Behold Da Bearz!

[wcblack34]

I'd like to see a legislature pass a bill that no state funds will be used for a professional sports team's stadium if that team has not competed in its league's championship in the twenty years prior to the request. Sure, that screws Minnesota sports teams...but also provides some incentive for them to go win something (or just for them to leave for another city...but don't rain on my picnic).

[vike daddy]

Bears receiver D.J. Moore has agreed to a four-year extension. It has a base value of $110 million with $82.6 million guaranteed, according to Ian Rapoport of NFL Media.

That’s a new-money average of $27.5 million.

Moore had two years left on his prior contract. He was due to make $15.85 million in 2024 and $14.85 million in 2025. He’s now under contract for six years at $130.35 million. It’s an average from signing of $21.725 million.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/bears-extend-d-j-moore-for-four-years

[SteelKing728]

That looks like a good deal for Chicago!

[vike daddy]

Velus Jones has had limited impact at wide receiver since the Bears took him in the third round of the 2022 draft, so they are looking at a new way of using him in hopes of getting more production.

Jones has been practicing with the team’s running backs at training camp this week. Head coach Matt Eberflus said offensive coordinator Shane Waldron and his staff have been looking at ways to “maximize our talents” and that Jones has been receptive to the chance to try out a new role.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/bears-looking-at-velus-jones-as-a-running-back

[SteelKing728]

Jones has had success in the NFL. Against the Vikings lol

[vike daddy]

The grass at Soldier Field is facing some scrutiny this morning ahead of the Bengals-Bears preseason game that is scheduled to kick off at noon local time.

Bears General Manager Ryan Poles and assistant GM Ian Cunningham have been on the field before the game, looking at the turf and inspecting different areas in what is more than a standard pregame routine, according to Brad Biggs of the Chicago Tribune. Biggs reports that the field is “not in tip-top shape.” There has been some light rain in Chicago this morning, and more could be coming during the game.

Kaitlin Sharkey of WGN posted pictures of the grass, which appears to have been re-sodded since a Metallica concert at Soldier Field last week.

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/soldier-field-grass-scrutinized-ahead-of-todays-bengals-bears-preseason-game

 

@VikeManDan see? that band just causes problems. or their fans do.... lol

[Ozzy]

The Bears could have a great year even with the loaded NFC North.  They have the best defensive backfield in the division by far the best linebacker core as well and the best wide receiver core also in the division.  Could argue they have the best/deepest DB core in the NFL, only other one in comparison would be the Cleveland Browns.

 

Rome Odunze could kill it as a 3rd WR for them and Swift could have a big year at RB and Herbert could have a great year also not to mention Johnson who is a beast.  Caleb Williams was the right choice for them and in terms of pure arm talent there is no QB better off platform and that is including Jordan Love who has some very high level arm talent.

They have an extremely solid football team and could easily finish 2nd in the Division and be real close to being 1st if everything goes right.  

 

 

[CWood21]

3 hours ago, Ozzy said:

The Bears could have a great year even with the loaded NFC North.  They have the best defensive backfield in the division by far the best linebacker core as well and the best wide receiver core also in the division.  Could argue they have the best/deepest DB core in the NFL, only other one in comparison would be the Cleveland Browns.

I definitely do not share your optimism with regards to the Bears.  They'll be much improved for sure.  But I don't think they're a very scary team unless Caleb Williams plays better than most rookie QBs do.

[Ozzy]

15 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I definitely do not share your optimism with regards to the Bears.  They'll be much improved for sure.  But I don't think they're a very scary team unless Caleb Williams plays better than most rookie QBs do.

With the three headed monster they have potentially at RB with Swift/Herbert/Johnson and WR Moore/Allen/Odunze and TE Kmet, Everett and Carlson/Sweeney, then Wright at RT and Braxton Jones at LT.  Yeah he will do quite well and should easily win rookie of the year if he stays healthy all season.  Only real question is center honestly, because defensively they are rock solid and backup pass rushers in Booker and Hardy have looked great in the preseason.  Bears are going to have a fine season and will compete with every team in the NFC North no question about it.

[CWood21]

19 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

With the three headed monster they have potentially at RB with Swift/Herbert/Johnson and WR Moore/Allen/Odunze and TE Kmet, Everett and Carlson/Sweeney, then Wright at RT and Braxton Jones at LT.  Yeah he will do quite well and should easily win rookie of the year if he stays healthy all season.  Only real question is center honestly, because defensively they are rock solid and backup pass rushers in Booker and Hardy have looked great in the preseason.  Bears are going to have a fine season and will compete with every team in the NFC North no question about it.

