Nnivolcm Posted May 30 Share Posted May 30 Just now, Karnage84 said: I don't know if it would. I could see us losing someone like Kerby or Iffy but they could also be replacement candidates at the current rate anyway. I don't know if it would either as I am far from a cap expert. I have heard it could be hard to resign him even if we don't make a Sutton-like addition so it's certainly a possibility if we make a trade for Sutton. That's what I asked the hypothetical question. I think if trading for Sutton means McNeill leaves I would rather not make that trade. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 https://www.totalprosports.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs-player-facing-two-police-warrants-for-animal-cruelty-as-teams-offseason-legal-issues-continue-to-mount/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3LxGg8vmgVOsFLsOS_RBSa-rQdslmNq1pqRZR4mr9Tj6O60Or07of0I4E_aem_AcfgPAX0fW0oATCBN8Ks_ECQd7fJVWL1pKLanHaLCcACVkGGoKEu765v8C7bWUZH11CvZIIvuwHiZtwctEwtrgC1 I’m glad we got rid of Buggs now after reading this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 51 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: https://www.totalprosports.com/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs-player-facing-two-police-warrants-for-animal-cruelty-as-teams-offseason-legal-issues-continue-to-mount/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3LxGg8vmgVOsFLsOS_RBSa-rQdslmNq1pqRZR4mr9Tj6O60Or07of0I4E_aem_AcfgPAX0fW0oATCBN8Ks_ECQd7fJVWL1pKLanHaLCcACVkGGoKEu765v8C7bWUZH11CvZIIvuwHiZtwctEwtrgC1 I’m glad we got rid of Buggs now after reading this. He didn't seem like a problem player when we signed him. You hate to see someone go off-the-rails like this. Hopefully he can get himself straightened out sooner rather than later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 17 hours ago, Nnivolcm said: I don't know if it would either as I am far from a cap expert. I have heard it could be hard to resign him even if we don't make a Sutton-like addition so it's certainly a possibility if we make a trade for Sutton. That's what I asked the hypothetical question. I think if trading for Sutton means McNeill leaves I would rather not make that trade. OTC has a valuation of $8.7M for him. Let's double that and put it around $16M. With nearly $40M in cap space once Sutton drops off, I don't think it'd be too hard for us to add Sutton and re-sign McNeill. Getting Hutch under contract when his time comes up could be the trickier part. Signing McNeill might not be the issue but keeping him could be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 46 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: OTC has a valuation of $8.7M for him. Let's double that and put it around $16M. With nearly $40M in cap space once Sutton drops off, I don't think it'd be too hard for us to add Sutton and re-sign McNeill. Getting Hutch under contract when his time comes up could be the trickier part. Signing McNeill might not be the issue but keeping him could be. I was looking at the cap by year and noticed a couple things. The Carlton Davis trade looks worse IMO because he has three void years causing a $9M dead money cap hit next year. Does that stay with us or is that on the Bucs since they gave him the signing bonus? Its no cash out of our pocket I believe so seems weird we get the cap hit. If we do have that on our books, between Decker, Davis, and Davenport we have about $16M in dead cap next year from void years. Given the projected caps, we are in a pretty good spot with the cap going forward, obviously people fall off the books so we need to sign more to fill out a roster. But for next year we have 48M in cap space with Decker being the big money falling off the books and I believe that includes carryover of this years current 31M in space. So if we spend 17M of that on Sutton this year, it reduces what we carry over and then would only have 31M next year and again 17M of that would be used by Sutton for 2025. So I think we could find a way to manage them both but it would limit what we can do to fill other holes. That being said, I am not sure Sutton is the right fit for us. Especially with that contract. I don't think he is needed but I do think we could upgrade our 2/3 WR some. I think there are better cost/reward options that could be available such as Robert Woods from Houston. Or just wait until some guys get cut. Even signing Michael Thomas for a cheap one year deal makes more sense IMO than giving up picks and a huge cap hit for Sutton who has been underwhelming since his breakout in 2019. His high since then is 62 catches and 829 yards. He only had 2 TDs a year until this year he had 10 but still was not overly productive on a yards/catch basis. Josh Reynolds was a cut WR we picked up off the streets for cheap and he was sufficient. We now have Jamo who hopefully takes that role and if not, we have DPJ who out-produced Sutton in 2022. