Training Camp/Preseason 2019: 1-3: Time to get to 53

[naptownskinsfan]

6 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

Per D Hall's new podcast, Trent Williams plans to continue his holdout into next week.

'There's zero chance I'll be in that building next week.'

The sun will rise and set in the meantime.  At least that's how Bruce Allen is viewing it.  If we ignore it, maybe it will go away?  

I do think it's time Trent went ahead and made a public statement, or at the very least, file a grievance with the team.  Enough of hiding behind people.  

[MikeT14]

I think I am more and more on board with Haskins sitting the whole season. There's a lot to work on, and that should be the focus of his season.

[turtle28]

2 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

I think I am more and more on board with Haskins sitting the whole season. There's a lot to work on, and that should be the focus of his season.

Best way to learn from your mistakes is making them in real live game action. Whether it's this year or next year he's going to have his ups and downs as he learns and adjusts to the NFL. Almost all-rookie, 2nd year or first time starting QBs deal with making mistakes and having to learn from them when they are first starting.

I don't understand why we should delay the inevitable. And, even if they wait until next season to start Haskins, he's still going to make mistakes and be up and down next year too. 

[MikeT14]

Just now, turtle28 said:

Best way to learn from your mistakes is making them in real live game action. Whether it's this year or next year he's going to have his ups and downs as he learns and adjusts to the NFL. Almost all-rookie, 2nd year or first time starting QBs deal with making mistakes and having to learn from them when they are first starting.

I don't understand why we should delay the inevitable. And, even if they wait until next season to start Haskins, he's still going to make mistakes and be up and down next year too. 

Or he just keeps reverting, doesn't ever gain confidence, and possibly gets injured from a shoddy line. I'll take door #1 of sitting, practicing and fixing his mistakes that can be corrected with drills, film, and learning. He might not be as up and down if we fix what we know is wrong now.

[turtle28]

32 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

Or he just keeps reverting, doesn't ever gain confidence, and possibly gets injured from a shoddy line. I'll take door #1 of sitting, practicing and fixing his mistakes that can be corrected with drills, film, and learning. He might not be as up and down if we fix what we know is wrong now.

If he's not going to get it despite being hit some and going through some adversity as a rookie or first-time starter then he's likely to never get it and become what we want him to become. Guys either have ”IT” or they don't, it just doesn't show up bc they say 6 games, 12 games or a year.

I used to think the way you all are thinking but seeing the numerous young QBs we've drafted since the 90s, I just think back and realize that some guys had it and some guys didn't and it was pretty obvious early on when those guys first started.

1. Obvious that Shuler didn't have it.

2. Obvious early on that Ferrotte was better than Shuler early on but also obvious that Ferottre wasn't going to be anything more than average.

3. Obvious that Trent Green was going go be better than Shuler and Frerotte very early on as a starter and he was still the one we let get away because of the issues we had with selling the team in 98-99.

4. It was obvious that Ramsey and Campbell were never going to be anything more than average. In my 20’s, I wanted them to succeed so bad bc I just wanted us to be good and I was hoping they'd improve as the team improved, but truthfully I was naive about that. They were what we thought they were and even if Ramsey had been protected better as a rookie, it's not like he was ever going to be a pro bowler.

4. It was obvious RG3 had magic the first time he stepped on the field. The issue was he needed his legs to help him and to open up things for him in the passing game in order for him to be successful. When he hurt his knee and then started to have issues with Shanahan bc of the way Shanahan handled that situation, then, it all went downhill for him.

5. It was obvious even when Kirk was a rookie in the preseason and vs the Browns that he could develop into a starter and probably a good starter. We didn't see that come to fruition until 2015 but what we all thought we saw of him and liked early on turned out to be true.

6. That leads me to Haskins. It's obvious this guy has the tools to be a good starter once he plays and develops. I don't think he's going to learn much at all by riding the pine and he won't get as many practice reps as the backup bc those will go to the starter, Keenum. I don't think he's being done any favors by sitting. Even when he eventually gets in the game - whenever that is - he's still going to make the mistakes he’d make now bc he'll be a first time starter in a month or two, just as he is now.

Lastly, I don't think our OL is as awful as people think it is. We don't have Trent, but one guy does not make an OL. Penn is obviously not Trent but Penn isn't awful either. Penn is at worst an average/serviceable LT and IMO a step up from that.

Yes, Flowers is an issue in pass pro but there are ways he can get help. We can have Roullier double team the DT to his left side and with that double team, Flowers and Roullier should be able to handle almost any DT. Also, we have the RB we have in the game at the time keep an eye on the C/LG blocking for a second or two before going out on a pass pattern.

[MikeT14]

I’m shocked you want to throw a QB you’re higher on that most to the wolves when he doesn’t seem to be ready but to each his own. 

Our OL is in the bottom 10. That’s not good. Our WRs are in the bottom 10. That’s not good. 

