. 

[PACKRULE]

16 hours ago, vegas492 said:

A lot of folks are pretty fed up with Gute.  Or MLF.  Or Rodgers.  Or all of them.

Let's just face it.  It's a bad year.  This didn't happen overnight.  It probably started when complacency set into the team.  Maybe it was training camp.  Maybe it was last year.  Maybe it was guys thinking that we win 10 games just by having Rodgers under center, so that next workout in the off-season isn't really that important.

But...there is the upside to this.  Humility. 

I now watch the games to see who is still fighting hard out there.  And I'm loving seeing the development out of some of our guys.

This is the roller coaster going down.  But, there will be a few ups in there as well.  Yah just gotta find them.

Watson.  Nixon.  Ford.  (God I love putting those two next to each other in a sentence.)  Engbare.  Yosh. 

good post Vegas,

The sad reality is though that most of those that are upset or want these guys fired were all good and fully in support until this year. They have no idea and most don't as to how things work. We should win the SB every year hands down. They want to make wholesale changes based on a possible down year, an AR broken thumb. Bad Oline play. Bad WR's where we could not get good FA's due to cash. I mean they wanted to go all in and Gute did and now they piss and moan at the first sign of water in the boat. Can't make everyone happy. And the league is meant to have this happen. You succeed well here is your bottome end pick every round. We have had a rash of injuries and 2 Aplus Oline coming off knee issues. All the while the moaning crew act like these things were avoidable and should have been caught and dealt with up front. 

With that said MLF has been fine whether it be with AR or Love his record before this year shows all i need to see. Losing some coaches has hurt and with a down year we should be able to rebuild that staff a bit in consideration to others likely getting fired aroudn the league this year:) 

Our DC needs to walk or be demoted it's too big for him he's a position coach doing the best he can but he's got no parts to be the man. Look at him on the sideline he stands well behind others. He's to passive as a person. Great guy and needs to be lead not be a leader.

A couple higher end picks sprinkled in from a draft some revamping and we are there with AR next year. If it's Love we will be middle of the pack likely as he'll take some time. 

Whiners and complainers are the first to get tossed off the boat or should be, reading this year on here is entertaining to say the least. 

[vegas492]

18 minutes ago, PACKRULE said:

good post Vegas,

The sad reality is though that most of those that are upset or want these guys fired were all good and fully in support until this year. They have no idea and most don't as to how things work. We should win the SB every year hands down. They want to make wholesale changes based on a possible down year, an AR broken thumb. Bad Oline play. Bad WR's where we could not get good FA's due to cash. I mean they wanted to go all in and Gute did and now they piss and moan at the first sign of water in the boat. Can't make everyone happy. And the league is meant to have this happen. You succeed well here is your bottome end pick every round. We have had a rash of injuries and 2 Aplus Oline coming off knee issues. All the while the moaning crew act like these things were avoidable and should have been caught and dealt with up front. 

With that said MLF has been fine whether it be with AR or Love his record before this year shows all i need to see. Losing some coaches has hurt and with a down year we should be able to rebuild that staff a bit in consideration to others likely getting fired aroudn the league this year:) 

Our DC needs to walk or be demoted it's too big for him he's a position coach doing the best he can but he's got no parts to be the man. Look at him on the sideline he stands well behind others. He's to passive as a person. Great guy and needs to be lead not be a leader.

A couple higher end picks sprinkled in from a draft some revamping and we are there with AR next year. If it's Love we will be middle of the pack likely as he'll take some time. 

Whiners and complainers are the first to get tossed off the boat or should be, reading this year on here is entertaining to say the least. 

I'll add to your post.

I hear the comment regarding Gute as "he wasted the last few years of Rodgers".

Without any mention of the restructuring of contracts that brought the core team back for like 3 years.

Then there is this....did Tomlin ruin Big Ben?  Big Ben who won a couple of SB's early....then never another one?

Philip Rivers was wasted, too.

Colts ruined Luck.

Shula ruined all of Marino's career.

Payton ruined a lot of Brees' career.

Reid ruined McNabb.

I mean, the list writes itself.  Just getting to the big game is tough enough.  Winning it is even tougher.

Just because Brady has won a ton of big games doesn't mean it is just that easy.  Certainly helps when you take less than a market value contract.  

[MacReady]

If it takes being rid of LaFleur to be rid of Barry, ******* do it.

[Brat&Beer]

1 minute ago, Outpost31 said:

If it takes being rid of LaFleur to be rid of Barry, ******* do it.

I don't think that will be necessary. I suspect he realizes he could lose the team if he brings Barry back next year. 

[MacReady]

3 minutes ago, Brat&Beer said:

I don't think that will be necessary. I suspect he realizes he could lose the team if he brings Barry back next year. 

That goes completely against what he just said, which I posted a link to in the Barry thread.