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 6 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: I was looking at the cap by year and noticed a couple things. The Carlton Davis trade looks worse IMO because he has three void years causing a $9M dead money cap hit next year. Does that stay with us or is that on the Bucs since they gave him the signing bonus? Its no cash out of our pocket I believe so seems weird we get the cap hit. If we do have that on our books, between Decker, Davis, and Davenport we have about $16M in dead cap next year from void years. Given the projected caps, we are in a pretty good spot with the cap going forward, obviously people fall off the books so we need to sign more to fill out a roster. But for next year we have 48M in cap space with Decker being the big money falling off the books and I believe that includes carryover of this years current 31M in space. So if we spend 17M of that on Sutton this year, it reduces what we carry over and then would only have 31M next year and again 17M of that would be used by Sutton for 2025. So I think we could find a way to manage them both but it would limit what we can do to fill other holes. That being said, I am not sure Sutton is the right fit for us. Especially with that contract. I don't think he is needed but I do think we could upgrade our 2/3 WR some. I think there are better cost/reward options that could be available such as Robert Woods from Houston. Or just wait until some guys get cut. Even signing Michael Thomas for a cheap one year deal makes more sense IMO than giving up picks and a huge cap hit for Sutton who has been underwhelming since his breakout in 2019. His high since then is 62 catches and 829 yards. He only had 2 TDs a year until this year he had 10 but still was not overly productive on a yards/catch basis. Josh Reynolds was a cut WR we picked up off the streets for cheap and he was sufficient. We now have Jamo who hopefully takes that role and if not, we have DPJ who out-produced Sutton in 2022. I don't see WR as a huge need for the Lions unless a significant injury occurs. With ARSB, Sam LaPorta, Jameson Williams and Jahmyr Gibbs all playing prominent roles in the passing game, it seems hard to justify a trade unless it a player-for-player trade. Antoine Green, DPJ and Kalif Raymond should be able to round out the rotation nicely. I suspect a quality veteran WR will become available due to the large number of your WRs that were taken in this draft anyway. I do see a real need for another safety though. I was down on Kerby Joseph's tackling (13.7% missed tackle rate) and overall marginal play following his return from injury. Now he is recovering from hip surgery. Brandon Joseph has been getting some run with the 1s in OTAs but it is tough to read anything into that. Maybe they have something in Loren Strickland. If there isn't a player that separates themselves and grabs that role, I could see the Lions making a move for a veteran safety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 30 minutes ago, Just Want A Title said: I don't see WR as a huge need for the Lions unless a significant injury occurs. With ARSB, Sam LaPorta, Jameson Williams and Jahmyr Gibbs all playing prominent roles in the passing game, it seems hard to justify a trade unless it a player-for-player trade. Antoine Green, DPJ and Kalif Raymond should be able to round out the rotation nicely. I suspect a quality veteran WR will become available due to the large number of your WRs that were taken in this draft anyway. I do see a real need for another safety though. I was down on Kerby Joseph's tackling (13.7% missed tackle rate) and overall marginal play following his return from injury. Now he is recovering from hip surgery. Brandon Joseph has been getting some run with the 1s in OTAs but it is tough to read anything into that. Maybe they have something in Loren Strickland. If there isn't a player that separates themselves and grabs that role, I could see the Lions making a move for a veteran safety. Agreed we could use something. I think there are a few guys like Jamal Adams and Justin Simmons waiting to find a starting job somewhere. Maybe we could reunite with Quandre Diggs or even Tracy Walker at a discount to fill in the depth although Diggs may be one waiting for an injury to be a starter somewhere. Also, we currently have 10 CBs signed. 11 if you count Branch there. I wonder if we plan to use Branch more in the S role and keep more CBs or have one of the CB's convert to S. For example, Kindle Vildor was awful in man coverage last year but graded highly in run defense and tackling. He also wasn't terrible in zone coverage so maybe he will be one like Iffy to move to S to save his career. Dorsey is another who has an extremely small sample size but was graded 78 tackling and 82 zone coverage by PFF. He could maybe make the move as well. I think AG likes versatility so having guys who can do both makes sense, and also helps disguise coverages/blitzes. edit - I just looked and Iffy had the highest PFF zone grade by a S last year. Didn't realize how good he was in coverage given his pass rushing ability but thats impressive. Also have to worry about losing him after this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted May 31 Share Posted May 31 34 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: Agreed we could use something. I think there are a few guys like Jamal Adams and Justin Simmons waiting to find a starting job somewhere. Maybe we could reunite with Quandre Diggs or even Tracy Walker at a discount to fill in the depth although Diggs may be one waiting for an injury to be a starter somewhere. Also, we currently have 10 CBs signed. 