Fire Pettine

[Leader]

Just now, 40Year Pack Fan said:

After two bad years (and no playoff appearances) with McCarthy at the helm, and we have a 14-4 season, and you suggest it wasn't a mediocre season.....Than where might you be heading?....

I wasnt "spreaking to" or about (supposedly) spoiled Packer fans. Wasnt on my radar screen.

I was keying on the word - mediocre - and simply stating I think our season far exceeded it.

[{Family Ghost}]

1 minute ago, MaryTsraining3s said:

If Dom Capers can get torched by the ageless Kurt Warner then bounce back to lead a super bowl winning defense the next year, I'm going to be optimistic and think Pettine is capable of doing the same. Mostly because.....we don't have a choice. 

It's possible with a boost in talent, and a renewed focus of stuffing the run that Pettine could lead a Super Bowl defense.  Robert Salah is all the talk this year .. last year he stunk.  Gute needs to add a couple more pieces this offseason.  If the offense takes a year two jump it will also help the defense immensely.  I'm sure Pettine is very prideful.  He's going to want to prove people wrong.

[Sasquatch]

6 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said:

It's possible with a boost in talent, and a renewed focus of stuffing the run that Pettine could lead a Super Bowl defense.  Robert Salah is all the talk this year .. last year he stunk.  Gute needs to add a couple more pieces this offseason.  If the offense takes a year two jump it will also help the defense immensely.  I'm sure Pettine is very prideful.  He's going to want to prove people wrong.

He might, but he also needs to get a clue.  Go back to strategy school, teach fundamentals of how to shed blocks, tackle, and hold your gap.  He'll get his lumps this off-season no doubt - it's how he responds - and Gute for that matter - that will be all-telling.

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

I remember listening to Ryan Clark talk about the difficulty of playing zone defenses with young secondaries that don't have a long history together.  To play zone well in the NFL, the guys need to be able to anticipate what their team mates will do on any given play, and that only comes from reps together.  

Pettine was forced into playing zone a lot this year because of the weakness of the front against the run.  To compensate, it appear to me, he went with more defensive backs to facilitate better coverage, but that made the run defense even worse.  He did that because he could win most games that way.

All in all, not a bad performance- he took a team that many thought would win 10 games, and won 13, and got to the NFC championship.

If Gute can bolster the front 7 so that they are competent against the run, and thus can get out of zone more often, then they could be really good.  If nothing else, one more year with an intact defensive backfield will help them play zone better as well.  A new DC doesn't fix the personnel issues.  A couple of better interior DL might though.

Edited January 23, 2020 by Ragnar Danneskjold

[OneTwoSixFive]

4 hours ago, {Family Ghost} said:

It's possible with a boost in talent, and a renewed focus of stuffing the run that Pettine could lead a Super Bowl defense.  Robert Salah is all the talk this year .. last year he stunk.  Gute needs to add a couple more pieces this offseason.  If the offense takes a year two jump it will also help the defense immensely.  I'm sure Pettine is very prideful.  He's going to want to prove people wrong.

Exactly.

Next season I'm looking for a high pick at DL (1st or 2nd) and a high pick at WR (again, 1st or 2nd). I'm also looking for Kingsley Keke to take a jump. I think one ILB is added through veteran FA and another in the draft (round 3 or 4). Those ILB's need to be one coverage expert and one stouter plug the gap guy. We cannot go into next season with Burks and Goodson backing up Martinez. If he wasn't too expensive (which he probably will be) Martinez would be fine as the plug the gap guy. If Gary can also take more snaps from the Smiths, keeping them fresh and making good use of his elite athleticsm, the Packers could look far, far less vulnerable to outside runs by the 49ers. That championship game made the Packers deficiencies cystal clear, it's up to Gute and his scouts to find ways to make this happen.

Edited January 23, 2020 by OneTwoSixFive

[Joe]

42 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said:

It's possible with a boost in talent, and a renewed focus of stuffing the run that Pettine could lead a Super Bowl defense.  Robert Salah is all the talk this year .. last year he stunk.  Gute needs to add a couple more pieces this offseason.  If the offense takes a year two jump it will also help the defense immensely.  I'm sure Pettine is very prideful.  He's going to want to prove people wrong.

No, last year they had a ton of injuries and their offense sputtered without Jimmy G and a reliable receiving threat not named George Kittle or Marquis Goodwin...

[minnypackerfan]

21 minutes ago, {Family Ghost} said:

It's possible with a boost in talent, and a renewed focus of stuffing the run that Pettine could lead a Super Bowl defense.  Robert Salah is all the talk this year .. last year he stunk.  Gute needs to add a couple more pieces this offseason.  If the offense takes a year two jump it will also help the defense immensely.  I'm sure Pettine is very prideful.  He's going to want to prove people wrong.

We'll see.  Pettine has been very open about stating that he believes his defenses have to be designed around stopping the pass as its a passing league.  I think that's one of the reasons he plays with so many defensive backs, the other being the defensive line talent (other than Clark) is below average.  So is Pettine prepared to change his coaching strategy and place more emphasis on stopping the run?  I do not know.  Should be interesting to find out.  LaFleur's statements yesterday about keeping Pettine were evasive at best which indicated to me he still had some questions in his mind that had to get answered satisfactorily before retaining him.  I guess in less than 2 or 3 hours, he made up his mind (or it was made up for him).  Something smells very "corporate" about that quick shift.  My opinion (and that's all it is but I've worked at 3 very large corporations over the past 40 years) is that after the press conference someone got a hold of him and told him that even if he was uncertain of Pettine's status that people above him thought he should be kept.  Then when he questioned Pettine's status in the press conference that probably got them concerned when they heard it..and they wanted to throw water on that fire before it got out of control.  

