The QB Thread: Everything Carr, Stidham and beyond...

[bucksavage1]

On 7/7/2021 at 9:44 AM, BackinBlack said:

Most of his fumbles and ints came when we were trailing by 2 scores and he starts trying to do too much. 
So I think with a better team around him, we wont be in those scenarios as much. 

😆

[BackinBlack]

53 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said:

😆

ill take the bait.
Do you disagree with the turnovers coming when we are trailing by 2 scores?
do you disagree and think hed play worse with a better team around him?

NE Fumble - was 29-13 NE with 5 mins left in game.
Buff Fumble - was 30-16 with 5 mins left in Game
KC INT- down 4 with 30 seconds left in game
Bucs INT - down 11 with 7 mins left
Falcons fumble - down 13 -3 
Falcons Pick 6 - down 16 -3 (Brutal game all together)
Falcons Fumble - down 33-6
Colts Pick 6 - down 37 -20  - 5 Mins left in game

To point 1:
Based off your laugh emoji Ill guess you are someone who ripped Derek Carr for throwing it away on 4th down, saying no one would care if it was a turnover. . . 
Well, unfortunately, you are the same person who rips on DC when he turns it over in near garbage time. 

To point 2:
If you think Carr would play worse with a better team around him, I now understand why I have to break down simple concepts to you 😆

 

Edited July 14, 2021 by BackinBlack

[NCOUGHMAN]

On 7/13/2021 at 8:57 AM, NCOUGHMAN said:

 

Anybody else watch this?

interesting points

-why last year he finally found his deep passing game and will he continue this year w/o nelly?

-why was he so happy nelly left?

-the locker room and Carl 

[MrOaktown_56]

3 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Anybody else watch this?

interesting points

-why last year he finally found his deep passing game and will he continue this year w/o nelly?

-why was he so happy nelly left?

-the locker room and Carl 

I don't think he was happy he left but he was happy for him as a person. It's a business and he's had a lot of WR's come and go. If we weren't gonna pay him, it's better he left on good terms.

It's the same reason John Brown took less $ to sign here. He wants to have an Agholor year and then cash out.

[MrOaktown_56]

On 7/13/2021 at 5:40 PM, BackinBlack said:

ill take the bait.
Do you disagree with the turnovers coming when we are trailing by 2 scores?
do you disagree and think hed play worse with a better team around him?

NE Fumble - was 29-13 NE with 5 mins left in game.
Buff Fumble - was 30-16 with 5 mins left in Game
KC INT- down 4 with 30 seconds left in game
Bucs INT - down 11 with 7 mins left
Falcons fumble - down 13 -3 
Falcons Pick 6 - down 16 -3 (Brutal game all together)
Falcons Fumble - down 33-6
Colts Pick 6 - down 37 -20  - 5 Mins left in game

To point 1:
Based off your laugh emoji Ill guess you are someone who ripped Derek Carr for throwing it away on 4th down, saying no one would care if it was a turnover. . . 
Well, unfortunately, you are the same person who rips on DC when he turns it over in near garbage time. 

To point 2:
If you think Carr would play worse with a better team around him, I now understand why I have to break down simple concepts to you 😆

 

At least 3 picks were really not his fault. One bucs one was off agholors hands, the jets one was off Ruggs hands, the Colts one was off Richard's hands, plus the Chiefs one was a forced play to try and get yards with 30 seconds. Hell, even the colts one was insane where their corner had an OBJ catch. I do wish he went to Ruggs on the Chiefs one because Agholor was covered.

Not to say Carr had a perfect year, but he was pretty good with his ints and had some bad luck.

[NCOUGHMAN]

16 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

I don't think he was happy he left but he was happy for him as a person. It's a business and he's had a lot of WR's come and go. If we weren't gonna pay him, it's better he left on good terms.

It's the same reason John Brown took less $ to sign here. He wants to have an Agholor year and then cash out.

I thought he took less to go to ne. I understand it’s a business but nelly being overly happy to leave and carr right there overly happy that he escaped was interesting to me. 

[MrOaktown_56]

1 hour ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

I thought he took less to go to ne. I understand it’s a business but nelly being overly happy to leave and carr right there overly happy that he escaped was interesting to me. 

No way we offered 11-13 mil a year to Agholor.

[true2form]

Did you even listen to what he said?  He wasn't happy he left, he was happy he got paid.

 

[ronjon1990]

1 hour ago, true2form said:

Did you even listen to what he said?  He wasn't happy he left, he was happy he got paid.