I don't like their RB room at all.  Honestly, I think the signing of Swift was a move that they probably should have avoided.  Honestly, I probably would have rolled with Herbert/Johnson/draft pick and spent that money elsewhere.  Swift seems like a strong candidate to regress.  Their WR room look tremendously talented, but it feels like Keenan Allen's health might be the determining factor.  But like I mentioned in the draft thread, there's only so many targets to go around.  DJ Moore last year was 16th in targets at 136 and Keenan Allen had at least 140 targets in the 4 of the last 5 seasons he played in 13+ games.  Cole Kmet hit 90 targets 2 of the last 3 seasons.  Sam Howell led the league with 612 passing attempts last year.  From a pure numbers' standpoint, the 3 mentioned earlier would count for nearly 60% of Howell's passing attempts.  Josh Downs finished 5th in receptions last year, and he got 98 targets as a rookie.  Add him and that accounts to almost 76% of the passing attempts.  If the Bears are a more middle-of-the-pack passing team (say Bryce Young attempt), that's 88% of the targets accounted for that year.  Someone's going to be on the outside looking in with regards to targets.  I could be wrong, but I believe Washington, Jacksonville, and Houston were the only team with 4 players with 70+ targets.  One was the most pass-happy friendly offense and one was led by arguably the best rookie QB season ever.  Someone isn't going to be happy about their production.  My guess is DJ Moore's targets are around 115, Keenan Allen's drops drastically, and Cole Kmet takes a dip.

I definitely wouldn't have glossed over that OL like you did.  Braxton Jones is a serviceable LT, but he'll need to clean up the penalties.  I've got high hopes for Darnell Wright, but he needs to clean up his play from last year.  He was credited for allowing 7 sacks and giving up 11 penalties.  Hopefully, he takes a 2nd year jump for Caleb Williams.  I've been pretty vocal that Teven Jenkins is exactly who he was when he came out of Oklahoma State, a good but not great guard.  Feels like Nate Davis and Jon Runyan were similar caliber players, and Green Bay isn't losing any sleep over losing him.  I know there was hope about Ryan Bates, but I feel like it's a ton of optimism there for no real reason.

Defensively, if I had more faith in their front four I'd probably agree with you.  But unless Montez Sweat makes a jump or DeMarcus Walker plays like he does in 2022 then I don't think there's enough pass rush there.  Because we know it isn't coming from Andrew Billings.  Gervon Dexter is the wild card.  If he can make a Y2 jump as an interior pass rusher, that'll open up things tremendously.  Austin Booker, who we're both high on, is 3rd on their depth chart.  Probably not a big producer Y1.  Linebacker group as a whole looks fine.  I don't think that's it going to be a corp that makes a huge impact, but I also don't think it'll be a liability either.  The secondary we're going to very much disagree on.  Byard is yet another year removed from his All Pro year, and he only secured a 2 year, $15M contract.  He's not an elite safety any more.  He signed for similar AAV as Darnell Savage, and we know Savage's career has been more and up and down than a roller coaster.  I like Brisker, and I think having a competent safety next to him will help his game play up.  Jaylon Johnson is obviously a stud, but the rest of that CB group is a mess.  Tyrique Stevenson was used and abused last year giving up the 2nd most amount of receptions, 2nd in receiving yards allowed, and the most targets.  I'd like to say I'm more optimistic about Kyler Gordon, but he had his issues last year too.

[Ozzy]

41 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I don't like their RB room at all.  Honestly, I think the signing of Swift was a move that they probably should have avoided.  Honestly, I probably would have rolled with Herbert/Johnson/draft pick and spent that money elsewhere.  Swift seems like a strong candidate to regress.  Their WR room look tremendously talented, but it feels like Keenan Allen's health might be the determining factor.  But like I mentioned in the draft thread, there's only so many targets to go around.  DJ Moore last year was 16th in targets at 136 and Keenan Allen had at least 140 targets in the 4 of the last 5 seasons he played in 13+ games.  Cole Kmet hit 90 targets 2 of the last 3 seasons.  Sam Howell led the league with 612 passing attempts last year.  From a pure numbers' standpoint, the 3 mentioned earlier would count for nearly 60% of Howell's passing attempts.  Josh Downs finished 5th in receptions last year, and he got 98 targets as a rookie.  Add him and that accounts to almost 76% of the passing attempts.  If the Bears are a more middle-of-the-pack passing team (say Bryce Young attempt), that's 88% of the targets accounted for that year.  Someone's going to be on the outside looking in with regards to targets.  I could be wrong, but I believe Washington, Jacksonville, and Houston were the only team with 4 players with 70+ targets.  One was the most pass-happy friendly offense and one was led by arguably the best rookie QB season ever.  Someone isn't going to be happy about their production.  My guess is DJ Moore's targets are around 115, Keenan Allen's drops drastically, and Cole Kmet takes a dip.

