Does sitting a QB his first season help or hurt his career?

[Ragnarok]

5 hours ago, everlong said:

I don't buy that. Good quarterbacks such as Stafford are mentally tough and don't "break" like Carr did.

There is no way to know that.  How many times can a guy get hit on a losing team, get injured, and bounce back?  I am not saying that there's not a mental aspect to it.  However, the physical beating takes a toll so I think it is a combination.  Not just one or the other.

[Ragnarok]

5 hours ago, Louis Friend said:

Stafford still is one of the highest sacked QBs in the league (top 6 the last 4 or 5 seasons), which is why Bob Quinn spent alot of money in free agency this offseason adding to the OL and drafting 3 OL in last years draft. 

Staffords first two seasons were riddled with injuries. He was called "Glassford" and called a bust and Lions were abhorred for starting him right away even though they had nothing else at the position. He's now played every game for the last 6 seasons and is currently 4th on the active list of QBs with most consecutive starts. He went from being labelled a bust and an injury concern to be considered a top 10 QB with 3 playoff appearances in 6 years. The difference between him and David Carr, is mental. 

I remember all of that too.

And Stafford is a tough dude.  But I think it is more than just mental.  

[DontTazeMeBro]

41 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

You do realize you just slapped every person in the face who's ever suffered from PTSD and abuse right? 

Is this a joke? We're not talking about getting raped by your dad or seeing your buddy get his legs blown off by an IED. We're talking about getting hit playing a game.

Just in case it actually is a joke I'll point to Brett Favre, Troy Aikman, Eli Manning who all struggled badly early in their career and weren't set back by it. There's a lot of others. Drew Brees is a Saint now because he sucked so bad before SD drafted Rivers. There's just something above the neck that some guys have and others don't.

[patriotsheatyan]

6 minutes ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

Is this a joke? We're not talking about getting raped by your dad or seeing your buddy get his legs blown off by an IED. We're talking about getting hit playing a game.

Just in case it actually is a joke I'll point to Brett Favre, Troy Aikman, Eli Manning who all struggled badly early in their career and weren't set back by it. There's a lot of others. Drew Brees is a Saint now because he sucked so bad before SD drafted Rivers. There's just something above the neck that some guys have and others don't.

Lol, he is looking for something to be offended about on the internet.

[Supersuavesky]

6 hours ago, TVScout said:

There are justifications for sitting a QB:

1) Bad mechanics.

2) Injury.

3) Disciplinary punishment.

4) Doesn't understand the playbook.

The playbook and Mechanics one can be applied to practically any and all rookie QBs no matter what round they were taken in. 7 on 7 camps help to emphasis bad mechanics and college coaches typically care about winning more then correcting problems (As they should). And every QB needs time to learn; you can installing a good amount of the playbook and maybe some packages but it takes longer then one off-season to learn the fine points of an entirely new offense.

 

It is because of these two things I think I'd like most QBs to sit if the coaches can afford it. But obviously fans and GMs only care about immediate results. 

[Calvert28]

16 hours ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

Is this a joke? We're not talking about getting raped by your dad or seeing your buddy get his legs blown off by an IED. We're talking about getting hit playing a game.

Just in case it actually is a joke I'll point to Brett Favre, Troy Aikman, Eli Manning who all struggled badly early in their career and weren't set back by it. There's a lot of others. Drew Brees is a Saint now because he sucked so bad before SD drafted Rivers. There's just something above the neck that some guys have and others don't.

"We're talking about getting hit in a game." !?!?!?! Like really? Have you even tackled by a 250 pound behemoth? Been hit by them multiple times throughout an hour long period? Thing's start to wear on you after a while. Nothing more so then a losing record, especially when you are the person everyone essentially blames for those losses. Stress wears on everyone. Or does Barry Sanders retiring early not strike as someone who was just fed up and tired, being mentally exhausted by an avg team? By your logic, the guy should have still been going strong because he just has that "it" factor upstairs. Nothing phases these people, nothing can alter their frame of mind, nothing can wear on their psyche. And yet we see it happen all the time.

Your comment was very general, not accepting the fact that even the smallest things shapes and affect our psychological makeup. Playing behind a horrible offensive line, being the face of an entire franchise, and all the pressure's it takes to succeed according to you should have no affect on good players. Which is a flat out lie, very rarely do you find players that can succeed with subpar to bad talent around them. And even then it takes an entire scheme built around them to have any type of success. Aikman started seeing alot of success after his 2nd year and had arguably the great offensive line developed for him, hence my comment of getting a great supporting cast early on can help fix and prevent bad habits from occurring. Favre, had alot talent developed around him over the years. Same with Eli. When the talent was down, these guys struggled.

But some guys just deal with such piss poor talent for a long while that they develop very bad habits trying to adjust and adapt to the situation. Carr being a grade A example. Sometimes it is just a little too late with some of these people. Believe or not nature does not always win over nuture. 

