With the 5th pick in the NFL draft the Broncos select....

[champ11]

 

2 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Ironically, I'm not sold Lamar is an athletic-freak only type guy.   Now, no way I'd want us to target him so early, just saying he's actually got real potential to be successful.  But yeah, that news isn't surprising at all.  I mean, let's face it, Elway didn't even bring Lamar Jackson in for a visit.   That's a dead giveaway.

that's because you don't get hooked on narratives. Jackson ran a pro style offense and displayed plenty of pocket passer ability. 

[Broncofan]

11 minutes ago, broncofan48 said:

Guarantee if we don't get Keenum 4 QBs go in the first 4 picks haha, murphy's law and all

I get that's the argument made - just that Elway's said he's not afraid to swing for the fences.    Given our cap situation, not putting us in a cap-committed hole to Keenum and going with Teddy B or McCown or even (ugh) AJ McCarron would have been a far bolder move.  Of course, the counter argument is that teams could have leveraged our transparent need for QB trade-wise to force our hand.   We just ended up paying either way hard, just in different ways - in this case, the one resource we lack the most - cap room.   

Now, if Elway gets his rookie, he's good enough to get Keenum traded before the season starts, then we ended up only paying 10M.  It's just if it's 18M, or higher...man, every dollar hurts, with our 2019 cap hell we're facing (still going to be 30th out of 32, and even if we cut 5+ vets, we'll be a bottom 10 team...unless we can clear Keenum, and even better if we can clear not just 2019, but if he's not our answer, 2018 too).    Given the above, it would be good enough just to clear the space, anything better than an early Day 3 pick would be a bonus.   

My concern is that if we get a QB - we will be hard-pressed to trade Keenum early this year.  So we lose 18M total (instead of 10M if we can trade him before week 1).   My 2nd biggest concern is that we don't get the QB - and Keenum's JAG.   Who succeeded because MIN was the perfect place for an average talent to succeed, and we're not.   I'd take curtain #1 every day lol.  

[BroncosFan2010]

Quote

that's because you don't get hooked on narratives. Jackson ran a pro style offense and displayed plenty of pocket passer ability. 

There was an eye opening article on Lamar that outlined how about 75% of his rushing yards came off designed plays. That's huge. Shows that he wasnt freelancing passing downs into scramble yards. It would have been a bad sign IMO if it was 75% scrambles to 25% designed runs.

Lamar is my QB3 after Darnold and Rosen. If you want to gamble on the less polished, mobile QB you might as well take the one with the best physical tools. That's Lamar.

Here is to hoping Elway is smoke-screening interest in Jackson so we can deal to 12 w/ Buffalo and pick him up.

[Broncofan]

17 minutes ago, champ11 said:

 

that's because you don't get hooked on narratives. Jackson ran a pro style offense and displayed plenty of pocket passer ability. 

And his development this year as a pocket passer was very promising.   But I'd be the first to say he can't be in the top tier, he's clearly behind (again...for me, the top tier is Darnold and Rosen).   

TBH, I'd rather we take Jackson than Allen, if it were to come to that - but we have no shot, given Elway's clearly taken Jackson off the list a while ago.   I'm still torn on Mayfield, but I'm terrified with Allen.   Can't deny that ceiling, but his flaws are exactly the ones that usually don't get fixed - and we've shown zero ability to develop projects.    Ironically, Allen looks like a much bigger project than Lamar.     But it's a moot point.

[paul-mac]

I have my QBs ranked in tiers:

 

ELITE: Sam Darnold

First round: Josh Rosen, Baker Mayfield

Second round: Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen

 

Reason I have Jackson above Allen, if I’m gonna gamble on a raw second round talent I would rather take the guy that you can change your offense to suit him and he can contribute straight away, rather than Allen who is a total project like Paxton Lynch. 

[AKRNA]

3 hours ago, broncos67 said:

The trend is that the positions he considers to be premium (QB, LT, DE, CB) have made up nearly all of his first round picks. Miller, Wolfe, Williams, Roby, Lynch, Ray, Bolles- all fit into those position groups.

If you listen to Elway he states often that in the draft he picks best talent and uses FA to bolster positions. I'm not sure he does but it's a solid practice none the less. Targeting positions in the draft is a fools errand.

[broncofan48]

Just now, AKRNA said:

If you listen to Elway he states often that in the draft he picks best talent and uses FA to bolster positions. I'm not sure he does but it's a solid practice none the less. Targeting positions in the draft is a fools errand.

But Elway's rankings in regards  to BPA are influenced by the positions (LT, CB, EDGE, QB) that in his mind affect the game the most.  

