Jets trade up to 3

[GangGreen420]

22 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Nope.  I'll take my chances on Rosen making it to 3.

Yeah this is the ideal scenario for me.

Im just very curious as to who Mac wanted at 1 and what the Browns wanted in exchange. 

[GangGreen420]

23 minutes ago, barnaby8787 said:

Really interesting note from Manish, I guess some have compared Rosen's attitude to Cutler's.  Bates' clearly had no issue getting the most out of Cutler.

That was very early in Cutlers career right? I wanted Jay Cutler bad when the Broncos were trading him. Then we got Sanchez. Sort of funny how we missed out on the big FA and end up drafting a QB very early instead, like we did that year.

I don’t mind the cocky attitude at all (same with Mayfield) many of the top QBs have it, it could even be a positive. As long as he is entirely dedicated to the game and holds himself accountable when he should I’m not too worried about it. The locker room will still follow him. My only concern with Rosen is the concussions/rich family thing. 

[barnaby8787]

55 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

That was very early in Cutlers career right? I wanted Jay Cutler bad when the Broncos were trading him. Then we got Sanchez. Sort of funny how we missed out on the big FA and end up drafting a QB very early instead, like we did that year.

I don’t mind the cocky attitude at all (same with Mayfield) many of the top QBs have it, it could even be a positive. As long as he is entirely dedicated to the game and holds himself accountable when he should I’m not too worried about it. The locker room will still follow him. My only concern with Rosen is the concussions/rich family thing. 

He worked with him twice.  In Denver and Chicago.  In Denver, early on.  In Chicago in 2012.  

[SDotNova]

49 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

That was very early in Cutlers career right? I wanted Jay Cutler bad when the Broncos were trading him. Then we got Sanchez. Sort of funny how we missed out on the big FA and end up drafting a QB very early instead, like we did that year.

I don’t mind the cocky attitude at all (same with Mayfield) many of the top QBs have it, it could even be a positive. As long as he is entirely dedicated to the game and holds himself accountable when he should I’m not too worried about it. The locker room will still follow him. My only concern with Rosen is the concussions/rich family thing. 

The concussion issues are definitely a concern. Guys have retired early because of repeated head injuries.

The rich family thing. ehh. That red flag is way overblown. Most starting QB's have generational wealth and they still keep putting in the hours. As long as the kid loves the game, and we don't have any reason to believe he doesn't, he should be fine. He asks the why. You don't put in that effort unless you truly want to understand the game.

[GangGreen420]

23 minutes ago, SDotNova said:

The concussion issues are definitely a concern. Guys have retired early because of repeated head injuries.

The rich family thing. ehh. That red flag is way overblown. Most starting QB's have generational wealth and they still keep putting in the hours. As long as the kid loves the game, and we don't have any reason to believe he doesn't, he should be fine. He asks the why. You don't put in that effort unless you truly want to understand the game.

Oh definitely. I meant it in the sense that if he were to get another concussion he could be more heavily influenced by his family to be cautious since they are well off/in the medical field. Other than the head injuries I have no worries with Rosen.  I want a cocky/intelligent QB.

[SDotNova]

1 minute ago, GangGreen420 said:

Oh definitely. I meant it in the sense that if he were to get another concussion he could be more heavily influenced by his family to be cautious since they are well off/in the medical field. Other than the head injuries I have no worries with Rosen.  I want a cocky/intelligent QB.

Oh definitely. I agree with you and, you're right, his family could influence him to move on from the sport if he gets more concussions. Hopefully for him, it's not an issue in the NFL. He'd be great in NY. Playing second fiddle in LA to the bigger program of USC mirrors what the Jets are to the Giants. So, he's dealt with a big media and he has dealt with playing for the second franchise in his market. 

[Bobby816]

I don’t worry about Rosen’s attitude or anything from that point of view. Very Aaron Rodgers like more so than Cutler. His injuries are my only question with him.  

[KBS756]

52 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I don’t worry about Rosen’s attitude or anything from that point of view. Very Aaron Rodgers like more so than Cutler. His injuries are my only question with him.  

Injuries are a major one with him since his last concussion had him miss a month.

Also major negative i have for him is he doesnt seem to create plays outside of the offense when plays break down that often (as he doesnt have even avg movement skills) ... and will probably only be worse at it at the next level. (Im talking pocket forces him to run pressure up the middle) ... Him and Allen actually both step up and deliver well.

[Bobby816]

21 minutes ago, KBS756 said:

Injuries are a major one with him since his last concussion had him miss a month.

Also major negative i have for him is he doesnt seem to create plays outside of the offense when plays break down that often (as he doesnt have even avg movement skills) ... and will probably only be worse at it at the next level. (Im talking pocket forces him to run pressure up the middle) ... Him and Allen actually both step up and deliver well.

