GDT Week 3: Denver Broncos @ Green Bay Packers

[thebestever6]

1 hour ago, broncos67 said:

if Denver is smart, they both walk and we get the comp pick.

We are reading the same book, on the same chapter, just might be a different page.

-I'd actively shop Sanders just because of direction of the offense, injury risk, him wanting to win. If I can get reasonable compensation I work off that. Bird in hand worth more than two in the bush.

- Harris it all depends can teams get desperate enough to go above comp pick? If no... Can you match comp pick a year early?If no... Can you get close to a comp pick plus a throw away wr on rookie deal that's not a fit in your system?

- my thought behind that is if you get a wr on his second team on a rookie deal you might get a humble player. That's crucial in an offense that's early stage in order to get to buy in.

- playing opportunity is great for negotiating second contracts. Why over spend in free agency when you may save money on young hungry players looking for experience who you can get for bargains while rebuilding. 

 

Edited September 23, 2019 by thebestever6

[AKRNA]

6 hours ago, BroncoBruin said:

I wouldn't go that far. I think you need to see progress in Year 2. You need to see real positive indicators that the team is headed in the right direction by December of that second year. And there are a lot of ways to measure that outside of wins. But if it looks like the team is regressing after 32 games in the schemes, change has to be on the table. 

Thats a fair caveat. Personally I was thinking more of our present situation. Given the disaster Fangio inherited IE. thin roster, terrible coaching, losing culture, lack of locker room leadership, lack of professionalism, (I could go on but you get the drift), I'll be satisfied if, as you say, progress isn't strictly measured by wins but by noticeable signs we're turning the listed deficiencies around. 

I like what I'm seeing so far. Improvement every week in any/all areas. Significant red zone progress this week. Better run blocking and game plans. Tough attitude and continuing to be a "tough out". Those are things you can build on. The wins will come later.

[Broncofan]

 

Can’t wait for the spin from Klis & co. - we’re number 1?

Edited September 24, 2019 by Broncofan

[thebestever6]

9 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

 

Can’t wait for the spin from Klis & co. - we’re number 1?

It goes by strength of schedule so we would have the 6th pick in the draft right now?

 

Edited September 24, 2019 by thebestever6

[Broncofan]

1 minute ago, thebestever6 said:

It goes by strength of schedule so we would have the 6th pick in the draft right now?

 

Long way to go before we worry about that.  Just lose baby? 

For 1 week we can say we’re number 1 at something.   Don’t take that away. 

[jsthomp2007]

I think if you move Sanders and CHJ, then obviously the Broncos are sellers and would hate to say it...move Von with Chubb looking better at this point.  And, Edge rushers these days are a dime a dozen.  Look at what Barrett is doing in Tampa.   The only thing that makes Von different is that when he wants to, he can completely dominate a game.  

[thebestever6]

3 minutes ago, jsthomp2007 said:

The only thing that makes Von different is that when he wants to, he can completely dominate a game.  

And Elway has to sell a contending team that this would be the norm if they trade for him. 

I hope he has a throwback game against the Jags win or loss

[thebestever6]

33 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Long way to go before we worry about that.  Just lose baby? 

For 1 week we can say we’re number 1 at something.   Don’t take that away. 

Being first in waivers could Denver theoretically agree with a team to pick up a crappy contract for the next two years? 12 million dollars in cap this year

In exchange for an overpayment for a player or two Chris Harris? Von Miller?

Or are the waivers strictly for guys who have no future in the NFL during the year? 

- teams seem to hide good young talent on IR with bs injuries.

How well does the league monitor ALL of this?

Edited September 24, 2019 by thebestever6

[Broncofan]

4 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

Being first in waivers could Denver theoretically agree with a team to pick up a crappy contract for the next two years? 12 million dollars in cap this year

In exchange for an overpayment for a player or two Chris Harris? Von Miller?

Or are the waivers strictly for guys who have no future in the NFL during the year? 

- teams seem to hide good young talent on IR with bs injuries how well does the league monitor this?

Players who get released with fewer than 4 years of service time get passed through waivers.  The rest become FA - why AB was free to sign when OAK & NE released him (good luck now lol). 

So no big names or vets are eligible.   It’s more if a Chad Kelly type situation comes up.  

