***SPOILERS*** Star Wars Episode VIII: The Last Jedi SPOILER Thread

[Calvert28]

1 minute ago, James said:

I'm not sure this one was supposed to be funny. Most people in the theater laughed but people are dumb. I think his move of rejecting the light saber made sense for his character though.

It was supposed to be humorous and telling at the same time. The scene in general doesn't make sense.

I mean if Luke rejected the teaching, the entire Force and everything. Why was he dressed up in his Grand Master robes?

[James]

1 minute ago, Calvert28 said:

It was supposed to be humorous and telling at the same time. The scene in general doesn't make sense.

I mean if Luke rejected the teaching, the entire Force and everything. Why was he dressed up in his Grand Master robes?

They're comfy. Duh.

[James]

5 minutes ago, Malfatron said:

the scene was played for comedy.

the dramatic music and then the music cut and he throws the light saber behind him

Oh, okay. It was hard to tell with all the people cackling.

[Calvert28]

Just now, James said:

They're comfy. Duh.

Maybe you're right. I mean between those and alien Walrus nipple milk. I mean what more does a man need?

[Deadpulse]

2 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

But now the question comes up, well if one ship like that can do that much damage, why hasn't this been a common thing for Rebels or really anyone to just go Eve Online against all these titan class vessals whenever they were outmatched?

I thought that too, but they cover their buts on this. As she starts to turn and rev up the hyperdrive, they cut to the deck of Snoke's ship and some peon tells Hux that she is doing just all that and he brushes it off as a ruse and tells them to focus on the fleeing transports. IMO, if Hux wasn't so preoccupied and in almost any other battle situation, the enemy would read that you are about to make the jump and be able to actually do something about it. Hence not making it a viable tactic most of the time. 

[fretgod99]

1 hour ago, Deadpulse said:

I thought that too, but they cover their buts on this. As she starts to turn and rev up the hyperdrive, they cut to the deck of Snoke's ship and some peon tells Hux that she is doing just all that and he brushes it off as a ruse and tells them to focus on the fleeing transports. IMO, if Hux wasn't so preoccupied and in almost any other battle situation, the enemy would read that you are about to make the jump and be able to actually do something about it. Hence not making it a viable tactic most of the time. 

Also, doing that much damage cost them a capital ship. You don’t find those just lying around. In a war of attrition, the Resistance is sure to lose. Hence, it’s a desperation thing.

[fretgod99]

9 hours ago, Malfatron said:

the on hold thing with Poe at the beginning

Hey look! Common ground! I wasn’t a fan of that either.

Disagree completely on Luke tossing the saber. It was less of a joke and more of a statement. It’s not supposed to be funny, it’s supposed to be unexpected. That it has a similar structure is unsurprising; the lead in is continuing to build expectation. If it made some people laugh along the way, whatever, added bonus. The primary intent was not to be funny.

[Deadpulse]

5 minutes ago, fretgod99 said:

Disagree completely on Luke tossing the saber. It was less of a joke and more of a statement. It’s not supposed to be funny, it’s supposed to be unexpected. That it has a similar structure is unsurprising; the lead in is continuing to build expectation. If it made some people laugh along the way, whatever, added bonus. The primary intent was not to be funny.

It's the opening salvo, crushing expectations from the word go. 

[Calvert28]

3 hours ago, Deadpulse said:

I thought that too, but they cover their buts on this. As she starts to turn and rev up the hyperdrive, they cut to the deck of Snoke's ship and some peon tells Hux that she is doing just all that and he brushes it off as a ruse and tells them to focus on the fleeing transports. IMO, if Hux wasn't so preoccupied and in almost any other battle situation, the enemy would read that you are about to make the jump and be able to actually do something about it. Hence not making it a viable tactic most of the time. 

The cruiser was still out of range from Snoke's fleet though. Not to mention that one ship destroyed like 8 other FO ships that were even larger then it. By that rational, they could just make several special kamikaze ships that are just designed to take out those capital fleet ships. Or even the Death Star. While we know they can track through Light Speed. They have nothing to target the ship that does if it does jump to light out of range from the cannons or what not.

[Calvert28]

1 hour ago, Deadpulse said:

It's the opening salvo, crushing expectations from the word go. 

How was it not to be funny as well as explain Luke's story in the movie from the start though? To be not funny and more serious would be letting him take then slowly lower his arm and toss it to the side with somber music. Instead of the defeated teacher, we were shown more cranky Master Roshi. This still falls under the forced humor category.

The humor with Poe would have been saved at the beginning if that was the only major crack up scene there was. Other slightly more situational humor like Rey's stuff with the lightsaber and pissing off the natives should really have been it. No Chewbacca eating a porg, Luke wiping imaginary dust off his robes at the end like some B-rated martial arts movie master, no Finn humor AT ALL. It would have helped that movie keep that dark tone alot more had they done it that way. Although I could have done with one more "It's a tra.." *BOOM* (bridge gone).

[SteelKing728]

3 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

How was it not to be funny as well as explain Luke's story in the movie from the start though? To be not funny and more serious would be letting him take then slowly lower his arm and toss it to the side with somber music. Instead of the defeated teacher, we were shown more cranky Master Roshi. This still falls under the forced humor category.

The humor with Poe would have been saved at the beginning if that was the only major crack up scene there was. Other slightly more situational humor like Rey's stuff with the lightsaber and pissing off the natives should really have been it. No Chewbacca eating a porg, Luke wiping imaginary dust off his robes at the end like some B-rated martial arts movie master, no Finn humor AT ALL. It would have helped that movie keep that dark tone alot more had they done it that way. Although I could have done with one more "It's a tra.." *BOOM* (bridge gone).