 

It's Carr's fault lol

[NCOUGHMAN]

2 hours ago, true2form said:

Did you even listen to what he said?  He wasn't happy he left, he was happy he got paid.

 

How much did we offer him?

[ronjon1990]

41 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

How much did we offer him?

I don't remember anything concrete, but our moves heavily favor "not much". 

I'm not sure we would've kept him anyway. New England overpaid, and I say that as a big fan of his. He "might" be better than John Brown, but no way he's so exponentially better than Brown as to make up the difference in salary. 

I think we wanted Agholor back and thought we'd be able to get another bottom barrel deal. With how long negotiations lasted (seems like we started in with him well before the end of the regular season), it feels like a classic case of him gambling on himself and hitting. 

Given our history with WRs, I'm still irked we weren't able to resign an actually productive player. Grudock wanted to bargain shop and got cocky, and I just hope our WR corps actually takes a step forward or it could be pretty ugly. 

[NCOUGHMAN]

57 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

I don't remember anything concrete, but our moves heavily favor "not much". 

I'm not sure we would've kept him anyway. New England overpaid, and I say that as a big fan of his. He "might" be better than John Brown, but no way he's so exponentially better than Brown as to make up the difference in salary. 

I think we wanted Agholor back and thought we'd be able to get another bottom barrel deal. With how long negotiations lasted (seems like we started in with him well before the end of the regular season), it feels like a classic case of him gambling on himself and hitting. 

Given our history with WRs, I'm still irked we weren't able to resign an actually productive player. Grudock wanted to bargain shop and got cocky, and I just hope our WR corps actually takes a step forward or it could be pretty ugly. 

I can’t find anything concrete either. I agree tho I don’t think nelly wanted to stay anyways. 

[MrOaktown_56]

4 hours ago, ronjon1990 said:

I don't remember anything concrete, but our moves heavily favor "not much". 

I'm not sure we would've kept him anyway. New England overpaid, and I say that as a big fan of his. He "might" be better than John Brown, but no way he's so exponentially better than Brown as to make up the difference in salary. 

I think we wanted Agholor back and thought we'd be able to get another bottom barrel deal. With how long negotiations lasted (seems like we started in with him well before the end of the regular season), it feels like a classic case of him gambling on himself and hitting. 

Given our history with WRs, I'm still irked we weren't able to resign an actually productive player. Grudock wanted to bargain shop and got cocky, and I just hope our WR corps actually takes a step forward or it could be pretty ugly. 

I think it'll be fine. Brown is solid insurance. He's a good enough player to spot start. Same with Snead. Plus Renfrow is not going anywhere. Even if only 1 of Ruggs/Edwards hit, we'll be more than fine.

[drfrey13]

1 minute ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

I think it'll be fine. Brown is solid insurance. He's a good enough player to spot start. Same with Snead. Plus Renfrow is not going anywhere. Even if only 1 of Ruggs/Edwards hit, we'll be more than fine.

This is just like the O-line argument.  What proven player do we have?  Renfrow is about the most reliable.  Brown would have been a decent #2 but after how he played last year he is a question mark.  Somebody will put up stats because Carr will have to give looks to someone other than Waller but it will not be because they are a good WR.  Just they are the best we have.  Same thing happens in basketball all the time.  You are the best player on a crap team you will put up some stats but that does not mean you will even start on a good team.

[MrOaktown_56]

3 minutes ago, drfrey13 said:

This is just like the O-line argument.  What proven player do we have?  Renfrow is about the most reliable.  Brown would have been a decent #2 but after how he played last year he is a question mark.  Somebody will put up stats because Carr will have to give looks to someone other than Waller but it will not be because they are a good WR.  Just they are the best we have.  Same thing happens in basketball all the time.  You are the best player on a crap team you will put up some stats but that does not mean you will even start on a good team.

Renfrow is a good slot. Ruggs will take attention off Waller at the very least. Brown is a proven receiver with multiple 1000 yard seasons who can be a solid 2. It's like last year. Edwards is still a mystery but definitely flashed when he got playing time. The Raiders offense is a basketball team. Each guy has a different role and can do it well. They were better than the sum of their parts last year for a reason. Plus Moreau is healthy and we've added Drake to give us a top 3 RB tandem in the league. I'm not worried about the offense.

Only James and Leatherwood are question marks on the OL. The other guys are all proven starters.

I also think the run game could see an uptick because Jackson and Hudson and our revolving door at right tackle were miserable blockers TBH. That could help the pass game.