I definitely wouldn't have glossed over that OL like you did.  Braxton Jones is a serviceable LT, but he'll need to clean up the penalties.  I've got high hopes for Darnell Wright, but he needs to clean up his play from last year.  He was credited for allowing 7 sacks and giving up 11 penalties.  Hopefully, he takes a 2nd year jump for Caleb Williams.  I've been pretty vocal that Teven Jenkins is exactly who he was when he came out of Oklahoma State, a good but not great guard.  Feels like Nate Davis and Jon Runyan were similar caliber players, and Green Bay isn't losing any sleep over losing him.  I know there was hope about Ryan Bates, but I feel like it's a ton of optimism there for no real reason.

Defensively, if I had more faith in their front four I'd probably agree with you.  But unless Montez Sweat makes a jump or DeMarcus Walker plays like he does in 2022 then I don't think there's enough pass rush there.  Because we know it isn't coming from Andrew Billings.  Gervon Dexter is the wild card.  If he can make a Y2 jump as an interior pass rusher, that'll open up things tremendously.  Austin Booker, who we're both high on, is 3rd on their depth chart.  Probably not a big producer Y1.  Linebacker group as a whole looks fine.  I don't think that's it going to be a corp that makes a huge impact, but I also don't think it'll be a liability either.  The secondary we're going to very much disagree on.  Byard is yet another year removed from his All Pro year, and he only secured a 2 year, $15M contract.  He's not an elite safety any more.  He signed for similar AAV as Darnell Savage, and we know Savage's career has been more and up and down than a roller coaster.  I like Brisker, and I think having a competent safety next to him will help his game play up.  Jaylon Johnson is obviously a stud, but the rest of that CB group is a mess.  Tyrique Stevenson was used and abused last year giving up the 2nd most amount of receptions, 2nd in receiving yards allowed, and the most targets.  I'd like to say I'm more optimistic about Kyler Gordon, but he had his issues last year too.

You are nuts to think Kyler Gordon is not a potential star at nickel CB.  He is great on the blitz, awesome open field tackler, big and has ball skills.  He is one of the best slot corners in the NFL and will be even better this season.  Terell Smith is not even worth a mention, sure say Stevenson is bad which I do not think he is, they have Smith who showed great potential last year at CB when other guys got hurt.  Smith as a 4th CB on a roster potentially, argue no team including the Browns have a 4th CB as talented as Terell Smith.  Stevenson I like his ability to tackle and he is solid, not a player who can be just ripped apart game in and game out.  

Sure Byard is not what he once was but is better than Eddie Jackson was last year and provides veteran leadership at the position.  Hicks as a backup his promising and Owen is not awful either in a backup role.  Brisker is legit I feel and will be even better this year.  

LBs are more than fine with Amen Ogbongbemiga as a backup and Baskerville as a backup and Noah Sewell as a backup.  Yeah they are clearly the best LB core in general in the NFL assuming Edmunds and Edwards can stay healthy.  

You underrate Dominque Robinson, Austin Booker and Daniel Hardy.  Sure outside of Sweat who is on the edge but one if not two of those three will breakout this year and be a legit rotation player that will produce.  Walker sure is not great but he is tough against the run and a physical force on the edge.  Dexter is promising at DT but needs to improve, Pickens is not awful and Cowart is a decent backup, also have Randolph from Illinois who has potential I feel. 

 

With the juice Caleb Williams has brought to that franchise they will be beyond solid this year and will compete with everyone they go up against unless there are major injuries.    Wright will be greatly improved, Jones I feel is better than just average at LT, they also have solid depth across the board if the starters do not workout.  Yes center is an issue but Nate Davis if healthy is not a problem and Teven Jenkins is not as bad as you say he is.  They were the 2nd best rushing team in the NFL last year with all these awful interior OL outside of the center last year, they are not that bad but sure need to gel a bit as a group.

The WR weapons are not even worth a conversation on targets, can DJ Moore play, yes, can Keenan Allen play, yes, can Cole Kmet play, yes...  Who cares if their numbers will not be the same as before, and Tyler Scott shows some big time jets for big plays and Rome Odunze should be great and be hell to cover if Moore and Allen get all of the attention.  

Did they overpay for Swift, maybe but who cares, he is coming off a career year, is super quick and provides something Johnson and Herbert do not in the passing game.  Either way say Swift is awful it does not matter with those other two backs on the roster.  They are loaded in terms of weapons and Caleb Williams will get them the football.

