SmittyBacall Posted March 5, 2019 Share Posted March 5, 2019 43 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: One year wonder. True, but he's not being touted as a top-5 pick solely because of his production. 44 minutes ago, RuskieTitan said: His game dominates college football, but just like JFF Manziel and Murray is a weak comparison. Murray is very simply a far better prospect. While both have good movement ability and have the ability to make those rare off script plays, Murray does and can do so much more and is overall just a much more well-rounded passer. Manziel's game really does pale in comparison. Most notably Murray' possesses far better arm talent to make every NFL throw, a natural feel and comfort within the pocket, and a willingness to win from the pocket and deliver an accurate ball with anticipation or zip. I think those three elements drastically separate the two. 1 hour ago, RuskieTitan said: when you start playing against professionals, those plays that went for touchdowns before suddenly wind up with you getting drilled. I'm not as concerned necessarily about his height, but I do believe that his athleticism won't be as game changing as this past season in college was. What is it specifically about Murray you don't see translating? This part is a bit vague. Could you highlight some specifically? I really think you should take the time to go back and watch Murray. I think the differences between the two are obvious and step back if you take another look. 1 hour ago, RuskieTitan said: In addition, he doesn't strike me as a "leader of men" persona that is sort of expected from a franchise quarterback position. I understand that interviews are no indication of game play ability, but he legitimately looks like a kid who is unable to handle questions.If he goes into a locker room, is he going to win over his teammates? What happens when he faces adversity, when losing streaks happen and he's playing poorly? Fair enough, and I can understand the concern. He doesn't appear to be the eloquent, outspoken, positive type. Though his teammates - Cody Ford at the combine for one - speak very highly of his leadership. I think he's likely more of a guy who leads by example, and wins. More than anything players want to win, and they will follow you if you have the ability and the talent to make that happen. I think Murray does. 1 hour ago, RuskieTitan said: End of the day, he's an exciting college player that is a real game changer. But in a league that contains the best players across the board, he's going to literally be a boy among men. Whether or not NFL defenses are faster he's still going to be a threat with his legs and defenses are still going to have to game plan for his rushing ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted March 6, 2019 Share Posted March 6, 2019 I am a Sooner alum and fan and I don't think Murray will succeed. I honestly feel he should have stuck with baseball. Rumors have been surfacing about his lack of preparation or mastery of offensive philosophy. It takes a lot of cerebral work to be a successful NFL QB. He seemed lost and confused by the 'Bama D even when he wasn't running for his life. And with such a small sample of work (only 14 games) such performance shouldn't be overlooked or dismissed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomont Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Obviously anything is possible and AZ drafting Murray may look brilliant in hindsight. But IMO if they do I will lmao @ them for making what will likely be one of the dumbest or at the very least riskiest/most unnecessary draft moves ever. Sure he's talented but the reasons for not drafting Murray #1 overall (and then some) are numerous and obvious to say nothing of giving up on Rosen as a "bust" after just one year on a team with a rather weak cast and dicey coaching to boot. If I'm them I take advantage of the hype and deal that pick away and laugh all the way to the bank. But it looks like another example of why some teams make it to the playoffs frequently while some rarely do. If they do this it is a moronic draft move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDez Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Changing to Bosa 80%/trade down 20%. It sounds like Vance doesn’t care about Bosa’s fit in a 3-4. Sorry Niner fans but Josh Allen is no slouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 2 hours ago, DirtyDez said: Changing to Bosa 80%/trade down 20%. It sounds like Vance doesn’t care about Bosa’s fit in a 3-4. Sorry Niner fans but Josh Allen is no slouch. I'm actually not sure it would be Allen. I think that is the direction that most of the fans would go, but I don't know, I have this weird feeling that we will go in a different direction. I think a trade down would be a possibility at that point, and then we will go with someone else. I think we are going to be big on Montez Sweat for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lark25 Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Wouldn’t Quinnen be better fit than Bosa? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SmittyBacall Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 6 hours ago, Forge said: I'm actually not sure it would be Allen. I think that is the direction that most of the fans would go, but I don't know, I have this weird feeling that we will go in a different direction. I think a trade down would be a possibility at that point, and then we will go with someone else. I think we are going to be big on Montez Sweat for some reason. Or Brian Burns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownLeader Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 On 3/5/2019 at 12:25 PM, RuskieTitan said: One year wonder. His game dominates college football, but just like JFF, when you start playing against professionals, those plays that went for touchdowns before suddenly wind up with you getting drilled. I'm not as concerned necessarily about his height, but I do believe that his athleticism won't be as game changing as this past season in college was. In addition, he doesn't strike me as a "leader of men" persona that is sort of expected from a franchise quarterback position. I understand that interviews are no indication of game play ability, but he legitimately looks like a kid who is unable to handle questions. If he goes into a locker room, is he going to win over his teammates? What happens when he faces adversity, when losing streaks happen and he's playing poorly? I remember how Vince Young couldn't handle it, and I see similar traits with Murray. End of the day, he's an exciting college player that is a real game changer. But in a league that contains the best players across the board, he's going to literally be a boy among men. He's extremely fortunate he made the decision to transfer to Oklahoma, and has had the stars align for him. He's not really a one year wonder. As a true freshman at A&M he started at least 3 games and looked like a big time star in 2 of them. Contrary to popular belief, when Manziel actually tried in year 2 he looked like a good young QB with the Browns. His **** for brains got in the way. But, as it's been said already, their games are not similar. "Leader of men" is a valid criticism. Imo he's just a guarded individual. Strikes me as a guy that doesn't really relax until he's around guys he trusts. Just doesn't strike me as a people person. I think what that means is that the coach/player relationship will be even more important with him. Vince Young had some issues but it's interesting to imagine what he would've been like without Fisher. Either way, I don't see the same personality at all between Murray and Young. Murray looks like a guy that just doesn't entirely trust the media and sees it all as extra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 6 hours ago, lark25 said: Wouldn’t Quinnen be better fit than Bosa? For Arizona? Probably. For SF? Hell no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDez Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 7 hours ago, lark25 said: Wouldn’t Quinnen be better fit than Bosa? On paper I suppose. Bosa will be more impactful IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 3 hours ago, SmittyBacall said: Or Brian Burns. I actually think that we will have Sweat over Burns. I'm just going off a random comment from John Lynch, but when asked what he looked for in pass rushers, he replied "power" multiple times...then added "bend, speed, all of it". But if he is really as big on power as that comment suggested, then I Think Bosa would be our #1, and #2 would probably be Sweat, as he offers the best combination of everything after that. I could be way off base and the comment could mean nothing, but our defensive line additions since this regime came in would support that (with the only possible exception being claiming Sheldon Day of waivers as a 3-tech). But a guy like Kentavius Street is all power. Ronald Blair has gotten massively more time playing under Shanny / Lynch then he did previously, and he's more power than speed as well. The Solomon Thomas pick as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDez Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 17 minutes ago, Forge said: I actually think that we will have Sweat over Burns. I'm just going off a random comment from John Lynch, but when asked what he looked for in pass rushers, he replied "power" multiple times...then added "bend, speed, all of it". But if he is really as big on power as that comment suggested, then I Think Bosa would be our #1, and #2 would probably be Sweat, as he offers the best combination of everything after that. I could be way off base and the comment could mean nothing, but our defensive line additions since this regime came in would support that (with the only possible exception being claiming Sheldon Day of waivers as a 3-tech). But a guy like Kentavius Street is all power. Ronald Blair has gotten massively more time playing under Shanny / Lynch then he did previously, and he's more power than speed as well. The Solomon Thomas pick as well. If Bosa goes #1 they should trade down with the Giants even if it’s on the lowball side. Pick up a 2nd and 3rd this year or another 1st next year and take one of the explosive DE’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Just now, DirtyDez said: If Bosa goes #1 they should trade down with the Giants even if it’s on the lowball side. Pick up a 2nd and 3rd this year or another 1st next year and take one of the explosive DE’s. I think that is how I lean as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyRam Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 I'm still not buying that the Cardinals are set on Murray. I think it's all smoke and mirrors. If they don't trade down, I fully expect them to take Bosa as first choice. Bosa improves their team more than Murray. I actually think without improvement on their OL then it doesn't matter who they have at QB. I'll put it out there, Brady wouldn't make the POs with the team Rosen had to work with last season. Rosen WOULD have made the POs with the supporting cast (and division and HC) Brady had, although I doubt he would have done anywhere near as well in the post season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PizzaPusher Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 On 3/4/2019 at 8:31 AM, SmittyBacall said: As a huge fan of Murray, I'd be pretty excited about the rumours. I like Murray a lot but Steve Keim would get him killed. On the right team Murray could be fantastic but sadly that’s not the Cardinals imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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