Utley Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, Thelonebillsfan said: MACHADO AND HARPER ARE 26 WHAT THE **** ARE YOU ARGUING? Holy **** dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Thelonebillsfan said: MACHADO AND HARPER ARE 26 WHAT THE **** ARE YOU ARGUING? Holy **** dude. Ease off on the dramatics would you? It's not conveying your ideas any better and there no need to get all worked up. As I've said multiple times - but perhaps I NEED TO YELL IT FOR IT TO SINK IN..... I'd rather have Harper over Machado. Age not withstanding - Manny's had two knee injuries already - will probably command 30M+ per year for an extended time - he HASNT put any of his previous teams onver the top and I dont want the extended liability. Harper should be cheaper IMO and fits our positional needs more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Leader said: Ease off on the dramatics would you? It's not conveying your ideas any better and there no need to get all worked up. As I've said multiple times - but perhaps I NEED TO YELL IT FOR IT TO SINK IN..... I'd rather have Harper over Machado. Age not withstanding - Manny's had two knee injuries already - will probably command 30M+ per year for an extended time - he HASNT put any of his previous teams onver the top and I dont want the extended liability. Harper should be cheaper IMO and fits our positional needs more. I'm frustrated because you're not actually saying anything substantive and the crux of your argument for weeks now has been "well the Yankees really shouldn't spend money, no collusion, owners aren't cheap, BUILD THE WALL!" and it's ******* insane and stupid. Stop acting like you have any idea what you're talking about. Cano didn't disappear, Machado made the Orioles demonstrably better, you literally have no contextual awareness of a players value beyond counting stats that you took a cursory look at. Because you believe the system to be arbitary and yet A) it's literally based on a statistical breakdown of their effective value based on an easily found criteria and formulas. https://www.baseball-reference.com/about/war_explained_comparison.shtml It's the exact opposite of an arbitrary system. You've got no idea what you're talking about and you have no idea what's going on in the league. There's evident, obvious collusion to keep contracts down, there was this evidence last year at this exact time because of the same empty nonsense that the arbitration system makes it so FA's don't reach until you have to pay for their tail years. That's the trade off, that's the system as collectively bargained as now the owners need to comply. Anything else is stupid window dressing that's based on nonsense and your idiotic belief that the Yankees aren't spending money for anything other than lining Hal's pockets and scaling back the money George put into the team. Not only that, you constantly and consistently insult other posters for literally providing you with sources that contradict your clearly fallacious assertion of a numerical value being arbitrary. When it's apparent that you have no earthly idea what the word "arbitrary" even means. So yes, I don't feel bad nor contradictory to call your fallacious ideas idiotic. Stop posting in this subforum if you have no desire to actually engage with Baseball as it is today. Some of us happen to deal with the league on a daily basis in a professional environment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, jrry32 said: That is how it works. In the NFL, salary is a scarce asset. You have a cap. You must work within the cap. Thus, you must allocate your resources efficiently. That consideration does not exist in baseball. The Yankees can literally say, "We don't give a single fug" and go buy up both Machado and Harper without any issue. Correct. The NYY, LA Dodgers...or any number of big market teams could say to hell with the rules of the game and go out bid all the other teams for talent. You think thats good for the game? You think that a smart way to go? If so, we'll simply agree to disagree. MLB does have a cap system in place - with penalty for overages. Is is exactly like the NFL's? No. But it exists and the NYY have been "extending" past that cap for years. Last year was the first they came under the cap. The first.....and how many championships have they won in that time? Listen - we werent all that far off last year. BOS didnt kick our *** - with all the BS we went thru during the year - we played them tight all year. It was against the bottom feeders we let our record get **** upon. Bird and Sanchez - two major production positions - hit for **** - they were holes in the lineup. Day in. Day out. During spring training last year - when there was word they were thinking of trading Frazier for Cole - I was against it. Wanted to hang on to the kid. In retrospect - and the way our starting pitching broke out (and down) - having Coles arm could have made all the difference at the end. Bottom line - BOS - our primary divisional comp - doesnt have our number - and they had a "clicking on all cylinders" year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, Leader said: Correct. The NYY, LA Dodgers...or any number of big market teams could say to hell with the rules of the game and go out bid all the other teams for talent. You think thats good for the game? You think that a smart way to go? If so, we'll simply agree to disagree. MLB does have a cap system in place - with penalty for overages. Is is exactly like the NFL's? No. But it exists and the NYY have been "extending" past that cap for years. Last year was the first they came under the cap. The first.....and how many championships have they won in that time? Listen - we werent all that far off last year. BOS didnt kick our *** - with all the BS we went thru during the year - we played them tight all year. It was against the bottom feeders we let our record get **** upon. Bird and Sanchez - two major production positions - hit for **** - they were holes in the lineup. Day in. Day out. During spring training last year - when there was word they were thinking of trading Frazier for Cole - I was against it. Wanted to hang on to the kid. In retrospect - and the way our starting pitching broke out (and down) - having Coles arm could have made all the difference at the end. Bottom line - BOS - our primary divisional comp - doesnt have our number - and they had a "clicking on all cylinders" year. I don't care what's good for the game. And no, the MLB does not have a cap system in place. A cap system necessarily implies a cap. They have a luxury tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Also trying to argue the reigning AL MVP in his age 26 season is only worth $20M AAV is laughable considering he's still the 3rd highest paid player on a per average basis on his own team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, Thelonebillsfan said: I'm frustrated because you're not actually saying anything substantive and the crux of your argument for weeks now has been "well the Yankees really shouldn't spend money, no collusion, owners aren't cheap, BUILD THE WALL!" and it's ******* insane and stupid. Stop acting like you have any idea what you're talking about. Cano didn't disappear, Machado made the Orioles