NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 Just now, redsoxsuck05 said: I feel like this is a reverse of the great Zion vs Ja debate of 2019. I was hung at the stake for even suggesting that Brandon Ingram would be better than Ben Simmons, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 42 minutes ago, 11sanchez11 said: I thought Jalen was pretty bad besides just making shots and getting bailed out on fts. I thought both Killian and Cade locked him up every time they were on him. He had a Devin Booker-esque performance for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: I had Cade #2 on my big board, I think he'll be a good pro. Just don't think he's a primary ball handler or a generational talent as some in the MSM and on this board have suggested. He could definitely tighten up the handle (so could Green) and I'd prefer he has someone that can help carry the playmaking duties, but its not like he can't do that at a pretty good level. I didn't watch Hayes all that much last year and he didn't impress me on offense this game much, but I liked how he did on defense matching up with Green a lot tonight. I'd prefer him to be with a guard that can get to the rim and be a good crafty finisher. Is Hayes that guy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 3 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I was hung at the stake for even suggesting that Brandon Ingram would be better than Ben Simmons, lol. You're lucky that Ingram massively improved his shooting after he was traded to the Pels. Simmons was way better at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 7 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I missed the game, just watched the highlights. I'd say that it is impressive if Cade was the better player tonight considering he had 20 points on 18 FGA, 2 assists/4 turnovers, 7 fouls, and was -8 in a 20 point loss. Green's turnovers were worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catcheryea Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 17 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Again some of these are reaches. Coming into the college season Kyrie Irving was not considered the consensus #1 guy throughout the year. In the way too early mock drafts people had him going 5th-6th. Throughout Rose's freshman season there was debates about if he or Beasley should be the #1 pick. Blake Griffin played two years at Oklahoma... Ben Simmons, Cade Cunningham, Andrew Wiggins, Zion Williamson, John Wall, and Greg Oden were really the only guys that came into college as the projected #1 pick and were able to maintain that status throughout their freshman season and then become the #1 overall pick. when kyrie hurt his foot it was the biggest story of the college basketball season. people couldn't stop talking about when or if he was coming back. if you're a top 5 player and you go to duke you will become a household name. you know this. rose was an absolute superstar in chicago in high school. they let him wear benji wilson's number, people wanted simeon to get rid of the no freshmen on varsity rule for him. he won city and state championships in one of the hardest cities and states to win championships. he lost a national championship on free throws at a school most people didn't know existed before that year. he was an electric guard and he got drafted by his hometown team. people could not wait to watch him in the nba. blake was the national player of the year, put up 23 and 14 and could jump out of the gym. what are people not supposed to like about that? he went to a football school and he singlehandedly made basketball cool again there. he was supposed to be the savior of one of the worst franchises in sports. of course he was hyped. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catcheryea Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 4 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: I'd prefer him to be with a guard that can get to the rim and be a good crafty finisher. Is Hayes that guy? at this point no and no 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: He could definitely tighten up the handle (so could Green) and I'd prefer he has someone that can help carry the playmaking duties, but its not like he can't do that at a pretty good level. I didn't watch Hayes all that much last year and he didn't impress me on offense this game much, but I liked how he did on defense matching up with Green a lot tonight. I'd prefer him to be with a guard that can get to the rim and be a good crafty finisher. Is Hayes that guy? Hayes was hurt almost all of last year so it's hard to really say anything about him either way. I liked him coming into the draft though, he reminded me a lot of D'Angelo Russell. I think one thing that might hurt Cade next year is Hayes' inability to hit 3's at an efficient clip. He shot 27% from 3 last year and is 0/6 from 3 through 2 SL games. And as the former #7 pick Casey will probably play him a ton but he'll be useless off ball unless he can hit open 3's, which likely means Cade will be pushed off ball more often than not because he can shoot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 4 minutes ago, redsoxsuck05 said: You're lucky that Ingram massively improved his shooting after he was traded to the Pels. Simmons was way better at that point. I was referring to them as draft prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catcheryea Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: Green's turnovers were worse. i don't remember the third one but the first two and the last one were atrocious ideas and passes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, catcheryea said: when kyrie hurt his foot it was the biggest story of the college basketball season. people couldn't stop talking about when or if he was coming back. if you're a top 5 player and you go to duke you will become a household name. you know this. rose was an absolute superstar in chicago in high school. they let him wear benji wilson's number, people wanted simeon to get rid of the no freshmen on varsity rule for him. he won city and state championships in one of the hardest cities and states to win championships. he lost a national championship on free throws at a school most people didn't know existed before that year. he was an electric guard and he got drafted by his hometown team. people could not wait to watch him in the nba. blake was the national player of the year, put up 23 and 14 and could jump out of the gym. what are people not supposed to like about that? he went to a football school and he singlehandedly made basketball cool again there. he was supposed to be the savior of one of the worst franchises in sports. of course he was hyped. Before the college basketball season Kyrie was not considered the consensus #1 player in the draft though. People legit though Jan Veesley and Perry Jones III were better NBA prospects. How often do 6'2 guards without elite athleticism go #1 in the NBA Draft? Rose was taken number one but again he wasn't a guy that was considered a lock to be the #1 pick all year. It was a debate between him and Michael Beasley who IIRC was NCAA POY. Blake Griffin played 2 years of college basketball... He was definitely a hyped prospect but not at the same level as guys like Oden, Wall, AD, Cade, Zion, etc. Who were pegged as the future #1 pick before the season started and then ended up going #1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 There's so much revisionist history when talking about the NBA Draft. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsoxsuck05 Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 2 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I was referring to them as draft prospects. Ingram was a weird one, though. Everyone was expecting a KD-lite to shoot out of the gym but he barely even shot until year 4. Did you expect Ingram to be better from the start or that he would eventually lap Simmons? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted August 11, 2021 Share Posted August 11, 2021 Just now, catcheryea said: i don't remember the third one but the first two and the last one were atrocious ideas and passes Two in the first quarter were really bad passes/decisions and one was when Cade was guarding him somewhat near half court and ripped it from him and it went off on Jalen. That might've been the one you don't remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted August 11, 2021 Author Share Posted August 11, 2021 Just now, redsoxsuck05 said: Ingram was a weird one, though. Everyone was expecting a KD-lite to shoot out of the gym but he barely even shot until year 4. Did you expect Ingram to be better from the start or that he would eventually lap Simmons? I expected that he would eventually become a better NBA player which is why I considered him a better prospect. Careers aren't defined by a players first couple of seasons. It takes time to really be able to come to a conclusion on who's the best guy from a draft class unless players are complete busts like Anthony Bennett. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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