LionArkie Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 7 hours ago, HashtagFTW said: He still scares me without seeing his bench. With those short arms, I want to see at least 28 reps. Short arms generally help the bench. I too have questions about his strength, but I wouldn't be convinced based on his bench production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 (edited) 20 minutes ago, LionArkie said: Short arms generally help the bench. I too have questions about his strength, but I wouldn't be convinced based on his bench production. Disregard it appears this is somewhat of a fallacy. Here is one resource I found interesting: https://birdbreakdown.com/2014/02/27/are-long-arms-bad-for-bench-pressing-not-so-fast/comment-page-1/ I still think there are better measurements of strength. Examples would be explosion out of the hole with a 500lb squat. Or Max single deadlift. I think muscle endurance isn't a good indicator for power. Edited March 30, 2023 by LionArkie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted March 30, 2023 Author Share Posted March 30, 2023 55 minutes ago, LionArkie said: Disregard it appears this is somewhat of a fallacy. Here is one resource I found interesting: https://birdbreakdown.com/2014/02/27/are-long-arms-bad-for-bench-pressing-not-so-fast/comment-page-1/ I still think there are better measurements of strength. Examples would be explosion out of the hole with a 500lb squat. Or Max single deadlift. I think muscle endurance isn't a good indicator for power. They are using their hands a lot in a punching/pushing motion - stiff arms, blocking, bull rush, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Karnage84 said: They are using their hands a lot in a punching/pushing motion - stiff arms, blocking, bull rush, etc. That has nothing to do with bench unless you are measuring the power output which would be the speed it comes off the chest. This is the measurement that almost all power lifters use to measure their progress on strength of the bench. The pushing motion you are mentioning is a force measurement, the punch if you will. F=M*A. Multiple bench reps doesn't equate on this. And the formula to equate multiple reps to a single gets skewed substantially with multiple reps over 8. Bull rush would also be a leg drive. So once again, A larger squat or deadlift would be a better indicator than bench press. Bench Reps at 225 is as useful as the 40 for most indicators. Dave Tate wrote an extensive article on this very thing quite a while back, but I cannot find that article or I would link it. **found one of his respsonses, but it still is not the article:https://www.elitefts.com/education/how-to-increase-your-225lb-bench-for-reps-test-rach-edit/ **found one from Joe Defranco instead. Just as good of a source as Tate: https://www.defrancostraining.com/the-pro-maker-an-interview-with-joe-defranco/ Edited March 30, 2023 by LionArkie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LionArkie Posted March 30, 2023 Share Posted March 30, 2023 2 hours ago, LionArkie said: That has nothing to do with bench unless you are measuring the power output which would be the speed it comes off the chest. This is the measurement that almost all power lifters use to measure their progress on strength of the bench. The pushing motion you are mentioning is a force measurement, the punch if you will. F=M*A. Multiple bench reps doesn't equate on this. And the formula to equate multiple reps to a single gets skewed substantially with multiple reps over 8. Bull rush would also be a leg drive. So once again, A larger squat or deadlift would be a better indicator than bench press. Bench Reps at 225 is as useful as the 40 for most indicators. Dave Tate wrote an extensive article on this very thing quite a while back, but I cannot find that article or I would link it. **found one of his respsonses, but it still is not the article:https://www.elitefts.com/education/how-to-increase-your-225lb-bench-for-reps-test-rach-edit/ **found one from Joe Defranco instead. Just as good of a source as Tate: https://www.defrancostraining.com/the-pro-maker-an-interview-with-joe-defranco/ Found the article:https://www.elitefts.com/education/novice/efs-classic-the-eight-keys-a-complete-guide-to-maximal-strength-development/ Go down to the Eight Keys Part II and it is roughly the first three paragraphs. Dave Tate has also been a consultant on multiple Division I Strength programs and trained at West Side Barbell. The dude is absolutely legit as well as Joe Defranco who I listed above. They train college athletes to prepare for the combine and both think the tests are stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Tso Posted April 4, 2023 Share Posted April 4, 2023 https://motorcityfootball.substack.com/p/testing-tendencies-evaluating-holmes I'm subbed to a Lions blog. This was an interesting article, similar to what we've been discussing. Brad drafts elite athletes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 4, 2023 Author Share Posted April 4, 2023 1 hour ago, General Tso said: https://motorcityfootball.substack.com/p/testing-tendencies-evaluating-holmes I'm subbed to a Lions blog. This was an interesting article, similar to what we've been discussing. Brad drafts elite athletes. is it free? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
