packfanfb Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 3 minutes ago, Golfman said: Does this change the top 10 speculation for him? Those are not that impressive of numbers. I'd say no. He's not a flier like Fant so no one expected a real fast time from him. For comparisons sake, Gronk ran a 4.68 and Ertz ran a 4.76. Hockinson falls in that range and is a "complete" in-line TE. I still think he goes top-15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 5 minutes ago, packfanfb said: I'd say no. He's not a flier like Fant so no one expected a real fast time from him. For comparisons sake, Gronk ran a 4.68 and Ertz ran a 4.76. Hockinson falls in that range and is a "complete" in-line TE. I still think he goes top-15. Indeed, Hockenson was never a "Jimmy Graham in his prime" kind of guy (that's Fant, who's already a better blocker than Graham IMO), he's "an extra offensive lineman who can run routes and catch" type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Just now, Golfman said: Does this change the top 10 speculation for him? Those are not that impressive of numbers. Like I told you before, those are normal numbers for a tight end. It's .3 seconds behind Rob Gronkowski. You told me ASJ had a slow 40 time. 10 pounds heavier, .3 seconds slower than Hockenson. Everybody sees the Engram/Njoku/Reed/Fant 40 yard dash times and neglects that most tight ends are running a 4.7 or slower 40 yard dash time. If you're basing your opinion on tight ends off of 40 yard dash times, you're gonna have a bad time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I mean, if you wanted to know "Hockenson is the more complete tight end; Fant is the better vertical threat, open field runner, and seam splitter" there's no need to go to the combine- you can just watch Iowa games (they go pretty fast, it's more efficient than Big 12 football.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 10 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Like I told you before, those are normal numbers for a tight end. It's .3 seconds behind Rob Gronkowski. You told me ASJ had a slow 40 time. 10 pounds heavier, .3 seconds slower than Hockenson. Everybody sees the Engram/Njoku/Reed/Fant 40 yard dash times and neglects that most tight ends are running a 4.7 or slower 40 yard dash time. If you're basing your opinion on tight ends off of 40 yard dash times, you're gonna have a bad time. What round did Gronk go in? What about ASJ? Exactly! Now you are trying to make this guy a top 10 pick. TE's who go top 10 should have all of those attributes. He's got AVERAGE speed for TE's. Not top 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 3 minutes ago, Golfman said: What round did Gronk go in? Gronk would have been a first round pick if he didn't miss so much time in college with a degenerative back condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Penske Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 I could see both Hock and Fant gone by 30 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Just now, Arthur Penske said: I could see both Hock and Fant gone by 30 Wouldn't surprise me at all. I think the only guy at 30 might be Irv. Hock gone in top 15, Fant in top 25. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Official times: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PossibleCabbage Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 1 minute ago, Arthur Penske said: I could see both Hock and Fant gone by 30 Do we have any idea whether LaFleur has any use for short tight ends in his offense (McCarthy had minimal interest)? Since Irv Smith is probably not of interest to a lot of teams because of the height thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Penske Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 4 minutes ago, PossibleCabbage said: Do we have any idea whether LaFleur has any use for short tight ends in his offense (McCarthy had minimal interest)? Since Irv Smith is probably not of interest to a lot of teams because of the height thing. I think bama had him listed at 6’4 lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 Just now, Golfman said: What round did Gronk go in? What about ASJ? Exactly! Now you are trying to make this guy a top 10 pick. TE's who go top 10 should have all of those attributes. He's got AVERAGE speed for TE's. Not top 10. First, you don't have to convince me Hockenson shouldn't be taken top 10. I wouldn't take a tight end until 30th overall no matter what they did. However, 40 yard dash time really doesn't matter for tight ends. Bubba Franks ran a 4.66 40 yard dash time when in reality he probably played the equivalent of a 4.9 40 yard dash. He was slow. With tight ends, it's more about their playing speed. You took issue with Austin Sefarian-Jenkins slow 40 time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPZ5ZDWEADo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8ih92jyppc Does any of that look slow to you? Same thing with Hockenson. Does literally any of this look remotely slow to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Golfman Posted March 2, 2019 Share Posted March 2, 2019 2 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: First, you don't have to convince me Hockenson shouldn't be taken top 10. I wouldn't take a tight end until 30th overall no matter what they did. However, 40 yard dash time really doesn't matter for tight ends. Bubba Franks ran a 4.66 40 yard dash time when in reality he probably played the equivalent of a 4.9 40 yard dash. He was slow. With tight ends, it's more about their playing speed. You took issue with Austin Sefarian-Jenkins slow 40 time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPZ5ZDWEADo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8ih92jyppc Does any of that look slow to you? Same thing with Hockenson. Does literally any of this look remotely slow to you? Speed becomes relative to the competition you play. The Big Ten is not loaded with fast teams like the SEC. His 4.7 in the Big Ten is elite. The step up to the NFL is a big, big difference. Now, my original question was does this affect his top 10 speculation. We went back and forth and now you state, I don't have to convince you he shouldn't go top 10. I wouldn't touch him at 12 and would still strongly consider him at 30 depending on what is on the board. I"m a bigger fan of Fant because of his ability to wreck havoc in the middle of the field. Hockenson might be the better all around talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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