End of Season Mock 2020

[Sugashane]

I don't see the Floyd love. He was the 4th best starter in the LB corps this year and is argue Kwiatkoski was better this year too.

Floyd was so easy to erase from the game it was embarrassing. 

[Heinz D.]

35 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

Wait, you think the Bears could *likely* get a 1st round pick in a trade for Floyd? HAHAHA log off, dude. Jamie Collins was 2x the player Floyd was in his prime and the Pats got a conditional third.

Never said "likely" to a first. Although that could easily happen. A 4-3 team, with cap space and a low first round pick. 

And, ignoring the fact you're simply going out of your way to harass people at the moment--the contention  that Jamie Collins was "2x" the player Floyd is, is ridiculous.  

Your contention is Floyd is terrible, then? And has no trade value? What are you basing that on? Curious. 

[Heinz D.]

12 minutes ago, Sugashane said:

I don't see the Floyd love. He was the 4th best starter in the LB corps this year and is argue Kwiatkoski was better this year too.

Floyd was so easy to erase from the game it was embarrassing. 

Don't love Floyd. But think he would be much better in a 4-3. Am guessing a lot of football people are thinking the same. The fact that he isn't a good pass rusher means almost nothing if you pencil him in as a 4-3 OLB, who blitzes on occasion. 

 

[beardown3231]

12 minutes ago, Heinz D. said:

Never said "likely" to a first. Although that could easily happen. A 4-3 team, with cap space and a low first round pick. 

And, ignoring the fact you're simply going out of your way to harass people at the moment--the contention  that Jamie Collins was "2x" the player Floyd is, is ridiculous.  

Your contention is Floyd is terrible, then? And has no trade value? What are you basing that on? Curious. 

I'm not harrassing you, it's that I legitimately want to know if something wrong with you. You keep posting things and then saying "I didn't say that." Add in the fact that- despite people having a right to their opinion- you have some extremely questionable takes. Pace isn't a big boy! He should trade the next five 1's for Herbert! Mack should be benched or traded! Jackson's extension isn't deserved and/or they should've waited!

You said Floyd would *likely fetch* a "very high pick." I asked you what "very high" was and you said "A first. Can't get any higher than that." That is quoted. Therefore YOU said they could likely get a 1 for Leonard Floyd. That's what that means, dude.

Collins was a Pro Bowler and a 2nd team All Pro (IIRC) doing almost exactly what Floyd does, so yeah, let me know when Floyd gets close to either of those DESPITE being surrounded by better talent than Collins ever was.

You also have an obsession with overreacting. Just because I don't think they can't get a 1st round pick for Floyd doesn't mean I "contend" that he's "terrible" or that he has "no trade value." It means there's no chance they could get a 1 or a 2 for a guy who consistently disappears and does nothing *very* well. It means if they trade him they'll be getting no better than a top 100 pick (and I would be open to that, FYI). Like @Sugashane said, Floyd was easily taken out of many games (or maybe he just isn't good enough to make a consistent impact [or both]). He chased Rodgers out of bounds in Lambeau and it was one of his best plays in weeks. Big deal. Another miss by Pace. What else is new?

Edited January 4, 2020 by beardown3231

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

As someone who can see at least partly valid points that you're both making, would you two please just kiss already?

[Heinz D.]

3 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

I'm not harrassing you, it's that I legitimately want to know if something wrong with you. You keep posting things and then saying "I didn't say that." Add in the fact that- despite people having a right to their opinion- you have some extremely questionable takes. Pace isn't a big boy! He should trade the next five 1's for Herbert! Mack should be benched or traded! Jackson's extension isn't deserved and/or they should've waited!

You said Floyd would *likely fetch* a "very high pick." I asked you what "very high" was and you said "A first. Can't get any higher than that." That is quoted. Therefore YOU said they could likely get a 1 for Leonard Floyd. That's what that means, dude.

Collins was a Pro Bowler and a 2nd team All Pro (IIRC) doing almost exactly what Floyd does, so yeah, let me know when Floyd gets close to either of those DESPITE being surrounded by better talent than Collins ever was.

