2023 Off-season Talk

[KingOfNewYork]

I think we’re screwed no matter what we do personally. It’s all gonna come down to the coordinator and health for that matter.

[GangGreen420]

Interesting top 3 in regards to the Jets there. Then you have Josh Allen on the list. 

[KingOfNewYork]

3 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

Interesting top 3 in regards to the Jets there. Then you have Josh Allen on the list. 

I always wondered how they measured these things. Is there a “strike zone” of sorts a QB is supposed to hit. 

[KingOfNewYork]

I’m going to watch every Zach throw this past season over the weekend. Then I’m going to watch every Carr throw, every Jackson throw and every Jimmy G throw. Until then let’s hope we hire a good OC for the sake of everyone else on the team. 

[KimuraGod]

Why are most experts who have us trading for Carr talking about this years second round pick plus a mid rounder in 2024? 
 

That seems expensive no? 

[KimuraGod]

7 hours ago, rickyt31 said:

I'm definitely interested in AR if we only come away with Jimmy G. I can't trust him health wise. 

I'm really 50/50 on this current staff. This season's progress could be fool's good because of the 5 backup QBs we beat, Watson less Packers, and a Bills that was missing a whole secondary + Milano. On the other side of that, we were injured as well on offense and didn't get blown out like we were getting in 2021. 

With everything that was said between Woody, Saleh, and JD, we know they will go big for a QB. So I'm not worried there anymore. My concerns are finding the right OC and Ulbrich being legit. JD won't need a lot to fix the other gaps in our roster. The $112m+ in cap space next season will give him a lot of flexibility. 

In regards to JD and Saleh going all out for a qb this year. I assume most of us on here see a ‘playoff or bust’ type of year???

With that being said if we did go down the Carr road….and we did get in the playoffs what would the mandate be for the following year? 

If we sign a guy like Derek Carr he gives us the chance to contend for a playoff spot no question. And a healthy Derek Carr playing 18 games this year would have been the difference this year between making/missing out on the playoffs.
 

But in 2024 after a year in the playoffs could Derek Carr lead us to a SB?! I have huge reservations. I could argue we would still be battling for a playoffs spot and if we did miss out in 2024 would that lead to the sacking of JD and Saleh?! 
 

I hate band aid options for this reason alone….it raises more questions than answers and puts us in no man’s land. I would hope we be brave and make a decision that can lead to a SB than a move that will get us the extra win or two needed to get in the playoffs and flame out. 
 

 

[Bobby816]

9 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said:

Where else would he go?

I mean he says he doesn’t want to be part of a rebuild. We aren’t that in essence. But he might want to go to a team closer than what we are perhaps. Or that at least have a more recent history of a winning culture. Some teams off the top of my head are PIT, MIA, TEN, DEN, etc.

 

I assume they won’t send him to an NFC team.

[Bobby816]

Here is what it sounds like to me when I hear someone say they think Wilson can/will take this huge leap with a new OC and should even have a chance at being our starter for 2023…….

 

Mims improved but is far from a good WR. So when I hear someone say Wilson just needs a new OC for him to be good. That sounds the same to me as someone saying all Mims needs is a new OC and he can be a #1 WR.

 

Point is neither are true. Mims won’t ever be a #1 WR in any system and Wilson based on what he’s shown won’t ever be a good QB in the U.S. league no matter who’s OC. His issues weren’t play calling. It was literally fundamentals that high school QBs have down before going to college.

[KimuraGod]

17 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Here is what it sounds like to me when I hear someone say they think Wilson can/will take this huge leap with a new OC and should even have a chance at being our starter for 2023…….

 

Mims improved but is far from a good WR. So when I hear someone say Wilson just needs a new OC for him to be good. That sounds the same to me as someone saying all Mims needs is a new OC and he can be a #1 WR.

 

Point is neither are true. Mims won’t ever be a #1 WR in any system and Wilson based on what he’s shown won’t ever be a good QB in the U.S. league no matter who’s OC. His issues weren’t play calling. It was literally fundamentals that high school QBs have down before going to college.

The blame for Wilson not being the franchise qb heading into year 3 we’d hoped for is not singlehandly on him but a massive percentage. He should have been doing the things necessary to be ‘the guy’.
 

He’s not done that. I don’t think anyone genuinely believes we will go into the year with Zach as #1 qb and building the offense around him. He’s done zero to deserve that. 
 

Whoever the new OC will be has a young talented guy who they can work with whilst we have a guy as a #1 qb who’s ready now.
 

Zachs not ready but maybe in 12 months he will be?! All depends on him. 

[NJC33]

21 hours ago, xrade said:

Agreed but QB is the prime “team” need. Carr would be a step in that direction while still adding to the rest of the team. You can sub Carr with Jimmy G, Tannehill or Danny Dimes if you like but it needs to happen. None of those QB will be the three you mentioned but we also beat Buffalo once this seaso and could have beaten them twice if we had a QB. 

Difference being, ~20m (approx.) and no long-term commitment. Signing someone like Tannehill, Jimmy G or Baker AND two additional starters for what Carr would cost, while staying proactive for a long-term solution.

But yea, some stop-gap option is obviously needed. 