 

It is going to be hell to be in the NFC North and the Bears to me no question will compete with any team in that division and any team really in the NFC.  Maybe there will be some growing pains but honestly 10-6 is not out of the question for them.  Out of their first 9 games I would favor the Bears in 6 or 7 of them, so they should do just fine.  

[CWood21]

43 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

You are nuts to think Kyler Gordon is not a potential star at nickel CB.  He is great on the blitz, awesome open field tackler, big and has ball skills.  He is one of the best slot corners in the NFL and will be even better this season.  Terell Smith is not even worth a mention, sure say Stevenson is bad which I do not think he is, they have Smith who showed great potential last year at CB when other guys got hurt.  Smith as a 4th CB on a roster potentially, argue no team including the Browns have a 4th CB as talented as Terell Smith.  Stevenson I like his ability to tackle and he is solid, not a player who can be just ripped apart game in and game out.  

Potential?  Sure.  Does potential always turn into production?  Nope.  PFR credited him with allowing a CMP% of 77.0% and gave up 2 passing TDs.  For comparison, Keisean Nixon was credited with 77.8% CMP% and allowed 3 passing TD.  But Packers' fans are pretty content improving upon him.  IF you want to credit Stevenson for being good please do without mentioning his draft status.  Because as of now, he's a poor man's Trevon Diggs.  You're overlooking the completions and yards allowed because he forces interceptions.  Terrell Smith is nice, but that's CB4.  But that's a 5th round pick who played reasonably well his rookie year.

 

59 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

Sure Byard is not what he once was but is better than Eddie Jackson was last year and provides veteran leadership at the position.  Hicks as a backup his promising and Owen is not awful either in a backup role.  Brisker is legit I feel and will be even better this year.  

That's not saying much.  Eddie Jackson was grossly overrated.  And if he's even a solid piece at safety, the Bears will be fine at the safety position.  Honestly, I thought Brisker got a bit exposed by Eddie Jackson's issues.  Elijah Hicks was a 7th round pick from 2 years ago, and he's played 200 more snaps on defense than special teams.  He's a replaceable-level safety.  And I'm not sure that anyone can say that Owens is "not awful".  He's brutal.  In fact, that might be generous.  He was miserable.  There's a reason why the Packers overhauled their safety room.  And it's not because Owens was "not awful".  It's because he was pretty much awful.

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

LBs are more than fine with Amen Ogbongbemiga as a backup and Baskerville as a backup and Noah Sewell as a backup.  Yeah they are clearly the best LB core in general in the NFL assuming Edmunds and Edwards can stay healthy.  

Best LB core?  If you want to say so, I don't see it.

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

You underrate Dominque Robinson, Austin Booker and Daniel Hardy.  Sure outside of Sweat who is on the edge but one if not two of those three will breakout this year and be a legit rotation player that will produce.  Walker sure is not great but he is tough against the run and a physical force on the edge.  Dexter is promising at DT but needs to improve, Pickens is not awful and Cowart is a decent backup, also have Randolph from Illinois who has potential I feel. 

I'm definitely not underrating Robinson, Booker, and Hardy.  There's a reason why the Bears felt the need to offer up a 3rd round pick to New England for Matt Judon.  And it's not because Judon is some amazing player.  It's because they felt the room needed to be improved.  Robinson is a nice backup pass rusher, but he's a backup for a reason.  I liked Booker coming out of, but he's going to be an issue as a rookie.  He's going to struggle in the run game, and he's probably a year away from being a legitimate rotational player.  Daniel Hardy is a nobody.  He played for the Rams in 2022 and didn't play in 2023.  He spent the entire year on the PS I believe.  He's a nobody.  You're literally trying to praise fringe roster guys.  You could do that about anyone.

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

With the juice Caleb Williams has brought to that franchise they will be beyond solid this year and will compete with everyone they go up against unless there are major injuries.    Wright will be greatly improved, Jones I feel is better than just average at LT, they also have solid depth across the board if the starters do not workout.  Yes center is an issue but Nate Davis if healthy is not a problem and Teven Jenkins is not as bad as you say he is.  They were the 2nd best rushing team in the NFL last year with all these awful interior OL outside of the center last year, they are not that bad but sure need to gel a bit as a group.

The Bears were the 2nd best rushing team because of Justin Fields.  They were 2nd in rushing yards with Justin Fields.  If you replace him with say something akin to Jordan Love, they'd drop to 14th in rushing yards.  They're an average to slightly above-average rushing team.  Teven Jenkins isn't good.  He's a replaceable level OG.  No different than Nate Davis and Jon Runyan.  Probably going to get overpaid once they hit FA, but not enough to justify spending big on them.

