matt27j Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 Garrett. What an amazing prospect. His presence gives us some leeway in this draft. He's the face of the defense and then QB at #1 is the face of the offense. Strangely, I like the thought of a trade down where you still nab a WR, DB, OT. Would be even more comfortable with it if we sign Mathieu, Joyner, Butler or Trumaine Johnson. Idk it all doesn't seem to matter that much when you got Myles and a legit QB prospect. Get those two things and the rest is depth, coaching, and minimizing weak spots in the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 10 minutes ago, pnies20 said: I'm not setting the parameters. I'm going off of the players generally agreed upon as blue chip by the media/draft community. for example it was pretty much consensus that Eric berry was blue chip. Do you consider Derwin James and minkah Fitzpatrick on Eric berry's level? I don't. As strong safeties, yeah. Minkah moreso, but yes. Quote Julio Jones and AJ Green. Is Calvin Ridley on their level? No Julio was the 6th pick, same as Mingo and Winslow who you dismissed. Which is it? Quote Theoretically you could get one after 5 but which would drop? Best shot is Nelson I guess Tremaine Edmunds? Vita Vea? They both have elite measurables and the film to match. I could argue 3 qb’s being elite, 2 at a min, Barkley, Nelson, Chubb, Minkah, Edmunds, James and Vea. That’s 10 this year, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 Great post @LETSGOBROWNIES channeled your inner @Mind Character. i agree with your premise. For 4th overall if we have drafted Darnold then my 1a is Nelson 1b is Fitzpatrick based on your criteria and then 1c is Chubb and then 1d is Barkley. Oline have the longest careers and rbs and cbs the shortest. To me Nelson looks like GOAT version of Alex Mack and he was great player. I differ from you in that I think the running game is supremely important. Ideally you should be able to have an effective game plan running or passing centric or a balanced one of the two. I think you want multiple ways to win. Some games me a last year our passing game completely failed and we would of been better off Running 80% of the time. we need variety on offense. Qe need a qb, 1-2 running backs and better push from our interior line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnies20 Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 5 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: As strong safeties, yeah. Minkah moreso, but yes. Julio was the 6th pick, same as Mingo and Winslow who you dismissed. Which is it? Tremaine Edmunds? Vita Vea? They both have elite measurables and the film to match. I could argue 3 qb’s being elite, 2 at a min, Barkley, Nelson, Chubb, Minkah, Edmunds, James and Vea. That’s 10 this year, IMO. I just don't see a lot of those players at that elite level. Just a difference of opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 Just now, Kiwibrown said: I differ from you in that I think the running game is supremely important. Ideally you should be able to have an effective game plan running or passing centric or a balanced one of the two. I think you want multiple ways to win. I don’t disagree with that, I just don’t think you need a top 4 pick at RB to have an effective run game. The champs did it with a vet min FA. Just now, Kiwibrown said: Some games me a last year our passing game completely failed and we would of been better off Running 80% of the time. we need variety on offense. Agreed, but adding a RB doesn’t change the plays. Hell, I remember the BAL game in mid Dec where Crow had like 5 for 70 yards and Hue just stopped running him. 16 ypc and the coach has seen enough smh.... Just now, Kiwibrown said: Qe need a qb, 1-2 running backs and better push from our interior line. We need a RB, I’ve agreed this whole time, I just think a guy or two at the top of round 2 can provide something similar at far less of an investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 1 minute ago, pnies20 said: I just don't see a lot of those players at that elite level. Just a difference of opinion. That’s fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnies20 Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 3 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: That’s fair. Was editing and it refreshed somehow... i also didn't mean to say you can't get a blue chip prospect outside of pick 5. Ngata would be an example for me (Vea is not on Ngata's level for me just like minkah is not Berry) That's just the example I gave for where we picked those couple of years. 2010 Draft we missed out on Suh, McCoy, Trent Williams and Eric Berry and got Haden at 7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 1 minute ago, pnies20 said: Was editing and it refreshed somehow... i also didn't mean to say you can't get a blue chip prospect outside of pick 5. Ngata would be an example for me (Vea is not on Ngata's level for me just like minkah is not Berry) That's just the example I gave for where we picked those couple of years. 