Yeah, they said this was "the darkest one of them all" and it never panned out that way. Rogue One is a far darker (and better) story

[Deadpulse]

6 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

The cruiser was still out of range from Snoke's fleet though. Not to mention that one ship destroyed like 8 other FO ships that were even larger then it. By that rational, they could just make several special kamikaze ships that are just designed to take out those capital fleet ships. Or even the Death Star. While we know they can track through Light Speed. They have nothing to target the ship that does if it does jump to light out of range from the cannons or what not.

Well she was about facing and sitting on the just out of range line, I would say when she starts to turn she is probably within range. Again, in the movie they imply that action COULD have been taken to stop Holdo from doing anything, but Hux just straight ignored her. 

I dont think kamikaze ships would be cost effective for either side, especially when super weapons exist that you can fire more than once. Did you see that cannon in the opening? Thing was devastating and they could do it more than once. Obviously all we can do is speculate as to how hyperspeed really works. How close do you need to be to actually do damage? Would a fully shielded ship or station block it? How close did Han come to kamikazing the Starkiller base? Or would he had just been a stain on the planet sized station because the falcon is just too small to do significant damage? There is a lot we just can't know because we have no information other than Hux ignoring her despite knowing she was up to something, the large ship was probably in range once she hit hyperspace, and Snoke's ship likely did not have forward shields up as it was bombarding the escaping transports. Just based on that, IMO it was a stars aligned situation to use the tactic. Again though, we don't have enough info to say either way definitively. 

[cddolphin]

4 hours ago, SteelKing728 said:

Yeah, they said this was "the darkest one of them all" and it never panned out that way. Rogue One is a far darker (and better) story

Yep and had a great third act, even if the first two were kind of 'meh'.

54 minutes ago, Deadpulse said:

I dont think kamikaze ships would be cost effective for either side, especially when super weapons exist that you can fire more than once. Did you see that cannon in the opening? Thing was devastating and they could do it more than once. Obviously all we can do is speculate as to how hyperspeed really works. How close do you need to be to actually do damage? Would a fully shielded ship or station block it? How close did Han come to kamikazing the Starkiller base? Or would he had just been a stain on the planet sized station because the falcon is just too small to do significant damage? There is a lot we just can't know because we have no information other than Hux ignoring her despite knowing she was up to something, the large ship was probably in range once she hit hyperspace, and Snoke's ship likely did not have forward shields up as it was bombarding the escaping transports. Just based on that, IMO it was a stars aligned situation to use the tactic. Again though, we don't have enough info to say either way definitively. 

Well the concept doesn't need ships to work. Take a dense slug, add a hyperdrive computer to it and launch it at the Death Star. Congratulations, you've just avoided the entire original trilogy.

It's true we can only speculate, but we do know some things:
1) hyperspace travel has existed in star wars for thousands of years
2) nowhere in any canon (or former canon) sources are hyperspace kamikaze-type weapons ever mentioned
 

My understanding of hyperspace is that you travel literally through another dimension, since faster-than-light travel is technically impossible. So it's not that you're moving super super fast (thereby giving your ship/projectile massive energy potential for an impact), but you simply slip into another dimension, bypassing all those pesky physics limitations when it comes to speed.

HOWEVER

 

Han to Luke: "Without precise calculations we can fly right through a star, or bounce too close to a supernova and that'd end your trip real quick."

That sort of carries the implication that they are traveling through the same dimension, unless Han meant when the ship re-enters "normal" space.

 

Let's be real, Star Wars doesn't think any of this through. Ever since the "parsecs" line in A New Hope it's sort of apparent that their scientific/physics fact-checking is.. tenuous, like most of Hollywood.

[Deadpulse]

33 minutes ago, cddolphin said:

Well the concept doesn't need ships to work. Take a dense slug, add a hyperdrive computer to it and launch it at the Death Star. Congratulations, you've just avoided the entire original trilogy.

Can you enter hyperspace coordinates remotely or launch said rocket and then have it enter hyperspace at the right moment? I suppose you can stick a droid in the rocket to do all that stuff, however would a small missile even be effective? We saw a HUGE ship do this to effect. How much damage would a small rocket do that is a very small fraction of the size? Does it matter? Also, as depicted in almost every star wars movie, everyone can detect when a hyperdrive is reving up. It has always taken some time to do this. If there was a missile about to hit hyperspace, wouldnt you just shoot it down before it could? It goes back to the idea that Holdo likely could have been stopped if the First Order paid her ANY heed. 

 

39 minutes ago, cddolphin said:

My understanding of hyperspace is that you travel literally through another dimension, since faster-than-light travel is technically impossible. So it's not that you're moving super super fast (thereby giving your ship/projectile massive energy potential for an impact), but you simply slip into another dimension, bypassing all those pesky physics limitations when it comes to speed.

HOWEVER

 

Han to Luke: "Without precise calculations we can fly right through a star, or bounce too close to a supernova and that'd end your trip real quick."

That sort of carries the implication that they are traveling through the same dimension, unless Han meant when the ship re-enters "normal" space.

My understanding of what happened to the FO ships was it was as Holdo was entering hyperspace. If she was a distance back, IMO, she enters hyperspace before getting to them and does no damage. I think you are right on about the super super fast just that it only happens as you are entering hyperspace. It could simply be that you are moving so fast that laws of physics break (as you said, light speed for mass is technically impossible), creating hyperspace. Again, only speculation, but how I see it is that it was Holdo entering hyperspace that did the damage, not her IN hyperspace. 

[MacReady]

All I know is if I hated a movie this much, I wouldn't watch it as many times as Calvert has, and I certainly wouldn't keep talking about it.