Edited September 24, 2019 by Broncofan

[thebestever6]

23 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Players who get released with fewer than 4 years of service time get passed through waivers.  The rest become FA - why AB was free to sign when OAK & NE released him (good luck now lol). 

So no big names or vets are eligible.   It’s more if a Chad Kelly type situation comes up.  

Corey Davis is an interesting name to me. I don't know what Avenue I'd take to inquire about him but he doesn't seem to fit with the Titans. Don't know where they are on the 5th year option  He's still only 24 years old. Hasn't been worth top 5 pick money or contract extension to this point. 

Adore Jackson starter quality doesn't look amazing.  CHJ would definitely solidify that secondary. 

Wonder what it would take to land him?

Edited September 24, 2019 by thebestever6

[BroncosFan2010]

Man, its been months since I posted here! Hope all is well everyone. Between my Blazers playing so well in the NBA playoffs, summer fun and job insanity I just have not had the time. Not to mention this team doesn't exactly inspire one to go out of their way to comment on  a message board.

Overall, its just pretty sad that we are in a position to jettison our last Super Bowl guys but reality is real and the reality is that this team is nowhere near contending for even a PO spot and its best for the franchise, and the vets, to move on. Miller should get a R1, Sanders a R4 and CHJ a R3 IMO.

I just cant get past the fact that Elway had that defense for so long after the Super Bowl and failed to get even a mediocre QB for another run. I find that indefensible when looking back in hindsight and believe it should cost him his job. The team had the talent across the board in 16/17 and to a lesser extend 17/18 to make another run with a decent QB. Put this current itineration of Joe Flacco on those teams and we are in the playoffs, likely even contending in 16/17. But we just totally crapped the bed. Its pretty sad to think back on, because as it stands we are one of the most uninspiring teams in the league. We lack young talent outside a few bright spots (Chubb, Lindsey, Sutton and arguably Freeman) and have horrendous depth.

Lock strikes me as another classic Elway QB, almost a clone of Lynch. I don't expect much. Bolles is who we all thought he was, a physical talent who is too dumb to handle LT and is more of a late-R2 Right Tackle type talent than the top 20 LT he was ovedrafted as.

I don't think the coaching staff is much to blame, the team just isn't that talented. It does strike me as another check against Elway that he hired a defensive oriented coach with a scheme super reliant on elite ILB play, then proceeds to throw the guy talents like Todd and Josey. That's just poor front office planning.

End of the day, we have not been blown out too bad and the losses are starting to look better week over week. There is some gelling going on. But its a testament to the state of Broncos football when your waxing poetic about losing in less embarrassing ways.

This team needs a franchise QB to reinvigorate the culture. Its that simple. You can not convince me of anything else. The league seems to be leaking talented, young QB's right now and we seem to be one of the only squads that keep missing out. I cant think of a team with a less inspiring QB situation not that Eli is sitting. Its just gotten so old. And Flacco isn't even playing that bad, its just that we need someone that can bring a pulse to this big bowl of meh football squad and a young QB is the absolute best and quickest way to do that.

 

 

 

[thebestever6]

48 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

I cant think of a team with a less inspiring QB situation not that Eli is sitting. Its just gotten so old. And Flacco isn't even playing that bad, its just that we need someone that can bring a pulse to this big bowl of meh football squad and a young QB is the absolute best and quickest way to do that.

 

Redskins are up there until Haskins plays lol. I'm willing to give Lock a long audition when he comes back from injury along with selling as you stated he may be Lynch 2.0 I just want to say they gave him 8 games I can live with that. If he ain't it the pick should be nice to make some moves.

I think a qb recession happened from 2013- 2016 not many successful qbs drafted outside of the top 2 in 2016. Elway never prepared for it (Foles, Wilson, Cousins)that's where I fault him. 

Trading a second for Tyrod Taylor wasn't going to be the straw to stirr the drink.

Edited September 24, 2019 by thebestever6

[BroncosFan2010]

Quote

Redskins are up there until Haskins plays lol. I'm willing to give Lock a long audition when he comes back from injury along with selling as you stated he may be Lynch 2.0 I just want to say they gave him 8 games I can live with that. If he ain't it the pick should be nice to make some moves.

I think a qb recession happened from 2013- 2016 not many successful qbs drafted outside of the top 2 in 2016. Elway never prepared for it (Foles, Wilson, Cousins)that's where I fault him. 

