RSkinGM Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 Peter Kings parting "thoughts". Man would I like to be the Bears G M . !! We trade our #2 a second this year and our first next year for #1. ( reasonable? - probably ) The Bears then trade #2 to Atlanta for their #8 , a second this year and 1 and 2 in 2025 ,, what a haul ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, RSkinGM said: Peter Kings parting "thoughts". Man would I like to be the Bears G M . !! We trade our #2 a second this year and our first next year for #1. ( reasonable? - probably ) The Bears then trade #2 to Atlanta for their #8 , a second this year and 1 and 2 in 2025 ,, what a haul ! And after all that they still won't have a QB and will be perpetually winning 7-9 games a season. But all them draft picks though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSkinGM Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 On the Junkies, Merrril Hoge says Drake Maye is NOT a first round Q B . Extremely inconsistent, processing is inconsistent. Not real athletic, stiff, long throwing motion. Surely Peters won't draft this guy . 🙏 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 13 minutes ago, RSkinGM said: On the Junkies, Merrril Hoge says Drake Maye is NOT a first round Q B . Extremely inconsistent, processing is inconsistent. Not real athletic, stiff, long throwing motion. Surely Peters won't draft this guy . 🙏 No clue who Merril Hoge is, but I have been saying all the QBs are overhyped so I can agree to an extent. I just think we already have a guy with the same skillset in Howell. If they go QB, for me, it should be either Caleb or Daniels, but my preference is a trade down. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 8 minutes ago, RSkinGM said: On the Junkies, Merrril Hoge says Drake Maye is NOT a first round Q B . Extremely inconsistent, processing is inconsistent. Not real athletic, stiff, long throwing motion. Surely Peters won't draft this guy . 🙏 One of my favorite Merril Hoge QB takes dates back to 2020, when he stated forcefully that there was only one 1st round QB talent in the draft (Burrow) and it “wasn’t even close” for anyone else — to include consensus 1st rounders Tua Tagovailoa and Justin Herbert. Here were his takes on these guys: 2. Jacob Eason, Washington: “I watched him and (Justin) Herbert back and forth, back and forth. Herbert, everything is deliberate, elongated, slower. And then you go over to Eason. He is really quick. If Eason has errant throws, they’re where they need to be errant. Herbert, they’re right in harm’s way. Five-yard out route, if you’re going to miss, miss outside. Herbert will miss inside. Eason will miss outside. Eason is much better. The only thing about Eason is there’s that one throw every game where you’re wondering: ‘What was that?’ That’s where it would help to be able to be able to go through it with him and ask him what he was looking at.” 4. Tua Tagovailoa, Alabama: “You can find a Tua in any draft. He’s a great kid; however, that is not a skill set. His accuracy when flushed from the pocket is very poor and his accuracy with intermediate to long balls is also not very good. And this is critical in the evaluation: He had the best wide-receiver group in the country. … People say Tua is accurate. Where do you get accurate? Completion percentage? That says nothing about accuracy. Is he pretty accurate with RPOs? He is. That’s a slant pass. Forget about those. In the NFL, nobody RPOs you to death the way Alabama does. At Alabama they throw a slant and it goes for 80 (yards). That might happen once in your career in the NFL. It happens every game at Alabama. … In the national championship game, Clemson used a similar blitz twice. One was a pick six, the other a pick. He had no clue what he was looking at. I think he got better, but still shows signs of not understanding blitzes. … Tua is also not a very good decision-maker. He does not know when to get rid of the ball at times. Hence his injuries.” 5. Justin Herbert, Oregon: “His inaccuracy, man, you look at some of his throws and you’re like, ‘What the …?’ Herbert is just slow and deliberate with everything he does. And that gets you in trouble in college. Then in the NFL you have a big issue, a huge issue. Can it be cleaned up a little bit? Yes, but ultimately that’s his twitch. And to switch a twitch is almost like an instinct. You can’t make a guy instinctive. You can’t say, ‘Hey, we’re going to work on your instincts today.’ … If a guy’s not accurate, you’re not going to change that. I don’t care what anybody tells you.” 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 The secret to Merril Hoge’s success as a “QB analyst” is to just loudly say that every prospect who isn’t a hyper-elite total package type is going to suck. Sure, you’ll be wrong about lots — but you’ll also be right about lots, and you can parlay that into people still asking you about QBs decades after your career as an NFL FB is over. Mostly because they remember you telling Skip Bayless that Johnny Manziel was going to be bad in the NFL. And they forget you saying that Justin Herbert, who has more passing yards in his first 4 seasons than any QB in NFL history, was painfully slow and inaccurate and lacked the requisite natural instincts to play the game. Incidentally, so far this draft season, in addition to his effort to bury Drake Maye, he’s also determined that Caleb Williams is “not special.” Which was fairly predictable, if you’re familiar with him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 7 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said: No clue who Merril Hoge is, but I have been saying all the QBs are overhyped so I can agree to an extent. I just think we already have a guy with the same skillset in Howell. If they go QB, for me, it should be either Caleb or Daniels, but my preference is a trade down. I really don't think their skillsets are similar and if they hadn't gone to the same college