Why wont he learn anything from riding the pine? More time with the playbook. More time to work on his footwork. How to read Ds. He’s played in 12 games with a team that 99% of the time they played they had more talent than their opponent. Now he plays for a Top 10 worst NFL team. Big shift. 

[bigdog44]

36 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

I’m shocked you want to throw a QB you’re higher on that most to the wolves when he doesn’t seem to be ready but to each his own. 

Our OL is in the bottom 10. That’s not good. Our WRs are in the bottom 10. That’s not good. 

Why wont he learn anything from riding the pine? More time with the playbook. More time to work on his footwork. How to read Ds. He’s played in 12 games with a team that 99% of the time they played they had more talent than their opponent. Now he plays for a Top 10 worst NFL team. Big shift. 

If I bought the team today I’d consider benching him for the season only because I’d consider my coach (and GM) as good as gone. No need to mess this kid up. I’d also start my coaching search today with the kid in mind. 

[Woz]

19 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Apparently they haven’t even talked to Trent lol

Maybe they have.

Of course, they're not going to bend on anything, so that's kind of moot.

Also, Brice looks like central casting's version of a slimy politician or evil dean of college in an Animal House reboot. It is just so natural for him to be a snake.

[Woz]

17 hours ago, bigdog44 said:

I agree, when you have a piece like Mario Williams you continue to build around him and play to his strengths. 

When Shanny switched to a 3-4 I understood a bit because it was an older unit, where guys were getting replaced anyway. He screwed up in only 2 spots though, picking a coordinator and picking players, outside of Kerrigan

So, what you're saying is that he completely wrecked the defense and left it in such shambles that they have only now begun to pull their way out of nine years on?

[NJC33]

Any shot you guys are looking to move Norman? Keep hearing speculation, but nothing reputable. Figured I’d check in.

 

[e16bball]

I really think it’s hard to overestimate the value of having time to learn the intricacies of a system and become entirely familiar with the way it works. Not just for rookies; look at the two QBs we were all fixated on last season. Both veterans, both know how to play football at this level, both are familiar with NFL defenses — but they weren’t totally familiar with their own offense, and they both struggled a lot more than expected.

 

We all knew Smith would take something of a step back because of the talent drop-off from KC to here. But he ended up taking about 3 steps back. The guy who knew that offense inside and out, who always made the right throw with the right timing, he just looked off during his 10 games here. He hadn’t yet mastered this offense, and it showed in his (in)ability to consistently execute it under fire. 

Same with Cousins. We all expected him to take a couple steps upward, moving from the flaming wreckage of the 2017 offensive roster here to arguably the best skill position group in the league in Minnesota. But he really only took a small step forward, and he was still worse than he’d been in 2015 and 2016 here. Watching him, he appeared hesitant, uncertain, and hyper-conservative. Incidentally, the last part is borne out by the stats available — by every Next Gen metric, Cousins was more of a “checkdown” passer than even Smith, despite the claims held and oft-repeated by various posters of good repute. 

 

Both of those guys needed more time than one offseason to adjust to a new offense and new teammates. They had years of NFL experience and success to fall back on, which followed years of college experience. We’re asking Haskins to adjust not only to a new offense and new teammates, but to a new league, new defenses, and an entirely new level of difficulty and complexity. And all he has to fall back on is a year of college in a really user-friendly situation. 

It won’t kill him to play at the end of the year to get some experience. But he’s really not close to ready to handle NFL defenses yet, especially with a poor supporting cast to lean on. 

And, perhaps unimportant (but perhaps not), he’s also not the best QB on the roster right now. That might not matter to many, as he’s clearly the best future option, but he hasn’t earned the job yet. Keenum is the better QB right now, and I think that means something. Haskins should get the call when he TAKES the job from these other mediocre vets — not just be handed the reins solely because of who he is and what we hope he’ll become. 

[MKnight82]

16 minutes ago, NJC33 said:

Any shot you guys are looking to move Norman? Keep hearing speculation, but nothing reputable. Figured I’d check in.

 

I think they would listen to offers.  

[Woz]

16 minutes ago, NJC33 said:

Any shot you guys are looking to move Norman? Keep hearing speculation, but nothing reputable. Figured I’d check in.

 

Like @MKnight82 said, they might be listening to offers, but as of right now, I would say no, they're not.

That said, it's entirely possible he will be cut next March as a salary cap casualty.

[MKnight82]

Raiders cut starting MLB Brandon Marshall.  Perhaps we should make a phonecall....

[Woz]

Since it will come up

https://www.hogshaven.com/2019/8/30/20840802/how-it-works-nfl-practice-squad-rules-eligibility-salary-and-more-redskins-nfl

Quote

The rules for NFL practice squads have changed over the past few years, expanding the number from 8 to 10, allowing 2 players with 2 years experience to be signed, and then expanding that number to 4 players.

Also, a player must now have a minimum of six games - up from the current three games - on a practice squad in order for that season to count as one of the player's three permissible seasons of practice squad service.

For the record, I missed the most recent changes as well (4 players with 2y exp, 6 games as opposed to 3 for PS exp)