You also have an obsession with overreacting. Just because I don't think they can't get a 1st round pick for Floyd doesn't mean I "contend" that he's "terrible" or that he has "no trade value." It means there's no chance they could get a 1 or a 2 for a guy who consistently disappears and does nothing *very* well. It means if they trade him they'll be getting no better than a top 100 pick (and I would be open to that, FYI). Like @Sugashane said, Floyd was easily taken out of many games (or maybe he just isn't good enough to make a consistent impact [or both]). He chased Rodgers out of bounds in Lambeau and it was one of his best plays in weeks. Big deal. Another miss by Pace. What else is new?

Harass may not have been the best choice of verbs, but I'm not sure of a better one offhand. I think you're so enraged that your favorite team has really botched a good chance at success that you're pretty much overreacting to everything that's presented. I haven't said Pace should pull off a massive trade for Herbert. Although, since you're even more convinced Trubisky will never work out, I'm surprised you haven't. Oh right, Burrow is the only good quarterback in this draft, and you're holding out for Lawrence anyway. Never said Mack should be traded, suggested he should be benched. Said Jackson's extension was a gamble. Plenty of other folks around here understand he didn't have the best season, either. If you want to pretend I'm the only one, that's fine. 

Floyd has never had a really good season with the Bears, and as long as the Bears continue to run this system, he never will. It's pretty clear from what I posted that I don't have a solid fix as to what he'd fetch, but it would probably be good. My point being that he'd be far more valuable to a team that ran a different defensive system. Sorry if that was unclear. I didn't think it was. 

[beardown3231]

44 minutes ago, Heinz D. said:

Harass may not have been the best choice of verbs, but I'm not sure of a better one offhand. I think you're so enraged that your favorite team has really botched a good chance at success that you're pretty much overreacting to everything that's presented. I haven't said Pace should pull off a massive trade for Herbert. Although, since you're even more convinced Trubisky will never work out, I'm surprised you haven't. Oh right, Burrow is the only good quarterback in this draft, and you're holding out for Lawrence anyway. Never said Mack should be traded, suggested he should be benched. Said Jackson's extension was a gamble. Plenty of other folks around here understand he didn't have the best season, either. If you want to pretend I'm the only one, that's fine. 

Floyd has never had a really good season with the Bears, and as long as the Bears continue to run this system, he never will. It's pretty clear from what I posted that I don't have a solid fix as to what he'd fetch, but it would probably be good. My point being that he'd be far more valuable to a team that ran a different defensive system. Sorry if that was unclear. I didn't think it was. 

Then what did you suggest? I'm still waiting for your response in the other thread. You said Ballard will go from 13 to 3 and get Herbert because it's a big boy move from a big boy GM, one we don't have, literally implying 1) you wish Pace would do that and 2) ignoring the position that he did that 3 drafts ago- fact 

You said if Mack continues to play the way he was playing week 11-12, he should be traded, and then he did continue to play that way thus you believe he should be benched OR TRADED which prompted @WindyCity to tell you it's financially impossible to do so- fact

You were very unclear about what Floyd would net because you quite clearly said (I mean, go look) that it would be dumb NOT to trade him because he'd net a "very high pick" and then clarified what you meant was "a first round pick, as high as it gets"- fact

Edited January 5, 2020 by beardown3231

[WindyCity]

No one is trading for Floyd making 13.2 million.

He is valueless at that cap number.

[GOGRIESE]

Tom Brady is about 9 seconds away from being a free agent...Could be interesting to see how him hitting the market shakes up everyones mock offseasons. 

Edited January 5, 2020 by GOGRIESE

[Sugashane]

6 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

Don't love Floyd. But think he would be much better in a 4-3. Am guessing a lot of football people are thinking the same. The fact that he isn't a good pass rusher means almost nothing if you pencil him in as a 4-3 OLB, who blitzes on occasion. 

 

Not you specifically. I see people on Facebook saying to lock him up next, he gets more credit than he deserves from media, etc. 

 

He's an athlete that has issues disengaging and didn't hold down the edge well enough for his praise. 