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

The WR weapons are not even worth a conversation on targets, can DJ Moore play, yes, can Keenan Allen play, yes, can Cole Kmet play, yes...  Who cares if their numbers will not be the same as before, and Tyler Scott shows some big time jets for big plays and Rome Odunze should be great and be hell to cover if Moore and Allen get all of the attention.  

At some point, someone's going to complain about touches.  Probably won't be Odunze, but someone's production is gonna dip especially if Swift is able to stay healthy and productive.  It's a good problem to have, but expecting all their production to stay in line with their career averages.

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

It is going to be hell to be in the NFC North and the Bears to me no question will compete with any team in that division and any team really in the NFC.  Maybe there will be some growing pains but honestly 10-6 is not out of the question for them.  Out of their first 9 games I would favor the Bears in 6 or 7 of them, so they should do just fine.  

The Bears will absolutely be competitive.  I don't think anyone thinks they won't unless you're convinced that Caleb Williams is going to fall on his face.  The problem is outside of their receiving corps, there's nothing on that roster that really excites me.  I clearly don't buy into their defensive players, but maybe Eberflus can be the guy that puts those pieces as better as the sum of the players.  I think 7 to 9 wins is a reasonable expectation for them.

[Ozzy]

10 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Potential?  Sure.  Does potential always turn into production?  Nope.  PFR credited him with allowing a CMP% of 77.0% and gave up 2 passing TDs.  For comparison, Keisean Nixon was credited with 77.8% CMP% and allowed 3 passing TD.  But Packers' fans are pretty content improving upon him.  IF you want to credit Stevenson for being good please do without mentioning his draft status.  Because as of now, he's a poor man's Trevon Diggs.  You're overlooking the completions and yards allowed because he forces interceptions.  Terrell Smith is nice, but that's CB4.  But that's a 5th round pick who played reasonably well his rookie year.

 

That's not saying much.  Eddie Jackson was grossly overrated.  And if he's even a solid piece at safety, the Bears will be fine at the safety position.  Honestly, I thought Brisker got a bit exposed by Eddie Jackson's issues.  Elijah Hicks was a 7th round pick from 2 years ago, and he's played 200 more snaps on defense than special teams.  He's a replaceable-level safety.  And I'm not sure that anyone can say that Owens is "not awful".  He's brutal.  In fact, that might be generous.  He was miserable.  There's a reason why the Packers overhauled their safety room.  And it's not because Owens was "not awful".  It's because he was pretty much awful.

Best LB core?  If you want to say so, I don't see it.

I'm definitely not underrating Robinson, Booker, and Hardy.  There's a reason why the Bears felt the need to offer up a 3rd round pick to New England for Matt Judon.  And it's not because Judon is some amazing player.  It's because they felt the room needed to be improved.  Robinson is a nice backup pass rusher, but he's a backup for a reason.  I liked Booker coming out of, but he's going to be an issue as a rookie.  He's going to struggle in the run game, and he's probably a year away from being a legitimate rotational player.  Daniel Hardy is a nobody.  He played for the Rams in 2022 and didn't play in 2023.  He spent the entire year on the PS I believe.  He's a nobody.  You're literally trying to praise fringe roster guys.  You could do that about anyone.

The Bears were the 2nd best rushing team because of Justin Fields.  They were 2nd in rushing yards with Justin Fields.  If you replace him with say something akin to Jordan Love, they'd drop to 14th in rushing yards.  They're an average to slightly above-average rushing team.  Teven Jenkins isn't good.  He's a replaceable level OG.  No different than Nate Davis and Jon Runyan.  Probably going to get overpaid once they hit FA, but not enough to justify spending big on them.

At some point, someone's going to complain about touches.  Probably won't be Odunze, but someone's production is gonna dip especially if Swift is able to stay healthy and productive.  It's a good problem to have, but expecting all their production to stay in line with their career averages.

The Bears will absolutely be competitive.  I don't think anyone thinks they won't unless you're convinced that Caleb Williams is going to fall on his face.  The problem is outside of their receiving corps, there's nothing on that roster that really excites me.  I clearly don't buy into their defensive players, but maybe Eberflus can be the guy that puts those pieces as better as the sum of the players.  I think 7 to 9 wins is a reasonable expectation for them.

You basically sound like a Packer fan hoping the Bears suck and the Packers continue to dominate them like they have for years.  Sure the Bears have not beat the Packers since 2018, that is about the change and will probably change this year.  