demonstrably better, you literally have no contextual awareness of a players value beyond counting stats that you took a cursory look at. Because you believe the system to be arbitary and yet A) it's literally based on a statistical breakdown of their effective value based on an easily found criteria and formulas. https://www.baseball-reference.com/about/war_explained_comparison.shtml It's the exact opposite of an arbitrary system. You've got no idea what you're talking about and you have no idea what's going on in the league. There's evident, obvious collusion to keep contracts down, there was this evidence last year at this exact time because of the same empty nonsense that the arbitration system makes it so FA's don't reach until you have to pay for their tail years. That's the trade off, that's the system as collectively bargained as now the owners need to comply. Anything else is stupid window dressing that's based on nonsense and your idiotic belief that the Yankees aren't spending money for anything other than lining Hal's pockets and scaling back the money George put into the team. Not only that, you constantly and consistently insult other posters for literally providing you with sources that contradict your clearly fallacious assertion of a numerical value being arbitrary. When it's apparent that you have no earthly idea what the word "arbitrary" even means. So yes, I don't feel bad nor contradictory to call your fallacious ideas idiotic. Stop posting in this subforum if you have no desire to actually engage with Baseball as it is today. Some of us happen to deal with the league on a daily basis in a professional environment. Please. "I dont engage in baseball as it is today" LOL The opposite is true. I'm discussing matters based on how the league is set up now. You're discussing it in terms of some hypothetical future system. Good for you. When that systems in place the parameters of this discussion will change but not till its in place. Your answer to things is simply that big market teams "with cash" should simply outspend the cap and all the other teams. Good. Deep thinking there. And what do you do? Empty wastebaskets in the sports department of some newspaper? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utley Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Leader said: Please. "I dont engage in baseball as it is today" LOL The opposite is true. I'm discussing matters based on how the league is set up now. You're discussing it in terms of some hypothetical future system. Good for you. When that systems in place the parameters of this discussion will change but not till its in place. Your answer to things is simply that big market teams "with cash" should simply outspend the cap and all the other teams. Good. Deep thinking there. And what do you do? Empty wastebaskets in the sports department of some newspaper? No Mr. Gym Teacher, he does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 9 minutes ago, jrry32 said: I don't care what's good for the game. And no, the MLB does not have a cap system in place. A cap system necessarily implies a cap. They have a luxury tax. They have a financial system in place. Call it what you wish. The NYY have paid luxury taxes since the current system was put in place - except for last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utley Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Leader said: Please. "I dont engage in baseball as it is today" LOL The opposite is true. I'm discussing matters based on how the league is set up now. You're discussing it in terms of some hypothetical future system. Good for you. When that systems in place the parameters of this discussion will change but not till its in place. Your answer to things is simply that big market teams "with cash" should simply outspend the cap and all the other teams. Good. Deep thinking there. And what do you do? Empty wastebaskets in the sports department of some newspaper? For real though, do you not understand that the only penalty for spending exorbitant amounts is that the owner has to spend more money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webmaster Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 You guys need to settle down. Stop the personal jabs. If you can't discuss baseball without all the bickering, use the ignore feature. Also, watch the language. If every post is getting censored, it's a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Just now, Utley said: For real though, do you not understand that the only penalty for spending exorbitant amounts is that the owner has to spend more money? LOL. Yes I understand that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Leader said: They have a financial system in place. Call it what you wish. The NYY have paid luxury taxes since the current system was put in place - except for last year. Yes, they did. Yet, the Yankees are still here. The only penalty is a monetary one. Basically, the Yankees can do exactly what I said. They just have to be willing to pony up. There is nothing preventing it. And I certainly do not care about what's good for other organizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Webmaster said: You guys need to settle down. Stop the personal jabs. If you can't discuss baseball without all the bickering, use the ignore feature. Also, watch the language. If every post is getting censored, it's a problem. No - actually - I'm not typing the words for the system to censor. Using ***** instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, Leader said: Please. "I dont engage in baseball as it is today" LOL The opposite is true. I'm discussing matters based on how the league is set up now. You're discussing it in terms of some hypothetical future system. Good for you. When that systems in place the parameters of this discussion will change but not till its in place. Your answer to things is simply that big market teams "with cash" should simply outspend the cap and all the other teams. Good. Deep thinking there. And what do you do? Empty wastebaskets in the sports department of some newspaper? Aren't you oh so witty. I am in awe of your brilliant riposte sir. And no, I'm not proposing anything you lackwit. I'm expressing the labor concerns that the percentage of revenue to operational costs is becoming skewed in the individual franchises favor and has been trending this way as players skim through arbitration taking below market deals, as the bargained trade-off is that teams eat money in their waning years. The Yankees cut costs and their primary dead money is on soon to expire contracts, surprise, their revenue last year was up over $100M from the 3 before it where it had plateaued at $510-20M. How the league is set up now is that this revenue is to be reinvested in increasing player salaries and operational costs. There's no cap, there's no hard system in place specifically so these players entering their age 29-30 seasons (and the average player age hovers from 27-29 most years) are paid commensurate to their value. Hal lining his pockets and the Rays having smart scouts to compensate for their owners pocketing the majority of their revenue is irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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