[Leader]

21 minutes ago, minnypackerfan said:

We'll see.  Pettine has been very open about stating that he believes his defenses have to be designed around stopping the pass as its a passing league.  I think that's one of the reasons he plays with so many defensive backs, the other being the defensive line talent (other than Clark) is below average.  So is Pettine prepared to change his coaching strategy and place more emphasis on stopping the run?  I do not know.  Should be interesting to find out.

I'm confident that if he gets the DL bodies / talent (we dont need anymore "bodies") - he'll let them do their thing when the time's necessary.

[Joe]

I don't doubt we need talent, but we need to move back to an even look. The league may be pass happy, but the run game is slowly coming back. It won't necessarily be a two stud back league, but more teams will probably run to set up the pass like SF, Baltimore, and Tenn. did this year. 

[Leader]

19 minutes ago, Joe said:

I don't doubt we need talent, but we need to move back to an even look. The league may be pass happy, but the run game is slowly coming back. It won't necessarily be a two stud back league, but more teams will probably run to set up the pass like SF, Baltimore, and Tenn. did this year. 

And Minnesota. Cook was the gas in that offense's engine.

Think if we had the DL difference makers in the SF game (read: on our roster) - they'd have been on the field - in which instance, we'd have heard Kittle and their WRs names mentioned more.

Current roster? Lowrey and Lancaster - really should be rotational depth and looking over their shoulders at Adams and Keke - if those guys would ever generate true competition.

I dont think Pettine's gonna park true DL difference makers on the bench simply because he's got some (supposed) fixation on DBs. I think you play the deck of cards you've got. Could/should he have gone to more 4 man fronts against SF? Maybe so. Would they have proven to be difference makers? Cant say for sure.

[Joe]

1 minute ago, Leader said:

And Minnesota. Cook was the gas in that offense's engine.

Think if we had the DL difference makers in the SF game (read: on our roster) - they'd have been on the field - in which instance, we'd have heard Kittle and their WRs names mentioned more.

Current roster? Lowrey and Lancaster - really should be rotational depth and looking over their shoulders at Adams and Keke - if those guys would ever generate true competition.

I dont think Pettine's gonna park true DL difference makers on the bench simply because he's got some (supposed) fixation on DBs. I think you play the deck of cards you've got. Could/should he have gone to more 4 man fronts against SF? Maybe so. Would they have proven to be difference makers? Cant say for sure.

More like 5 man fronts regularly. Keke was a rookie this past year and a Day 3 pick. What are you really expecting out of him. The real disappointment was Lowry TBH. He looked like a solid starter that could push the pocket and get a sack every once in awhile. His tackling eroded, he was easily washed out on double plays, and his overall technique seemed to regress. I would've liked to have seen more Keke and Lancaster in particular. Lancaster isn't a world beater, but he was generally ok vs. the run. Adams is a busted flush.

I don't fault Pettine for putting out more DB's for pass coverage given our pass rush, but even if we have JAG's along the DL, you have to press them hard to perform.

[MacReady]

@LaFleur, it’s not too late to change your mind.

[Leader]

8 minutes ago, Joe said:

Keke was a rookie this past year and a Day 3 pick. What are you really expecting out of him.

Nothing. I mentioned him only in context of him being an available DL option.

9 minutes ago, Joe said:

The real disappointment was Lowry TBH. He looked like a solid starter that could push the pocket and get a sack every once in awhile. His tackling eroded, he was easily washed out on double plays, and his overall technique seemed to regress. I would've liked to have seen more Keke and Lancaster in particular. Lancaster isn't a world beater, but he was generally ok vs. the run. Adams is a busted flush.

Agree. As stated, their role would be best if we could use them as rotational depth. Unfortunately, we didnt have front line bodies to make them so.

12 minutes ago, Joe said:

Even if we have JAG's along the DL, you have to press them hard to perform.

I cant gauge how hard Pettine pressed them - or presume he didnt.

[incognito_man]

3 hours ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said:

I remember listening to Ryan Clark talk about the difficulty of playing zone defenses with young secondaries that don't have a long history together.  To play zone well in the NFL, the guys need to be able to anticipate what their team mates will do on any given play, and that only comes from reps together.  

Pettine was forced into playing zone a lot this year because of the weakness of the front against the run.  To compensate, it appear to me, he went with more defensive backs to facilitate better coverage, but that made the run defense even worse.  He did that because he could win most games that way.

All in all, not a bad performance- he took a team that many thought would win 10 games, and won 13, and got to the NFC championship.

If Gute can bolster the front 7 so that they are competent against the run, and thus can get out of zone more often, then they could be really good.  If nothing else, one more year with an intact defensive backfield will help them play zone better as well.  A new DC doesn't fix the personnel issues.  A couple of better interior DL might though.

Looks to be a solid FA class for DL as well. Would like to upgrade both Lowry and Lancaster TBH.

[skibrett15]

4 hours ago, Norm said:

If you're upset at being down 27-0 at half and giving 200 yards rushing to journeyman running back, you're spoiled. You guys didn't have to go through the 1-9 season of 1863! Stupid millennials. 

I could've sworn that was a season which only had 9 games because the team had to go to war or work on the percussion cap assembly line or something like that.