 

I am not going to sit and pretend a massive QB upgrade like Caleb Williams is not going to improve every part of that organization and motivate the players in having a chance because they have a special QB.

 

I loved the Bears secondary last year and like them even more this year.  They were also the #1 run D in the NFL last year because their LB core sucked or their DL was awful?  No not really, and it should be better this year.  If they figure out that IOL especially C and are able to stay healthy they will be a force and will win far more than 7 freaking games.  

 

As for the Bears run game last year, Fields was apart of it but he only had 675 yards rushing, not like he ran for 1500 yards or something and no other Bear rusher had over 700 yards rushing, so it was a collective group thing which shows collective dominance on the OL.  You do not gain yards a luck in the NFL and sure they need to improve as a group but they are not nearly as bad as you say they are.  Oh and Caleb Williams is not this statue that will provide nothing in the run game either, he will be a factor in that also and Swift will be great as a pass catcher out of the backfield.

 

Wish all you want, Bears are very legit as a football team.  But like any team it matters if a majority of the top players can stay healthy.    Only negative is that they are in the NFC North and the Packers and Lions are two of the best rosters in the NFL as well.  Still with that start to the year, Bears should do very well because outside of the LA Rams and Houston Texans they do not play any great teams and maybe can throw in Jacksonville in that mix.  So again that is a 6-3 record and pretty sure some confidence will come from that.  Compare that to the Packers who play Detroit, Houston, Jacksonville, LA Rams and the Eagles in their first 9 games.  

 

Who would I be more afraid to go up against, the Bears with their RB/WR/TE groups or the Packers.  Yeah it would be the Bears no question about it.  Packers have a better OL though and a better DL but LB clear Bears and secondary I say Bears over the Packers unless Bullard and McKinney are out of their mind at safety which could happen.  They need Cooper to be a super star at LB though and Bears already have two in Edmunds and Edwards.  We will see what actually happens.  

 

 

[CWood21]

5 hours ago, Ozzy said:

You basically sound like a Packer fan hoping the Bears suck and the Packers continue to dominate them like they have for years.  Sure the Bears have not beat the Packers since 2018, that is about the change and will probably change this year.  

As I've already said, I think they're going to be competitive.  I don't think they're going to be great, but they're not going to be the pushover they've been in year's past.  Last year, they finished 7-10 and largely a byproduct of a meh schedule.  Of all the teams in the playoffs mix, only New Orleans had a worse SOV.  Only teams in the NFL that had a lower SOV than Chicago was New Orleans, Washington and NY Giants.  Chicago went 6-6 inside the conference and 2-4 against the division.  They'll need to do better in divisional games if they want any chance of pushing for a playoff spot.  LIS, I think they're somewhere in that 7 to 9 win range more if Caleb Williams plays better than most rookie QBs do.  For Green Bay, if they go 4-2 in the division or better, I'd consider it a smashing success.  Green Bay hasn't swept Minnesota since 2019, so if they can split Detroit and Chicago and sweep Minnesota they can there.  Think 3-3 is more realistic.  If they go 2-4, they're probably not pushing for a playoff spot IMO.

5 hours ago, Ozzy said:

I am not going to sit and pretend a massive QB upgrade like Caleb Williams is not going to improve every part of that organization and motivate the players in having a chance because they have a special QB.

Let me guess, you're smelling off that CJ Stroud hype right?  CJ Stroud is coming off arguably the best rookie QB season ever.  I might be wrong, but I believe prior to CJ Stroud the last team to take a non-playoff team to the playoffs as a rookie was Andrew Luck and that season they won a ridiculous amount of close games.  They were a whopping +8 in close wins/losses.  LIS, if Caleb Williams is even in the same breath of CJ Stroud in his rookie season the Bears will be a playoff team for sure.

5 hours ago, Ozzy said:

I loved the Bears secondary last year and like them even more this year.  They were also the #1 run D in the NFL last year because their LB core sucked or their DL was awful?  No not really, and it should be better this year.  If they figure out that IOL especially C and are able to stay healthy they will be a force and will win far more than 7 freaking games.  

You mean the same secondary that was 8th worst passing yards allowed per game, 9th worst in CMP%, 4th worst in passing TDs allowed, etc.?  They're high on potential but low on production.  And I'd probably be led to believe their run defense was a byproduct of their porous pass defense.  Only San Francisco faced less rush attempts per game last year.  That's speculation but it wouldn't be the first time a team has struggled in one facet of the game and looked better in another because of it.  Chicago was 4th worst in opponents' 3rd down conversion, but if their run defense is as good as you claim it to be that 3rd down conversion is because of their pass defense.