2010 Draft we missed out on Suh, McCoy, Trent Williams and Eric Berry and got Haden at 7. You might wanna go back and watch Vea some more, he’s a Ngata clone imo. He may not play a position of need for is, but he’s a damned monster. Minkah’s legit too. His played right away at the most talent rich program in the nation and put up fantastic numbers/tape. Overanalysis os killing him more than his actual weaknesses imo. As far as 2010, I wanted ET, which would have been just fine in hindsight. Another in the long line of right place, wrong player, for the Browns on draft day. We’ve picked higher on average than every other team in the league over the last 2 decades. We don’t suck from lack of opportunity. For example, that same year the Pats, who picked at the end of the rounds, managed to snag Devin McCourtey and Gronkowski in rounds 1 and 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnies20 Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 1 minute ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: You might wanna go back and watch Vea some more, he’s a Ngata clone imo. He may not play a position of need for is, but he’s a damned monster. Minkah’s legit too. His played right away at the most talent rich program in the nation and put up fantastic numbers/tape. Overanalysis os killing him more than his actual weaknesses imo. As far as 2010, I wanted ET, which would have been just fine in hindsight. Another in the long line of right place, wrong player, for the Browns on draft day. We’ve picked higher on average than every other team in the league over the last 2 decades. We don’t suck from lack of opportunity. For example, that same year the Pats, who picked at the end of the rounds, managed to snag Devin McCourtey and Gronkowski in rounds 1 and 2. Minkah is right on the border for me just like the other players you mentioned. Great players but when's the last time you saw a guard like Nelson? Not advocating taking him but the last great guard I can remember is Decastro and he's blows Decastro out of the water. Could probably play tackle at a high level. Barkley is head and shoulders above Fournette who was taken at 4 last year. These few guys at the top dont come along too often. When they do, odds are you don't get a shot at more than 1. Another thing were not taking into consideration is free agency. We're targeting a CB (Breeland, IMO), WR (Allen Robinson, Pryor), Safety (Mathieu if he comes available). What if we sign all those players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 9 minutes ago, pnies20 said: Another thing were not taking into consideration is free agency. We're targeting a CB (Breeland, IMO), WR (Allen Robinson, Pryor), Safety (Mathieu if he comes available). What if we sign all those players? We had damned well better sign the likes of them or better, trading lower picks if necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 3 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I don’t disagree with that, I just don’t think you need a top 4 pick at RB to have an effective run game. The champs did it with a vet min FA. Agreed, but adding a RB doesn’t change the plays. Hell, I remember the BAL game in mid Dec where Crow had like 5 for 70 yards and Hue just stopped running him. 16 ypc and the coach has seen enough smh.... We need a RB, I’ve agreed this whole time, I just think a guy or two at the top of round 2 can provide something similar at far less of an investment. A broader view of success should be taken than to just comparing our team to the eagles. If you think that Barkley is Faulk or LT you can take hi a t 4 for reasonable value. If he is less than that it is not wise to take him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cattleman78 Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 I remember watching Jim Brown, Leroy Kelly, Mike and Greg Pruitt, Eric Metcalf, Kevin Mack and Ermest Byner. We had teams back than. Not saying we should draft Barkley just food for thought. Those were fun days. I miss them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 8 hours ago, bruceb said: Good reasoning but bad result. It is all about value. I think we will have several trade-down alternatives that will gain us draft pick (or in the case of ARZ maybe player, too) value that dwarfs the value of picking any single player at #4. The above scenario was if we picked at #4 without a trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted March 6, 2018 Author Share Posted March 6, 2018 3 hours ago, Kiwibrown said: A broader view of success should be taken than to just comparing our team to the eagles. I’m not. Use any super bowl winner in the last decade, none of them drafted a RB high except the Saints (Bush) and I don’t think anyone would consider him a success. 3 hours ago, Kiwibrown said: If you think that Barkley is Faulk or LT you can take hi a t 4 for reasonable value. If he is less than that it is not wise to take him. Every team who drafts a player high views them as some version of a great player they’ve seen previously. Doesn’t mean they all work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 8 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I’m not. Use any super bowl winner in the last decade, none of them drafted a RB high except the Saints (Bush) and I don’t think anyone would consider him a success. Every team who drafts a player high views them as some version of a great player they’ve seen previously. Doesn’t mean they all work out. The goal should t be to win the Super Bowl. It to be a very good football team that will have a high chance of success each year over the next 5 years. That is why we draft a qb at 1. You can be an excellent team with a great rb. The chargers go to the super bowl and probably win led by LT if there db doesn’t fumble an int v the past a in the afc championship game. The rams and the Seahawks both have had a lot of success recently with a top tier rb. I am not saying to it I just think there is some evidence that a weapon at rb is valuable. at the moment I would prefer other options, Nelson, Fitzpatrick, maybe even Chubb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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