[Madmike90]

13 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

He will have a ton of value to a 4-3 team. Pace drafted a great player. Just one that didn't fit the system he wanted to run.

A first. Can't get any higher than that, last I checked. Floyd's not a great pass rusher. He is a great linebacker. 

No one if given up a first for Floyd dude.

[Madmike90]

13 hours ago, SirA1 said:

Kareem Hunt is a RFA for the Browns so they will likely Tender him.

No doubt it could happen but with a new coaching staff in Cleveland the possibility is there that he walks. 

[WindyCity]

Floyd as a great player? That is comedy gold.

You would be lucky to get a day 3 pick for him. Off the ball LBs are not that valuable and he makes WAY TOO MUCH money for what he does on the field.

Floyd is a solid NFL starter who makes too much money. Teams do not line up to trade premium picks for those guys.

[Nads786]

21 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Floyd as a great player? That is comedy gold.

You would be lucky to get a day 3 pick for him. Off the ball LBs are not that valuable and he makes WAY TOO MUCH money for what he does on the field.

Floyd is a solid NFL starter who makes too much money. Teams do not line up to trade premium picks for those guys.

The thing that bothers me with Floyd is we rarely use him in inside stunts or running free to the QB. That’s his best trait. New England would be a perfect fit for him.

[Heinz D.]

12 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

Then what did you suggest? I'm still waiting for your response in the other thread. You said Ballard will go from 13 to 3 and get Herbert because it's a big boy move from a big boy GM, one we don't have, literally implying 1) you wish Pace would do that and 2) ignoring the position that he did that 3 drafts ago- fact 

I've always advocated the same thing--draft a guy with one of the second round picks, or move up into the bottom half of the first to get somebody they feel strongly about. Hope the worst scenario in that move is that you end up with a cheaper, better backup than Daniel. You and I even discussed this a couple of days ago. 

I said that Ballard was going to trade up for Herbert, that doesn't mean I want Pace to. That's a pretty big leap there, dude. The 'big boy" element you're referring to means Ballard sees a hole on his roster, and he's going to try to fix it. We have a GM that looks like he's going to cower in a corner and hope nobody realizes he made a big mistake that ended up putting in motion a plan that may end up being mistake riddled itself, because of that original miscalculation. That's exactly the opposite of a "big boy" GM.

I fail to see why you'd be against trading up this year (in the Herbert scenario you laid out) because Pace "did that 3 drafts ago", but yet you're advocating trading up at an even higher price, next year. But that's neither here nor there, I suppose. I just find that confusing.

Look, you and I see the whole overall scenario differently. You're happy to blow this team up, hope they're as bad as possible, and go get Lawrence. And that's a reasonable position to have--I simply don't share it. I think action should be taken right away, but I'm beginning to doubt that it will. 

12 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

You said if Mack continues to play the way he was playing week 11-12, he should be traded, and then he did continue to play that way thus you believe he should be benched OR TRADED which prompted @WindyCity to tell you it's financially impossible to do so- fact

I don't see why benching a player that isn't playing well is some kind of football blasphemy to you. That also seems weird to me. I don't remember saying he should be traded, though. Find that for me?

12 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

You were very unclear about what Floyd would net because you quite clearly said (I mean, go look) that it would be dumb NOT to trade him because he'd net a "very high pick" and then clarified what you meant was "a first round pick, as high as it gets"- fact

As I said, I was clearly spitballing. I wasn't convinced he'd get a first round pick, I was floating possibilities. You're also continuing to ignore my underlying argument behind floating those possibilities, though. 

11 hours ago, WindyCity said:

No one is trading for Floyd making 13.2 million.

He is valueless at that cap number.

You're right. There would have to be a serious renegotiation of that number. Which, of course, would require Floyd and his agent accept that he simply isn't a pass rusher. Who knows if that will happen. It'd be in their best interest if it did.

4 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

No one if given up a first for Floyd dude.

Even in the scenario I laid out? I suppose it doesn't help matters that two of the sorts of teams I described are in the same division. Pace will never know what he'll get unless he tries. I'm afraid he won't.