On 8/18/2024 at 4:07 PM, Ozzy said:

As for the Bears run game last year, Fields was apart of it but he only had 675 yards rushing, not like he ran for 1500 yards or something and no other Bear rusher had over 700 yards rushing, so it was a collective group thing which shows collective dominance on the OL.  You do not gain yards a luck in the NFL and sure they need to improve as a group but they are not nearly as bad as you say they are.  Oh and Caleb Williams is not this statue that will provide nothing in the run game either, he will be a factor in that also and Swift will be great as a pass catcher out of the backfield.

Justin Fields accounted for 23% of their rushing attempts and was their leading rusher.  Yes, I'd venture a guess that he was a BIG part of their running game.  And my issues with OL is more in terms of pass protection.  They allowed the T-7th most sacks in the NFL last year.  That's not good.  And while I do believe sacks are partially a byproduct of QB play, you can't put all the blame on Justin Fields for those sacks if you're praising him for his rushing abilities.  And I'm not sure anyone (let alone myself) is saying that Caleb Williams is a statue.  But he's not Justin Fields.  Caleb Williams never ran the ball more than 109 times in college and averaged 3.3 YPC over his career.  For his comparison, Fields averaged 109 rushing attempts in his 2 seasons in Columbus and averaged 4 YPC while there.  Caleb Williams can absolutely create with his legs, but Justin Fields is better.

On 8/18/2024 at 4:07 PM, Ozzy said:

Wish all you want, Bears are very legit as a football team.  But like any team it matters if a majority of the top players can stay healthy.    Only negative is that they are in the NFC North and the Packers and Lions are two of the best rosters in the NFL as well.  Still with that start to the year, Bears should do very well because outside of the LA Rams and Houston Texans they do not play any great teams and maybe can throw in Jacksonville in that mix.  So again that is a 6-3 record and pretty sure some confidence will come from that.  Compare that to the Packers who play Detroit, Houston, Jacksonville, LA Rams and the Eagles in their first 9 games.  

Again, I said I think they're going to be very competitive.  I just don't think they're ready to take the league by storm.  I think they're a year away assuming that Caleb Williams is even close to who people think he is.  I think the entire NFC North sans Minnesota is going to be very competitive to the point where 10 wins may very well win the division.  And this isn't the NFC South where you're the tallest midget.  I think there could legitimately be 3 playoff teams come from the NFC North.  Every team in the North has questions.  The difference between first and fourth might only be a game or two.  I think they have a very genius Week 1-10 schedule including Tennessee, Carolina, Washington, Arizona, and New England where they should win.  But their final 8 games include all playoff teams from a year ago OR a divisional rival.  That's a daunting finish.  But let's assume they go 6-3 in the first 9 games and they go 4-4 over their final 8, that's 10-7 which is pretty damn close to what I'm expecting. 

You mention Green Bay playing Houston, Jacksonville, and LA Rams in their first 9 games.  You know who also play those 3 teams in the first 9 games?  Chicago.  It's amazing how skewed your opinion is of the Bears' schedule in that regard.  What you choose not to mention is that 7 of the Bears' final 8 games are either against teams that made the playoffs last year or divisional opponents.  But you're making this a GB vs CHI discussion which I wasn't trying to.

On 8/18/2024 at 4:07 PM, Ozzy said:

Who would I be more afraid to go up against, the Bears with their RB/WR/TE groups or the Packers.  Yeah it would be the Bears no question about it.  Packers have a better OL though and a better DL but LB clear Bears and secondary I say Bears over the Packers unless Bullard and McKinney are out of their mind at safety which could happen.  They need Cooper to be a super star at LB though and Bears already have two in Edmunds and Edwards.  We will see what actually happens.  

I'd EASILY take the Packers' RB over Chicago's unless you're convinced that 2023 is going to be the standard for Josh Jacobs and D'Andre Swift.  Bears' WR group is more top heavy, but the Packers is deeper.  Definitely would take the Bears' group as a whole though assuming Keenan Allen is healthy.  I think TE position is closer than you care to admit.

Cole Kmet: 90 targets, 73 receptions, 719 receiving yards, 6 TD receptions
Luke Musgrave and Tucker Kraft (combined): 86 targets, 707 receiving yards, 3 TD receptions

I think the question is that 2nd year development of those two is going to be crucial.  As you mentioned, the Packers' OL is substantially better.  As for the defense, I don't think the Packers' linebackers are anything special but again I wouldn't say that the Bears are either.  Definitely wouldn't call them superstars.  I feel like Edmunds is overrated, and Bears massively downgraded when they dealt Roquan Smith away.  TJ Edwards is good, but definitely not superstar material.  Xavier McKinney is a top 10 safety in the NFL right now, and Bullard has been arguably the best rookie in the Packers' camp.  Probably should be a mention of Evan Williams who would probably be the 2nd best playing rookie.  The reality is the Bears don't have a shutdown corner like Jaire Alexander (albeit with health conners) and Carrington Valentine outplayed Tyrique Stevenson last year.  One was a SRP and the other was a 7th.  Keisean Nixon isn't very good as a nickel corner, but hopefully Bullard ends up there more as the season wears on.

