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How much of Peyton Manning not winning more than 1 SB was his fault?

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3 minutes ago, lancerman said:

If it wasn't for Osweiler they absolutely would have went to Foxborough and they would not have won in Foxborough. Both games were one possession games and in the AFCCG the Patriots were basically a missed PAT away from having a tie score going into OT against a defense that was gassing out. 

So yeah he does owe Brock a lot and Brock did perform with that team. 

lol man, Brock had a 86 QBR in the handful of games he took over. Lets not act like he was out there lighting the world on fire.

That entire season was because of the defense and not much else. They had average QB play the entire year regardless of who was starting with one of the best defenses in NFL history. If Peyton needs to give thanks to somebody, he should give it to Von Miller, not Brock Osweiler

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6 hours ago, Starless said:

Yeah, Peyton made some plays against the Pats (or more like Jamie Collins completely blew his coverage on Owen Daniels twice). But erasing Osweiler's contribution to that season, as much as he's become a punchline since then, isn't fair. 

I wasn't trying to erase Osweiler's contribution to the SB myself, I was just saying that Manning's contribution shouldn't be dismissed just because he clearly was no longer the Peyton Manning he had been.  He provided the Broncos with QB play that was good enough to get them the championship so I think its silly to try to claim that he didn't really win 2 SB's.  He did.

Osweiler, meanwhile, does get credit from me for saving their season when Manning went down, but I wouldn't consider him a SB-winning QB because he didn't play in the actual SB.  But his contribution was vital in getting there.

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5 hours ago, AkronsWitness said:

lol man, Brock had a 86 QBR in the handful of games he took over. Lets not act like he was out there lighting the world on fire.

That entire season was because of the defense and not much else. They had average QB play the entire year regardless of who was starting with one of the best defenses in NFL history. If Peyton needs to give thanks to somebody, he should give it to Von Miller, not Brock Osweiler

I didn't see much of Brock's play during his time filling in for the injured Manning that year, but I did watch the entire NE game in the regular season and he absolutely won that game for the Broncos from what I remember.  He made some really clutch throws.

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20 hours ago, megatechpc said:

Re: your edit, I always think its unfair to Peyton Manning that people say he had nothing to do with that SB run in 2015.  The defense was largely intact the very next year without Peyton and they didn't even make it to the playoffs.  Clearly he played poorly that year and was certainly not the reason they went to the playoffs or won the SB, but he still did enough on the field and as a leader to contribute to the championship IMO.

They still finished 9-7.  The defense in 2016 wasn’t nearly as good as the one in ‘15 though; they were far worse against the run.

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6 minutes ago, iknowcool said:

They still finished 9-7.  The defense in 2016 wasn’t nearly as good as the one in ‘15 though; they were far worse against the run.

The decline of that team has been precipitous since their SB in 2015 though.  They only won 5 games last year, and that defense is still a top-5 unit even now.  They were the 4th ranked defense in the NFL in 2016 and 2017 (though the awful play of their offense last year put them in way too many bad situations to keep teams from scoring on them).  All I'm saying is that Manning absolutely deserves to be considered a two-time SB champion and that he definitely contributed to that 2015 ring especially with his clutch play in the playoffs.

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What exactly do you mean by "should"? I don't think he should have won the SB against the Saints or Seahawks. I don't think he should have won any of the AFCCs he lost either. So I guess I would say he won as many as he "should" have.

 

I am floored by people saying he should have 5+; that he should have won in 2003, 2004, 2009... What!? No matter how good of a QB you think he was, he was still just 1 player. It's not easy to win SBs in this league. The pairing of arguably the greatest QB AND the greatest coach in the history of the game has only produced 5 SB rings over 17 years.

 

No if you want to ask how many could he have? That's a different story, I would say there were 4 or 5 Colts teams and 3 Broncos teams of his that were capable of winning the SB, and had he come out playing lights out all postseason every year, he could have 8... but then again so could Brady, Montana, Elway, etc.

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8 hours ago, iknowcool said:

They still finished 9-7.  The defense in 2016 wasn’t nearly as good as the one in ‘15 though; they were far worse against the run.

People forget but nearly every win the Broncos had that year was an ugly grind it out job. It was so impressive to watch but it’s unsustainable longterm

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The 07-08 teams should have gone deeper into the playoffs considering those were the most well rounded Colts teams Peyton got to play with and Brady was out all of 2008. 

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38 minutes ago, Malik said:

The 07-08 teams should have gone deeper into the playoffs considering those were the most well rounded Colts teams Peyton got to play with and Brady was out all of 2008. 

And even in 07 he was on arguably the best team in the AFC not named the Patriots and he didn't play them when he got knocked out. He just couldn't beat the Chargers for whatever reason

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Some, but not that much. I think that Marvin Harrison and the Colt special teams also deserve blame for his failures in Indy.

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There's not a ton of QBs in the free agent era to win more than 2.  The Patriots long term success is an incredible outlier.  

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