literally no one would make the comparison in my opinion. Like, they couldn't be more different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSkinGM Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 (edited) 24 minutes ago, e16bball said: One of my favorite Merril Hoge QB takes dates back to 2020, when he stated forcefully that there was only one 1st round QB talent in the draft (Burrow) and it “wasn’t even close” for anyone else — to include consensus 1st rounders Tua Tagovailoa and Justin Herbert. Here were his takes on these guys: 2. Jacob Eason, Washington: “I watched him and (Justin) Herbert back and forth, back and forth. Herbert, everything is deliberate, elongated, slower. And then you go over to Eason. He is really quick. If Eason has errant throws, they’re where they need to be errant. Herbert, they’re right in harm’s way. Five-yard out route, if you’re going to miss, miss outside. Herbert will miss inside. Eason will miss outside. Eason is much better. The only thing about Eason is there’s that one throw every game where you’re wondering: ‘What was that?’ That’s where it would help to be able to be able to go through it with him and ask him what he was looking at.” 4. Tua Tagovailoa, Alabama: “You can find a Tua in any draft. He’s a great kid; however, that is not a skill set. His accuracy when flushed from the pocket is very poor and his accuracy with intermediate to long balls is also not very good. And this is critical in the evaluation: He had the best wide-receiver group in the country. … People say Tua is accurate. Where do you get accurate? Completion percentage? That says nothing about accuracy. Is he pretty accurate with RPOs? He is. That’s a slant pass. Forget about those. In the NFL, nobody RPOs you to death the way Alabama does. At Alabama they throw a slant and it goes for 80 (yards). That might happen once in your career in the NFL. It happens every game at Alabama. … In the national championship game, Clemson used a similar blitz twice. One was a pick six, the other a pick. He had no clue what he was looking at. I think he got better, but still shows signs of not understanding blitzes. … Tua is also not a very good decision-maker. He does not know when to get rid of the ball at times. Hence his injuries.” 5. Justin Herbert, Oregon: “His inaccuracy, man, you look at some of his throws and you’re like, ‘What the …?’ Herbert is just slow and deliberate with everything he does. And that gets you in trouble in college. Then in the NFL you have a big issue, a huge issue. Can it be cleaned up a little bit? Yes, but ultimately that’s his twitch. And to switch a twitch is almost like an instinct. You can’t make a guy instinctive. You can’t say, ‘Hey, we’re going to work on your instincts today.’ … If a guy’s not accurate, you’re not going to change that. I don’t care what anybody tells you.” Great memory for you to pull this up ! Impressive my man . The point being-take what he says and just file it away as another man;s opinion- that I happen to agree with . It'll be ironic if he's the next Herbert ! Edited February 27 by RSkinGM more info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSkinGM Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 18 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said: No clue who Merril Hoge is, but I have been saying all the QBs are overhyped so I can agree to an extent. I just think we already have a guy with the same skillset in Howell. If they go QB, for me, it should be either Caleb or Daniels, but my preference is a trade down. Hoge was tough R B for the Steelers. Did the job with guts more than sheer gifted talent as I remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted February 27 Author Share Posted February 27 1 hour ago, RSkinGM said: On the Junkies, Merrril Hoge says Drake Maye is NOT a first round Q B . Extremely inconsistent, processing is inconsistent. Not real athletic, stiff, long throwing motion. Surely Peters won't draft this guy . 🙏 Not real athletic? lol, oh Merril. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 3 hours ago, lavar703 said: I really don't think their skillsets are similar and if they hadn't gone to the same college literally no one would make the comparison in my opinion. Like, they couldn't be more different. Quote POSITIVES — Good build. Able to withstand repeated shots throughout the game and keep playing. — Can run in between the tackles and is a tough runner overall, with enough athleticism and burst to handle designed runs. Has the play strength to bounce off tackles. — Good arm strength, with the ability to drive intermediate throws. — Throws a very catchable deep ball. Can consistently get distance and put touch on Go balls. — Above-average accuracy at all three levels when in rhythm. Can help create yards after the catch with his ball placement. NEGATIVES — Below-average height for the position. — Has a long, over-the-top throwing motion that defenders can punish if he's late on a throw. — Plays in an RPO-heavy system. Has a ways to go in terms of progressing and reading over the middle of the field. Lacks consistent anticipation and will wait for receivers to flash open before pulling the trigger. — Will look to tuck the ball and run too early. Overall, Howell has the arm strength, athleticism and enough accuracy to make it in the NFL. But he will need a good deal of development and polish on his footwork, pocket awareness and movement, understanding of dropback concepts, and overall mechanics to become a viable NFL starting quarterback. https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10021434-sam-howell-nfl-draft-2022-scouting-report-for-north-carolina-qb Quote POSITIVES — Good athletic ability. Quick for his size, good speed to threaten defenses as a scrambler and designed runner. — Very good arm strength. Throws with tons of velocity outside the numbers and down the field. — Great ability to throw off-platform and under pressure. Can rip it when the pocket is