11 if you count Branch there. I wonder if we plan to use Branch more in the S role and keep more CBs or have one of the CB's convert to S. For example, Kindle Vildor was awful in man coverage last year but graded highly in run defense and tackling. He also wasn't terrible in zone coverage so maybe he will be one like Iffy to move to S to save his career. Dorsey is another who has an extremely small sample size but was graded 78 tackling and 82 zone coverage by PFF. He could maybe make the move as well. I think AG likes versatility so having guys who can do both makes sense, and also helps disguise coverages/blitzes. edit - I just looked and Iffy had the highest PFF zone grade by a S last year. Didn't realize how good he was in coverage given his pass rushing ability but thats impressive. Also have to worry about losing him after this year. If Ifeatu Melifonwu stays healthy like he did last year, he could be a legit pro bowl safety. His football skills are finally starting to catch up with his physical skills. Adding Deshea Townsend as his coach could make him even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superduperman Posted June 6 Share Posted June 6 In which Cam Sutton speaks two whole paragraphs and says precisely nothing https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/pittsburgh-steelers-news/2024/6/5/24172338/steelers-cb-cam-sutton-breaks-silence-on-domestic-violence-incident-detroit-lions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Friend Posted June 9 Share Posted June 9 On 6/5/2024 at 10:34 PM, Superduperman said: In which Cam Sutton speaks two whole paragraphs and says precisely nothing https://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/pittsburgh-steelers-news/2024/6/5/24172338/steelers-cb-cam-sutton-breaks-silence-on-domestic-violence-incident-detroit-lions Trash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idoubtit Posted June 10 Share Posted June 10 On 5/31/2024 at 11:27 AM, Sllim Pickens said: The Carlton Davis trade looks worse IMO because he has three void years causing a $9M dead money cap hit next year. Does that stay with us or is that on the Bucs since they gave him the signing bonus? I'm quite sure that stays with us. We restructured his contract right after we signed him. I think it is a bit of a bet for the Lions. The salary he signed with TB pays him about $15m/yr which is how much actual cash he is getting this year even though his cap hit is less than $5m. He is 28 years old right now and missed 4 games with injury last year. But if he plays well and stays injury free I could see us extending him and softening the blow of those void years. If his play declines or he struggles with injury I expect we will take the loss and move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Friend Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Lions are signing UFL K Jake Bates. Move becomes official on Tuesday according to reports. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idoubtit Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 Which player would be the most catastrophic to lose if they were injured during the season? My top 3. 1) Hutch - This is probably more feeling than actual objectivity but I just would not feel good about the rest of a season with him out. Maybe another player will step up and give me more confidence but I think we would get run over without him there. I don't even think he is out most important player, it's just due to the rest of the players at Edge. 2) Sewell - I know that it is only one guy but I think losing him changes our offense ability completely. He gives us the ability to do many different things with many different players. 3) Goff - How could I not have him first? I just get the feeling that with our online and RBs we could manage. It would be a lot harder but I just have more confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 38 minutes ago, idoubtit said: Which player would be the most catastrophic to lose if they were injured during the season? My top 3. 1) Hutch - This is probably more feeling than actual objectivity but I just would not feel good about the rest of a season with him out. Maybe another player will step up and give me more confidence but I think we would get run over without him there. I don't even think he is out most important player, it's just due to the rest of the players at Edge. 2) Sewell - I know that it is only one guy but I think losing him changes our offense ability completely. He gives us the ability to do many different things with many different players. 3) Goff - How could I not have him first? I just get the feeling that with our online and RBs we could manage. It would be a lot harder but I just have more confidence. That could almost warrant a separate thread. I am going go with Penei Sewell. My reasoning: 1. Terrell Williams should be able to get more pass rush production from the other D-Lineman. We also have some pretty solid blitzing safeties in Brian Branch and Ifeatu Melifonwu. The LBs should be able to chip in some pass-rush help also. 2. Assuming Hendon Hooker goes into the season as our #2QB, he will have a very good O-Line and running game to rely on. He will have to make enough plays to keep defenses honest. Once he stops over-thinking stuff he should settle in. I suspect the over-thinking will start to go away about 1.5 weeks into training camp. When his mind catches up to his physical tools it will be really obvious. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vike daddy Posted June 15 Share Posted June 15 13 hours ago, Louis Friend said: Lions are signing UFL K Jake Bates. Move becomes official on Tuesday according to reports. boomer of a leg obviously, but lesser accuracy. still, i wish him and the Lions the best. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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