General Tso Posted April 4, 2023 Share Posted April 4, 2023 (edited) 1 minute ago, Karnage84 said: is it free? There is both free and paid content. I'd say 70% of the content is free? You can click around on the page anyways to see what's free. Also, I say I'm subbed, but I'm just doing the free part. Edited April 4, 2023 by General Tso Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted April 4, 2023 Share Posted April 4, 2023 1 hour ago, General Tso said: https://motorcityfootball.substack.com/p/testing-tendencies-evaluating-holmes I'm subbed to a Lions blog. This was an interesting article, similar to what we've been discussing. Brad drafts elite athletes. Solid article. Definitely along the lines of what we have been discussing and funny enough it mentions branch as a guy who fits his data points but using the RAS x PFF he is way out of it. I think @Karnage84 needs to sign with the Athletic or something and charge for his content. Its better than you get at a lot of sites. Or team up with this guy for content. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 4, 2023 Author Share Posted April 4, 2023 4 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: Solid article. Definitely along the lines of what we have been discussing and funny enough it mentions branch as a guy who fits his data points but using the RAS x PFF he is way out of it. I think @Karnage84 needs to sign with the Athletic or something and charge for his content. Its better than you get at a lot of sites. Or team up with this guy for content. That's too kind my man. I mainly just steal other peoples data (mainly PFF) and then try to interpret it in a way to better understand the Lions. I get a lot of other sites will use PFF in their articles too but I don't know how much journalisming you're really doing. If you guys wanted to... pay me for stuff.... I'll set up a Venmo lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 4, 2023 Author Share Posted April 4, 2023 Also on that note, @Sllim Pickensif I ever go that route you're going to be made Editor-in-chief. I get a lot of information and gap filling from your posts on here. So I do appreciate your insights on things. I honestly appreciate everyone who does take out the time to write a post on here. I enjoy getting all of the different perspectives and having an avenue to sort of explore different thoughts (such as whether AR at 6 can be hedged by his athleticism and whether that's something that could work in his favour or not). Even if we have differing opinions, I like getting all perspectives. So thanks gents. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 4, 2023 Author Share Posted April 4, 2023 https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zvydrKYPj9hIuMllT-TRB9FxQBlnNdAzTRkIQVEmtfI/edit?usp=sharing I went down a little rabbit hole with Anthony Richardson Tied for 3rd in 'Hit As Thrown' (HAT) = 6 (Top is Bryce Young with 11) Throwaways = 25 (Tied for 2nd) I had heard somewhere something about Florida WR's having some of the most drops but they only had 14 (Most was 29) and on 4.2% of his attempts (worst was 8.1%). Quote Equipped with a bevy of possession receivers who could produce adequately in short to intermediate levels of the field, the Gators still lacked the ability to take the top off of defenses at any point. Florida found mild success from Shorter in the middle of the year, sending the fifth-year senior of deep posts — usually at the beginning of games — to catch defenses lacking. He hauled in multiple deep balls on the year in these scenarios, but the unit still lacked a true deep threat to make these plays consistently without the necessity to catch an opposing secondary off guard. To make matters worse, the room grew depleted when the war of attrition began in the closing stretch of the season. ... That forced an already thin unit to rotate in second-and third-string reserves over the final four-to-five games. https://www.si.com/college/florida/football/florida-gators-wide-receiver-review-preview-ricky-pearsall-keary-colbert So it seems like his WR's were an issue in terms of overall talent. I also gather there was some issues with the OL T-4th in overall pressures with only a 3.9% sack rate (13). I know some of the draft pundits, especially ex-QB's have discussed his footwork as an issue, but I do wonder how much help he got from his supporting cast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldfishwars Posted April 5, 2023 Share Posted April 5, 2023 Lions on the clock at 18 - would be great to have your votes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted April 5, 2023 Author Share Posted April 5, 2023 50 minutes ago, goldfishwars said: Lions on the clock at 18 - would be great to have your votes Do you have any rules on voting while intoxicated? I'm seeing a lot of Will Levis votes and I feel this needs to be reported to the proper authorities. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldfishwars Posted April 5, 2023 Share Posted April 5, 2023 35 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: Do you have any rules on voting while intoxicated? I'm seeing a lot of Will Levis votes and I feel this needs to be reported to the proper authorities. A Dan Campbell and Will Levis led team is a beautiful thing to consider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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