 

I'm gonna be honest, it's kinda weird seeing a Vikings' fan sipping the Bears' kool-aid.

[Ozzy]

10 hours ago, CWood21 said:

I think the question is that 2nd year development of those two is going to be crucial.  As you mentioned, the Packers' OL is substantially better.  As for the defense, I don't think the Packers' linebackers are anything special but again I wouldn't say that the Bears are either.  Definitely wouldn't call them superstars.  I feel like Edmunds is overrated, and Bears massively downgraded when they dealt Roquan Smith away.  TJ Edwards is good, but definitely not superstar material.  Xavier McKinney is a top 10 safety in the NFL right now, and Bullard has been arguably the best rookie in the Packers' camp.  Probably should be a mention of Evan Williams who would probably be the 2nd best playing rookie.  The reality is the Bears don't have a shutdown corner like Jaire Alexander (albeit with health conners) and Carrington Valentine outplayed Tyrique Stevenson last year.  One was a SRP and the other was a 7th.  Keisean Nixon isn't very good as a nickel corner, but hopefully Bullard ends up there more as the season wears on.

 

I'm gonna be honest, it's kinda weird seeing a Vikings' fan sipping the Bears' kool-aid.

Jaylon Johnson long term is better than Jaire Alexander if he can stay healthy but that is a question for both of them.  Long term Gordon will be better than Nixon and Stevenson will be better than Valentine.  Sure maybe they were good at run D because teams passed on them but I do not believe that, they are good at run D because they have standout LBs and a solid front especially when Sweat was added.

 

Kool Aid?  It is called following talent and recognizing it.  Green Bay has a ton of young talent and are probably considered the youngest team in the NFL again this year, they have more young starters than the Bears and more under 25 talent in terms of numbers do but not by much, but look at the top of these lists.  I would take the Bears top 10 guys over the Packers top 10 all day long. They have a higher ceiling and to me have more top end elite level talent.  Sure some guys on the Packers could develop far more and improve their overall future projection as a player, but the Bears are right there if not potentially ahead in terms of elite guys 25 and under on the active roster.

 

It will depend on who develops and who improves, and granted for either roster just because a young guy starts in the NFL early in their career does not mean they will have a great career.  But with that easier start to the season the Bears will gain confidence for a young football team.  And my guess is they beat Green Bay once for the first time since 2018 as well.  You can throw up all these stats about this and that, the team is crazy talented in terms of young players are just as talented as Green Bay is with arguably a better more promising QB.

 

 

 

Chicago Bears
Jaylon Johnson 25
Caleb Williams 21
Darnell Wright 23
Kyler Gordon 24
Rome Odunze 22
DAndre Swift 25
Braxton Jones 25
Jaquan Brisker 25
Cole Kmet 25
Tyrique Stevenson 24
Roschon Johnson 23
Grevon Dexter 22
Jack Sanborn 24
Terell Smith 25
Austin Booker 21
Amen Ogbongbemiga 25
Noah Sewell 22
Tyson Bagent 24
Tyler Scott 22
Elijah Hicks 24
Daniel Hardy 25
Larry Borom 25
Zaach Pickens 24
Keith Randolph 22
Micah Baskerville 24
Kiran Amegadijie 22

 

 

 

 

Green Bay Packers
Jordan Love 25
Jayden Reed 24
Tucker Kraft 23
Zach Tom 25
Lukas Van Ness 23
Quay Walker 24
Rasheed Walker 24
Javon Bullard 21
Edgerrin Cooper 22
Christian Watson 25
Eric Stokes 25
Luke Musgrave 23
Romeo Doubs 24
Karl Brooks 25
Isaiah McDuffie 25
Dontayvion Wicks 23
Jordan Morgan 23
Colby Wooden 23
Sean Rhyan 23
Michael Pratt 22
Brenton Cox 24
Enagbare Kingsley 24
Jonathon Ford 25
Ben Sims 24
Jacob Monk 23
Marshawn Lloyd 23
Evan Williams 23
Emanuel Wilson 25
Tyron Hopper 23
Kalen King 21