beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Just now, redsoxsuck05 said: As I said, give DeGrom the Cy rn if IP doesn't matter to you. Fine by me. He's the only one with a better case than Burnes. See my last post too for reference. I'm not making **** up lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Joe Girardi leaves his guy in because his bullpen is a joke. Counsell doesn't have that necessity. Games with 100+ pitches Wheeler - 14 of 23 starts Burnes - 3 of 20 starts Is this supposed to be an argument against Wheeler or something? Maybe he'd have better rate stats if he wasn't forced to cover for a **** bullpen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 minute ago, redsoxsuck05 said: Is this supposed to be an argument against Wheeler or something? Maybe he'd have better rate stats if he wasn't forced to cover for a **** bullpen. Considering he's never had better rate stats in his career, I can confidently say that's not true. Keep trying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Considering he's never had better rate stats in his career, I can confidently say that's not true. Keep trying. Burnes has thrown like 270 innings in his whole career! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Just now, redsoxsuck05 said: Burnes has thrown like 270 innings in his whole career! What does that have to do with 2021? Literally, the only advantage Wheeler has is innings pitched. If that matters to you, awesome. It shouldn't but have at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) IP: Wheeler (156 to 121)IP/Start: Wheeler (6.8 to 6.1)K/9: Burnes (12.79 to 10.44)BB/9: Burnes (1.56 to 1.96)ERA: Burnes (2.23 to 2.42)FIP: Burnes (1.51 to 2.42)xFIP: Burnes (2.17 to 2.76)HR/9: Burnes (0.37 to 0.58)GB%: Burnes (50.7 to 50.3)HR/FB%: Burnes (6.1 to 9.6)LOB%: Wheeler (77.9 to 77.3)BABIP: Wheeler (.288 to .315)BAA: Burnes (.202 to .210)xERA: Burnes (1.76 to 2.63)SIERA: Burnes (2.45 to 3.13)fWAR: Tied (5.6) Updated. Edited August 12, 2021 by beekay414 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 2 minutes ago, beekay414 said: What does that have to do with 2021? Literally, the only advantage Wheeler has is innings pitched. If that matters to you, awesome. It shouldn't but have at it. Considering the results are only marginally different, I will take the guy who's literally contributed more value by pitching way more. FYI I'm largely indifferent to FIP and SO/BB ratios when it comes to award races, so keep that in mind before you blow a gasket bc it's too late for that **** lol. I'll use them as a tiebreaker if runs allowed and innings pitched are identical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, redsoxsuck05 said: Considering the results are only marginally different, I will take the guy who's literally contributed more value by pitching way more. FYI I'm largely indifferent to FIP and SO/BB ratios when it comes to award races, so keep that in mind before you blow a gasket bc it's too late for that **** lol. I'll use them as a tiebreaker if runs allowed and innings pitched are identical. Considering he has barely provided more value with 3 more starts, mmkay. Wheeler can't hold Corbin's jock strap lol. And LOL at marginally different! Edited August 12, 2021 by beekay414 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Considering he has barely provided more value with 3 more starts, mmkay. Wheeler can't hold Corbin's jock strap lol. And LOL at marginally different! Are you drinking? You're even more aggressively condescending than usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, redsoxsuck05 said: Are you drinking? You're even more aggressively condescending than usual. No. I just don't put any stock into the same **** you do. One guy goes 6 innings and hands it off to a stellar bullpen. The other guy goes 6.2 and throws more pitches. You're putting stock into 2 outs per start as if somehow that makes him more valuable despite their situations being completely opposite. You then make the case that his rates would be better if he didn't have to do that when that's literally never been the case in his entire career. Congrats, Wheeler eats innings. Burnes obliterates batters in 2 less outs per start. And you get to throw out qualifiers like "I don't consider FIP and SO/BB numbers" as if they don't matter lol. Get the **** outta here. There's nothing marginal, in those numbers, about this conversation. Burnes is better across the board and you're sticking hard to IP. If Burnes had made the same 23 starts, we're talking roughly 17 innings over the course of 23 starts. This isn't a deGrom situation where one of these guys has missed extended time. It's literally 3 starts with the guy behind provided damn near the same value as the guy with the 3 start buffer. But I will gladly wait until October to settle this. Fair? Edited August 12, 2021 by beekay414 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) I mean, we're talking about someone with a better K/9, BB/9, ERA, FIP, xFIP, xERA, HR/9, HR%, GB%, BAA and fWAR per start and on the better team (which plays into voting often) but, yeah, 3 more starts makes the other guy more deserving. And we can even add SIERA, ERA-, FIP-, xFIP-, WHIP, K%, BB% blah blah blah. One guy has the clear advantage while the other's thrown more innings. Edited August 12, 2021 by beekay414 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 (edited) deGrom is still the best pitcher in the NL and all of baseball, so don't get that twisted. They could give him the Cy Young based on just how absurd he was and his track record and I would not think twice. Edited August 12, 2021 by beekay414 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 A’s with the 3 game road sweep against Cleveland. Two come from behind wins and a 17-0 blowout. I think we have won 7 in a row now. I thought the offense would take a hit without Ramon, but weirdly, it’s performing even better. Marte has been a godsend for us. Batting over .400 for us and always super clutch. Gomes has also been a beast. All three trades we made have worked out super well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renndawg37 Posted August 12, 2021 Share Posted August 12, 2021 Alek Manoah is a stud. Jays have the best rotation in the division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizardHawk Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 Have to hand it to MLB, they’ve screwed up a great many things, but they did a fantastic job with Field of Dreams. Terrific game too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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