Trading a second for Tyrod Taylor wasn't going to be the straw to stirr the drink.

Lock should be given 8 games, that I agree with. I do believe that even if he plays well, we should target a QB in 2020. I don't think this will be an issue because I don't expect him to play well.

I do agree that there was a dearth of QB's available in 2016/17 offseasons, but we should have made a splash move. Not a R2 for Tyrod type, but a 2-3 FRP's for an established QB or top 5 pick to use on a QB. We had a special team, with special talent on both sides of the ball. All we needed was a QB to get back into contention. I know this is hindsight, but could this team have been a deep playoff squad if we offered Detroit something crazy for, say, Stafford in 2016? Would it have been worth 3-4 FRP's to stay a Super Bowl contender for another two seasons? I absolutely think it would have been. I would mortgage 5-10 years of the future to add a final piece to a special team, and in 16+17 that final piece was a QB. Our current trajectory shows that even when you don't mortgage the future for instant gratification, there is no guarantee that future you keep is worth anything. Right now it looks pretty glim.

[The Helicopter]

58 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

Man, its been months since I posted here! Hope all is well everyone. Between my Blazers playing so well in the NBA playoffs, summer fun and job insanity I just have not had the time. Not to mention this team doesn't exactly inspire one to go out of their way to comment on  a message board.

Overall, its just pretty sad that we are in a position to jettison our last Super Bowl guys but reality is real and the reality is that this team is nowhere near contending for even a PO spot and its best for the franchise, and the vets, to move on. Miller should get a R1, Sanders a R4 and CHJ a R3 IMO.

I just cant get past the fact that Elway had that defense for so long after the Super Bowl and failed to get even a mediocre QB for another run. I find that indefensible when looking back in hindsight and believe it should cost him his job. The team had the talent across the board in 16/17 and to a lesser extend 17/18 to make another run with a decent QB. Put this current itineration of Joe Flacco on those teams and we are in the playoffs, likely even contending in 16/17. But we just totally crapped the bed. Its pretty sad to think back on, because as it stands we are one of the most uninspiring teams in the league. We lack young talent outside a few bright spots (Chubb, Lindsey, Sutton and arguably Freeman) and have horrendous depth.

Lock strikes me as another classic Elway QB, almost a clone of Lynch. I don't expect much. Bolles is who we all thought he was, a physical talent who is too dumb to handle LT and is more of a late-R2 Right Tackle type talent than the top 20 LT he was ovedrafted as.

I don't think the coaching staff is much to blame, the team just isn't that talented. It does strike me as another check against Elway that he hired a defensive oriented coach with a scheme super reliant on elite ILB play, then proceeds to throw the guy talents like Todd and Josey. That's just poor front office planning.

End of the day, we have not been blown out too bad and the losses are starting to look better week over week. There is some gelling going on. But its a testament to the state of Broncos football when your waxing poetic about losing in less embarrassing ways.

This team needs a franchise QB to reinvigorate the culture. Its that simple. You can not convince me of anything else. The league seems to be leaking talented, young QB's right now and we seem to be one of the only squads that keep missing out. I cant think of a team with a less inspiring QB situation not that Eli is sitting. Its just gotten so old. And Flacco isn't even playing that bad, its just that we need someone that can bring a pulse to this big bowl of meh football squad and a young QB is the absolute best and quickest way to do that.

 

 

 

Having leaders on the offensive side would be smart. Manning elevated the team with his leadership and work ethic, even when his play regressed.

Giving Lock a true audition probably means keeping Sanders around a bit longer...

[thebestever6]

15 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said:

Our current trajectory shows that even when you don't mortgage the future for instant gratification, there is no guarantee that future you keep is worth anything. Right now it looks pretty glim.

I can't argue with this statement one bit. As soon as Elway committed that huge deal to Von which I disagreed with it was a win now move. A corresponding move had to be made right or wrong to solidify the QB position with that move being made.

If a franchise tag and trade of Von happened (Frank Clark), rumors were two firsts and a 3rd were offered. You have a better future Mahomes, Watson, Darnold, Mayfield ammo in the future. I'd love to know what Joe Ellis and his role were.

This non committal approach deserves to get Elway fired more than anything. I don't like sentimental combined with taking short cuts it's a recipe for disaster. 

Edited September 24, 2019 by thebestever6