cluttered or when he's on the move. — Great accuracy. Throws well to all three levels and shows flashes of special touch. — Above-average ability to operate within structure. Plays on time and knows how to get to the checkdown. NEGATIVES — Tendency to make bad plays worse. Will run into bad sacks or throw head-scratching interceptions trying to save a play. — Can struggle to come off his pre-snap read when the picture changes on him post-snap. Overall, Maye is a supremely talented passer. He has the athleticism, arm talent and baseline processing skills to become a weapon at the next level. All he needs to do is cut out some of the "doing too much" plays. Maye has the skill set to fit in any system and develop into a star. https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10089376-drake-maye-nfl-draft-2024-scouting-report-for-unc-qb I'm sorry, my dude, they may not be "identical," but the concept that "they couldn't be more different" is way off base IMO. Both dudes struggle post snap with their ability to process their reads. Both players play hero ball too often. Both players have the abilities to make any throw required of them. Both of them stand tall in the pocket and have good statistical years followed by down years before coming out in the draft. They are more alike than you want to admit and quite honestly the biggest different between them is Maye's height and slightly better arm strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 Look, I like Sammy more than just about anyone else on this board and I think that's pretty well known. Had we not ended up in a position to draft Drake Maye I would be totally on board with giving him another season and building around him to see what happens but here we are, at pick 2. There is almost no metric out there that supports the idea that Maye and Howell are similar. Their RAS scores are going to be vastly different as well. Its not a knock on Sam but Maye is just that much better with a much higher ceiling due to the fact he's better equipped to play the position. The height, the speed, the ball placement and off platform oddball throwing ability that only a few QBs on the planet can do. Hell, I wasn't even convinced about Maye until I really started watching and reading as much as I could. He's a kid who made a decision to stay close to him instead of going to Alabama and ended up on an inferior team because of it. Without Maye that team probably wins 3-4 games. He was really all they had. Ultimately by about midseason of next year I think you'll end up happy about this pick @Slappy Mc. He's the type of talent at QB that we've constantly missed out on because we won too many games. He's the real deal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taylor made Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 (edited) 1 hour ago, Slappy Mc said: Both players have the abilities to make any throw required of them. Both of them stand tall in the pocket I think you are overrating Sam's abilities here. His size really hurt his ability to do either of these things. Sam's pocket presence was a mess and got worse over the year. I also felt Sam couldn't make all the throws. His throws were not on a rope, especially to the sidelines. From what I've seen of Maye, I think he is vastly superior to Sam here. Edited February 28 by taylor made Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARTMONK HOF Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 Like the majority of people if I had my preference it would be C. Williams. If that is not an option it’s a toss up for me between Maye and Daniels. My biggest red flag for JD is that he takes too many big hits and they will be so much more devastating in the pros and needs to learn to protect his body. My biggest red flag for DM is that is accuracy with ball placement is very inconsistent. They both get through their progressions, DM a little quicker than JD at this point but when it’s time to rip it JD is more accurate than DM. I’ve heard people say you’re accurate or you’re not, but if it’s a footwork issue maybe it can be fixed. You can’t say it enough how big this pick will be. Would love to know where these guys heads are at. To be continued… 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted February 28 Share Posted February 28 22 minutes ago, lavar703 said: Ultimately by about midseason of next year I think you'll end up happy about this pick @Slappy Mc. He's the type of talent at QB that we've constantly missed out on because we won too many games. He's the real deal. Whatever the team decides to do I will stand behind. I'm not saying I am going to give them a pass if/when it doesn't work out, but I am well aware the team will most likely draft a QB at #2 regardless of whether I feel they deserve to be drafted there. With that said, you better hope they draft some damn lineman with their next two picks because he is going to get killed, just like Sam behind our offensive line. 11 minutes ago, taylor made said: I think you are overrating Sam's abilities here. His size really hurt his ability to do either of these things. Sam's pocket presence was a mess and got worse over the year. I also felt Sam couldn't make all the throws. His throws were not on a rope, especially on the sidelines. From what I've seen of Maye, I think he is vastly superior to Sam here. IMO, there is no way you can adequately judge Sam on his pocket presence from last year. I am absolutely positive I could point to more examples of Sam having little to no time and showing a direct correlation to bad play. I also think that if you watched him play well and still thought he couldn't make all the throws, that is your bias. I don't think, at this point, that Sam is a franchise QB and I am okay with them exploring other options. I just don't think the QB we pursue should be like the QB we are ready to move on from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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