I don't agree with this. His combine speed and agility numbers are pretty comparable to that of Mayfield for example. While I say his injuries are my only real issue with him for me... I don't find it as a major issue for a pocket QB. The NFL protects these QBs so much that they aren't getting hit incredibly hard as often anymore. Its the guys running around that are taking the shots. While we don't see Rosen improvise as often as the others... he shows good pocket awareness and isn't scared to stand in the pocket and take a hit to get the ball out.

[doumeyer]

10 hours ago, GangGreen420 said:

Oh definitely. I meant it in the sense that if he were to get another concussion he could be more heavily influenced by his family to be cautious since they are well off/in the medical field. Other than the head injuries I have no worries with Rosen.  I want a cocky/intelligent QB.

Joe Namath was a cocky guy, and that sure work for us. This concussion thing is a problem for all players not just Rosen, look at Gronk.

[KingOfNewYork]

12 hours ago, KBS756 said:

Injuries are a major one with him since his last concussion had him miss a month.

Also major negative i have for him is he doesnt seem to create plays outside of the offense when plays break down that often (as he doesnt have even avg movement skills) ... and will probably only be worse at it at the next level. (Im talking pocket forces him to run pressure up the middle) ... Him and Allen actually both step up and deliver well.

Honestly I think if you have a concussion you should miss a month minimum. I've had two and it takes a while to just feel normal in a sense so I'm happy he took that much time off.

[rdelaney89]

13 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

I don't agree with this. His combine speed and agility numbers are pretty comparable to that of Mayfield for example. While I say his injuries are my only real issue with him for me... I don't find it as a major issue for a pocket QB. The NFL protects these QBs so much that they aren't getting hit incredibly hard as often anymore. Its the guys running around that are taking the shots. While we don't see Rosen improvise as often as the others... he shows good pocket awareness and isn't scared to stand in the pocket and take a hit to get the ball out.

Haven't been here in almost a month haha time to brush off the cobwebs 

I like Rosen I think he will be fine at the next level but IMO it is a mistake to look at the combine to compare the play styles of Mayfield and Rosen. Mayfield absolutely had the better OL but it's clear as day he is very good at improvising while completing passes under pressure, he still has a 111 passer rating while being rushed. Rosen is a statue in the pocket, he doesn't have to leave the pocket because he is very good at sliding around and he'll deliver a ball while a defender is targeting him. I don't think Rosen is remotely mobile regardless of what his combine metrics say, I can watch the tape and see the same lumbering escapability that Brady and both Mannings have shown over their careers. That is not an indictment on Rosen because clearly that play style has worked in the NFL. 

[Bobby816]

1 hour ago, rdelaney89 said:

Haven't been here in almost a month haha time to brush off the cobwebs 

I like Rosen I think he will be fine at the next level but IMO it is a mistake to look at the combine to compare the play styles of Mayfield and Rosen. Mayfield absolutely had the better OL but it's clear as day he is very good at improvising while completing passes under pressure, he still has a 111 passer rating while being rushed. Rosen is a statue in the pocket, he doesn't have to leave the pocket because he is very good at sliding around and he'll deliver a ball while a defender is targeting him. I don't think Rosen is remotely mobile regardless of what his combine metrics say, I can watch the tape and see the same lumbering escapability that Brady and both Mannings have shown over their careers. That is not an indictment on Rosen because clearly that play style has worked in the NFL. 

I generally agree with you. But OUs style of offense allowed a more open concept for mayfield to move rather than Rosen’s. I’m not at all saying Rosen is athletic at Mayfield. I actually think both are very average in athleticism. I’m pointing out that just bc Rosen didn’t move as much as Mayfield, doesn’t mean he can’t. And a big thing that should be noted about this is how much of Mayfields success cane on the run last year? I point that out bc he won’t be able to move like that in the nfl to create throwing windows (especially being a shorter QB). I’d be more worried about that than Rosen’s athletic ability.

[Rockice_8]

16 hours ago, GangGreen420 said:

Oh definitely. I meant it in the sense that if he were to get another concussion he could be more heavily influenced by his family to be cautious since they are well off/in the medical field. Other than the head injuries I have no worries with Rosen.  I want a cocky/intelligent QB.

So you want Mayfield then 

[barnaby8787]

4 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I generally agree with you. But OUs style of offense allowed a more open concept for mayfield to move rather than Rosen’s. I’m not at all saying Rosen is athletic at Mayfield. I actually think both are very average in athleticism. I’m pointing out that just bc Rosen didn’t move as much as Mayfield, doesn’t mean he can’t. And a big thing that should be noted about this is how much of Mayfields success cane on the run last year? I point that out bc he won’t be able to move like that in the nfl to create throwing windows (especially being a shorter QB). I’d be more worried about that than Rosen’s athletic ability.

One common myth about Mayfield is that he didn't throw from the pocket in college.  He threw plenty out of the pocket.  With that said, if we do end up with him, Bates has to be creative to create lanes for him similar to what the Seahawks does for Wilson.