[broncosfan07]

 

WTH kind of insight is this? In other news Broncos plan to show up to draft, may select a few players. 

[Broncofan]

18 minutes ago, broncosfan07 said:

 

WTH kind of insight is this? In other news Broncos plan to show up to draft, may select a few players. 

 It’s full blown lying season.   Same day that CLE GM wouldn’t rule out drafting QB for both 1.1 and 1.4 and NYG said they were open to any player lol.  No one wants to tip their hand.

[Broncofan]

1 hour ago, broncofan48 said:

But Elway's rankings in regards  to BPA are influenced by the positions (LT, CB, EDGE, QB) that in his mind affect the game the most.  

And his BPA list is skewed to insane physical tools / bust floor guys.   No other way to explain some of the Day 2 reaches he’s made.   

[AKRNA]

1 hour ago, broncofan48 said:

But Elway's rankings in regards  to BPA are influenced by the positions (LT, CB, EDGE, QB) that in his mind affect the game the most.  

I think it does also and IMO that's a fools approach. The game changes, positional value changes, nothing is static.

I think we'll see that in spades in just a few years. Four QB's will likely be drafted in the top 8-10 and three of the teams will be regretting it. All the while, guys like Nelson, Vea (I'm a big fan also), guys they passed up will be heading to their second or third pro-bowl while their "franchise" QB sucks and won't be tendered a 5th year.

[germ-x]

15 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

I think it does also and IMO that's a fools approach. The game changes, positional value changes, nothing is static.

I think we'll see that in spades in just a few years. Four QB's will likely be drafted in the top 8-10 and three of the teams will be regretting it. All the while, guys like Nelson, Vea (I'm a big fan also), guys they passed up will be heading to their second or third pro-bowl while their "franchise" QB sucks and won't be tendered a 5th year.

That still doesn’t make the case of an OG being more important or equally as important in the game of football.  It just means you made the wrong pick.

No one is saying take a QB for the sake of taking a QB.  For example, I’ll take Nelson all day every day over Mayfield because I don’t think Mayfield is going to be any good. 

[AKRNA]

2 hours ago, germ-x said:

That still doesn’t make the case of an OG being more important or equally as important in the game of football.  It just means you made the wrong pick.

No one is saying take a QB for the sake of taking a QB.  For example, I’ll take Nelson all day every day over Mayfield because I don’t think Mayfield is going to be any good. 

I think it's important to remember that only 6 guys on the team, if healthy, play 100% of the snaps on either side of the LOS. That's the QB and the entire OL. I think teams are starting to realize that, given the size of the FA OL contracts this year.

I believe it's the start of a serious trend upwards in OL salaries. That's one of the reasons why I hope we try to extend Paradis this year if we'd like to keep him. If he hits FA he'll go for the dollars and they won't be in Denver.

[germ-x]

1 hour ago, AKRNA said:

I think it's important to remember that only 6 guys on the team, if healthy, play 100% of the snaps on either side of the LOS. That's the QB and the entire OL. I think teams are starting to realize that, given the size of the FA OL contracts this year.

I believe it's the start of a serious trend upwards in OL salaries. That's one of the reasons why I hope we try to extend Paradis this year if we'd like to keep him. If he hits FA he'll go for the dollars and they won't be in Denver.

I don’t think the rise is necessarily because of the fact that they play every snap.  I think it’s more to do with offensive lineman sucking.  So when a good/decent one hits the market it’s going to cost you.  Further, all positions are costing more because the salary cap keeps rising, it’s been doing this for a decade.

To be honest, the more the NFL moves to the spread and quick passing game (which has been the transition for quite a few years now) I see offensive lineman becoming less and less valuable.  The NFL follows the college game and the college game doesn’t require an elite OL to be successful.  All the talent is going to the defensive side of the ball to combat the spread, quick passing, and athletic QBs.  This transition will make an impact on the NFL.

[DiehardBronxFan]

It’s lying season, so no idea what is real and what is diversion at this point.  But I do have a thought that all of Elway’s public pronouncements that he’s open to trading down are trying to send the (misleading) signal that he’s not interested in QB.  Why?  Keep Buffalo from jumping him to 4.  I strongly believe Elway doesn’t want to have to spend the capital to move up, even to 4.  If he can sell others (Buffalo primarily) that he’s not taking a QB at 5, and is even open to trading out, then there is less (no) need for anyone to jump ahead of us to get their QB.  They can save a little, plan on trading with us or Indy or....

Then he snaps up Rosen at 5 and he gets his guy without having to trade up.

One possible interpretation, at least.