[Heymangold]

5 hours ago, KimuraGod said:

Why are most experts who have us trading for Carr talking about this years second round pick plus a mid rounder in 2024? 
 

That seems expensive no? 

i'd imagine there aren't many teams looking to trade for Carr.  the jets would probably be bidding against themselves. 

[Bobby816]

11 minutes ago, KimuraGod said:

The blame for Wilson not being the franchise qb heading into year 3 we’d hoped for is not singlehandly on him but a massive percentage. He should have been doing the things necessary to be ‘the guy’.
 

He’s not done that. I don’t think anyone genuinely believes we will go into the year with Zach as #1 qb and building the offense around him. He’s done zero to deserve that. 
 

Whoever the new OC will be has a young talented guy who they can work with whilst we have a guy as a #1 qb who’s ready now.
 

Zachs not ready but maybe in 12 months he will be?! All depends on him. 

I'm just not getting the whole sign an ok vet and let that guy and Wilson battle it out. We just were a borderline playoff team with absolute garbage QB play last year. The team "should" only get better with guys coming back off injury, FA and the draft.

With how bad Wilson has looked, he'd literally have to do a 180 for him to win the starting job. I just cant see it happening. Listen to the words the FO says. It really doesn't matter what "we" want. Woody, Saleh, JD all talking about making QB the main thing for us this off season. Signing a Minshew, Tannehill type isn't that move. They know that and deep down the guys not wanting Carr and such know that too.

What does signing a Minshew, Tannehill type do for us? Probably actually puts us in the playoffs. But not a real threat. Because while they were good enough to get us in. They're not good enough to win us playoff games. All hypothetical. But for me you bring in a better talent than the tier those guys are in. And now you can hang with the big boys. Bc you have an elite D. Should with a bolstered OL and Hall back have a great run game. And all that with actual good QB play (we get a legit QB in here GW is a #1 WR). There's no weakness there. We can hang with BUF, CIN, KC and such. We know our defense can keep us in games. We just can never score to capitalize. A good QB changes that.

We sign an ok vet they beat out Wilson and they have us out in the 1st round and we're then drafting in no mans land. We have trash still with Wilson and a below average vet as our starter. Can a franchise QB be drafted not at the top of the draft? Of course. But doing this route really helps us in no way at QB. And stands little chance of working.

 

My idea is this. Go sign or trade for a good vet. Not an average one. Carr comes to mind for me. Bc we know he's available and likely wont cost us a ton of draft capital. He gets a guaranteed 3 year deal. He's 31. So that's still him playing in his prime. Obviously now with him, there's no QB competition. He's #1 and Wilson is #2. Wilson sits and learns without pressure. If Carr gets injured (unlikely, guy has only missed 3 starts his whole career). Wilson is next man up. So what I see in turn happening is us as a playoff team and able to compete with the big teams to see how far we can go. Fast forward to the 2024 off season and I cut ties with Wilson. Get whatever we can in a trade for him (probably very little). And now draft a QB in the 2nd-4th round in 2024. Carr still has 2 years left on his deal and is 100% the starter. This allows that young QB to develop and sit and learn for a couple years. Carr is about as durable as it gets as a starter. So the risk of having to play that young guy earlier than you want is small. So now you can do like other teams and develop a guy while still winning and competing for a SB. And if Carr balls out in those 3 years and there's 0 reason to move on from him. That's a great problem to have.

 

[Bobby816]

24 minutes ago, NJC33 said:

Difference being, ~20m (approx.) and no long-term commitment. Signing someone like Tannehill, Jimmy G or Baker AND two additional starters for what Carr would cost, while staying proactive for a long-term solution.

But yea, some stop-gap option is obviously needed. 

We all know cap is fake and if the owner has money they can move money around generally. I'm not worried about anything financially. While I'm not on the boat of let's get Jackson in here. It's not bc of money. It's more his playing style and giving up 2 1st for him that I don't like. So giving Carr money shouldn't be a reason guys don't want him. Money can be moved around. Same was as we can sign Q long term and actually save money this year.

[jetsfan4life51]

Too long to quote but almost my exact thoughts @Bobby816 and I’m going to keep emphasizing that we need a leader at QB. I want to create a great culture and locker room.

I prefer to get rid of Zach now so he’s not lingering around but with the thought of going 2024 QB, seeing if Zach makes progress before drafting that guy is a good idea too. 

Saleh’s rah rah and t-shirts don’t work if we lose the locker room. 

[KingOfNewYork]

1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Here is what it sounds like to me when I hear someone say they think Wilson can/will take this huge leap with a new OC and should even have a chance at being our starter for 2023…….

 

Mims improved but is far from a good WR. So when I hear someone say Wilson just needs a new OC for him to be good. That sounds the same to me as someone saying all Mims needs is a new OC and he can be a #1 WR.

 

Point is neither are true. Mims won’t ever be a #1 WR in any system and Wilson based on what he’s shown won’t ever be a good QB in the U.S. league no matter who’s OC. His issues weren’t play calling. It was literally fundamentals that high school QBs have down before going to college.

So just so I’m clear, it’s all on Wilson and on no one else?