[Jlowe22]

Wait a minute...are we now comparing getting sacked to getting legs blown off by an IED?

[Malik]

Getting hit in the pocket so often can make you antsy when throwing a football during a game. It does not give you Post Traumatic Stress Disorder.

[DontTazeMeBro]

41 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

"We're talking about getting hit in a game." !?!?!?! Like really? Have you even tackled by a 250 pound behemoth? Been hit by them multiple times throughout an hour long period? Thing's start to wear on you after a while. Nothing more so then a losing record, especially when you are the person everyone essentially blames for those losses. Stress wears on everyone. Or does Barry Sanders retiring early not strike as someone who was just fed up and tired, being mentally exhausted by an avg team? By your logic, the guy should have still been going strong because he just has that "it" factor upstairs. Nothing phases these people, nothing can alter their frame of mind, nothing can wear on their psyche. And yet we see it happen all the time.

Most of what you're saying here isn't wrong. It still doesn't come close to what most people suffering from PTSD or abuse victims are dealing with. Which you brought up.

And we're not talking about me. I don't spend my life getting my body in shape to be able to get hit by a 250 pound behemoth. I haven't been taking hits since I was a teenager. 

[Jlowe22]

If you play professional football and are getting stressed out, you need to go cash your check and buy a new car.  You do not need treatment for PTSD.

[TheVillain112]

How about sitting a QB in their 7th season?  Asking for a friend...

[Ragnarok]

2 hours ago, Jlowe22 said:

If you play professional football and are getting stressed out, you need to go cash your check and buy a new car.  You do not need treatment for PTSD.

I think every player is stressed out.  But there's a massive difference between that and ptsd.

[Iamcanadian]

21 hours ago, Calvert28 said:

You do realize you just slapped every person in the face who's ever suffered from PTSD and abuse right? 

 

Someone who deals a crappy situation but gains support early on can get out of bad habits quicker. 

A person who is exposed early and sustains the mindset that they have to rely on themselves because others are a liability. That mentality sticks with you for years to come. Regardless if the support you get later on. That why the Texans or the Browns have never sustained great QB play. 

At least now the Texans have a shot at building up Watson because of the stellar supporting cast early in his career. 

Your joking right! Top 5 drafted QB's were drafted by teams that completely stunk and took a mauling as rookies, yet the vast bulk of them went on to be great franchise QB's because they were mentally very tough human beings. Carr simply wasn't strong mentally and acting like he failed because his supporting cast around him was weak, just does not cut it.

The Texans and the Browns simply have not done much of a job in drafting solid QB's, their QB picks have just been full of failures due to bad drafting and not much else.

Football is a very tough sport and you have to have  real courage to play it. Most of us would not return to the field of play after starting for a couple of plays, because we are not used to the pain every pro football players suffers every game day. Concussions, broken limbs, torn ligaments etc. etc. etc.. yet most of them come back from these injuries and play again and QB's are no different. They are hit on practically every passing play whether they have a good OL or not, a good OL may cut down on the sacks, but QB's get hit over and over. There are many, many NFL QB's who play on teams that are rather weak, but their QB's just do not let it bother them. That is called mental toughess.

Carr, simply did not have the capacity to take it and never really ever showed he had the talent to be a NFL franchise QB.

[Calvert28]

6 hours ago, DontTazeMeBro said:

Most of what you're saying here isn't wrong. It still doesn't come close to what most people suffering from PTSD or abuse victims are dealing with. Which you brought up.

And we're not talking about me. I don't spend my life getting my body in shape to be able to get hit by a 250 pound behemoth. I haven't been taking hits since I was a teenager. 

Your entire post implied that great players are going to be great no matter what. That if they can be affected mentally by the game and it's pressures then they were never going to be good in the first place. 

Granted my PTSD comparison was extreme, but you made it sound as if outside influences will never affect a strong mind and it just rubbed me the wrong way and I was pointing really not to guys getting their legs blown off but just ones who's simply witnessed something traumatic can affect someone for years to come. Just seeing someone in a head on collision with a car can warp your mind. And cause traumatic stress on the mind. No one on earth is the exception in regarding bad situations.

Anyways getting back to the original subject. No one is immune to bad nurturing. A bad situation can ruin an athlete. Or even a bad instance, here let me bring up another situation to prove just how devastating the game is. Go look up Earl Campbell's hit on Isiah Robertson. A multi probowler who's confidence and self esteem was basically cut in half just by one play. Dude was great and yet that one thing just kept eating at him for even years after the game. 

[paul-mac]

I think with the way college offenses and NFL offenses are today, I think the only way to grow a QB in this league is to start him. Now, that's not to say that QBs should never sit. For example, I've got no problem with the Chiefs having Mahomes sit behind Alex Smith as long as Smith continues to have them as a genuine contender, but I don't see the benefits for someone like Mitchell Trubisky to sit behind Glennon. I'd start him.