Rolni Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 22 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: You guys were 9th in yards this season...8th in yards last season...I am a Bears fan...have you seen our offence? 😂 So the numbers are better than the coaching? This is Jon Gruden's offense! Gruden called the plays before he stepped down. Olson called the plays after with Carr. Carr was a master of this Gruden O already when Gru left, so Olson was not a big factor IMO... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 10 hours ago, Mr Raider said: The much bigger issue in my eyes would be the way he handled the Colts job. Seemingly taking the job and then backing out of the job at the last minute. After assembling a staff that left their current gigs only to be left hanging. Giving your word and commitment to an organization and backing out (for any reason but particularly if he did so because he was given a pay bump and a hand shake deal of being the HC in waiting in NE) tells me a lot about his character and how he may handle tough situations. https://www.si.com/nfl/patriots/gm-report/why-mcdaniels-actually-ditched-colts Quote "It had everything to do with stuff that fans don't care about," Breer told The Ross Tucker Football Podcast. "How is strength and conditioning going to set up? Who does medical report to? How does video work? It was all these structural things that, as much work that (Chris) Ballard and Josh (McDaniels) had done and said 'okay, this is how we are going to set it up," somehow, they didn't get around to doing all of that. And Ballard had come form a place and places where the general manager set that up, and Josh had come from a place where the coach had power over all of that. That's where it sort of fell apart. "I don't think for Josh, leaving Indianapolis had anything to do with picking players. I think he wants someone he can trust picking players, and there are guys he can bring with him to Carolina or Cleveland who can do that. I think for him it is more so having the organization aligned properly when it comes to all that other stuff, and having a guy he can trust picking players for him." There was a sound reason for him pulling out if Indy. You only get one chance at a second shot to be a HC, he wanted things set up for his success. No shame in that. Bad look, but always more to the story. I'm more focusing on the positives that Ballard and his crew hand picked him as their HC. That is a good front office endorsement for McDaniels even if it didn't work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jraider91 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Madmike90 said: You guys were 9th in yards this season...8th in yards last season...I am a Bears fan...have you seen our offence? 😂 So the numbers are better than the coaching? He is just your classic old school OC, run to set up the pass and call lots of short of the sticks pass plays. He did do better with calling deep shots this year, the O stepped back without Gruden though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolni Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 9 minutes ago, big_palooka said: https://www.si.com/nfl/patriots/gm-report/why-mcdaniels-actually-ditched-colts There was a sound reason for him pulling out if Indy. You only get one chance at a second shot to be a HC, he wanted things set up for his success. No shame in that. Bad look, but always more to the story. I'm more focusing on the positives that Ballard and his crew hand picked him as their HC. That is a good front office endorsement for McDaniels even if it didn't work out. There is always two sides to any story... My issue with him would be his leadership. Could he be a leader of a team? With his past doings, his ego etc. it looks like a big questionmark to me. If he would arrive under Dodds as our new GM I would feel better I guess, but if he comes with his college pal Ziegler I will be pretty pissed. The Pats is not a good drafting team IMO and we need to start to draft well to build a strong overall roster to have a chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 10 hours ago, Geezy said: At 32, it’s hard to change some qualities too. There’s no guarantees, I feel true leaders are born it’s not learned behavior. Especially in a room full of alphas that can smell bull**** from a mile away Agree to disagree on this. Leadership is a very learned skill if you want it to be and you do the work. I would think a decade between HC jobs would mature him. But you are correct. Locker rooms are filled with all types and you have to understand that and be relatable and be able to push the right buttons. One reason I think this can work for him in Vegas is this is by far an away the most cohesive veteran locker room this team has had. There are good leaders in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, Madmike90 said: You guys were 9th in yards this season...8th in yards last season...I am a Bears fan...have you seen our offence? 😂 So the numbers are better than the coaching? In Olsen’s case, the numbers are far better than the coaching. He was fine as a go-between OC with Gruden calling the plays and Carr running them, and both Gruden & Carr seemed to like him. But he’s extremely conservative in calling a game himself and this was noticeable once he took over as playcaller when Gruden left. He’s had two stints with us as OC and is just a really “meh” guy. Not convinced at all he’ll be the right guy to develop Fields. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 9 hours ago, BayRaider said: Hiring people based off Brady or Bellicheck’s success has been mostly a recipe for disaster so far. The two guys who did kind of pan out in Vrabel and Flores do have leadership type of personalities. McDaniels definitely does not. Once again, Vrabel never coached with the Patriots. He coached at Ohio St. and later Houston as the DC. Flores and Bill O'Brien both had success at HC. BoB imploded when he became the defacto GM in Houston. The issue isn't that Patriot guys can't coach. It's that they shouldn't be given roster control. McDaniels does not seem to want that. To say McDaniel's doesn't have leadership qualities is curious to me. He was Brady's right hand for years. Guys like Brady expectations for success and winning are rare and he was always up for the task. He's praised by former player (the great ones anyway) and an all time great former Oline coach came out of retirement because of him: Quote “I would have never gone back into coaching after my first two years of being retired if Josh (McDaniels) wasn’t the coordinator,” Scarnecchia said. “I just feel that strong about the guy.” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 4 hours ago, RaidersAreOne said: Kindof sounds like we're losing all our staff. Expected I guess but it's disappointing losing Milus and Rod M imo. A year ago everyone wanted to shoot Rod into the moon and were crying for Brenston Buckner being let go. Amazing how things change so dramatically around here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 Good article here: https://theathletic.com/3038371/2021/12/30/josh-mcdaniels-stock-soars-again-despite-scars-of-broncos-colts-debacles/ For those who don't have the Athletic, here are the important pieces: Quote “I think he’s a head coach,” a general manager said. “I think he’s learned from his experience. He’s been humbled. When he got his first job, what was he, 32? If you ask him, he was probably trying to be (Bill) Belichick at the time, trying to be a hard ***, all the things he thought you were supposed to be, instead of just being himself. I think he’s matured. I think he’s a brilliant offensive mind. “He did burn some coaches with the Indy deal. But when you really know the dynamics of why he went back to New England, you can somewhat understand from his viewpoint. I think he’d be an excellent head coach. I think you have to talk to him, and he’ll do a really good job this time through.” Quote “(McDaniels) knows exactly what his quarterback is, and he tailors the offense to that quarterback,” the general manager said. “He doesn’t ask him to do anything he can’t do. He’s relatable. He knows how to talk to these guys, how to teach these guys. If you put him in front of a room of 53 players, he can talk to them as well. He’s got enough knowledge and presence. I think he’d be an excellent (head) coach.” Quote The Broncos were 3-9 in his second season, which included a videotaping scandal, and McDaniels was fired. He was criticized for having a brash personality while trying to replicate Belichick’s style, and he fell flat. McDaniels has since noted numerous times that he learned from that experience; that he grew as a coach, leader and person; that he became more aware of the ways a head coach must operate. Quote “I can’t imagine a more qualified or more deserving assistant coach in this league than Josh,” Scarnecchia said. “The guy’s record speaks for itself, pre-Denver and post-Denver. And you have to take into consideration Denver as well. He is a pleasure to be around, a pleasure to work with, very respectful. He commands the room, but he does it in such a way where there’s no ego. You just get stuff done, and it’s easy and painless. When you watch him in front of the offense, he just commands the room. He can answer any question. He’s to the point. He’s deliberate. He is respectful of the players. The players respect him tremendously. I just think the guy is really, really good.” Quote “I think he’s been around it enough,” a general manager said. “He knows who he is as a coach. He’s not going to try to be Belichick this time. He’s smart enough. He’s secure enough in who he is as a coach that I think he’s the one guy who could break away (from Belichick and succeed). And he’s done a really good job of developing quarterbacks, which is the whole key behind this.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jraider91 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 If I am the Bears I am going all in to get Pep Hamilton in some form, great QB developer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 7 hours ago, FloydFan said: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Robinson_(American_football) What about this guy? We can say Vrabel had no idea about coaching rub off on him during his time with the Patriots, which is in its own right a little far fetched, but how about Robinson. He has been great for them. Turned that franchise around. I live here and have watched it. He absolutely came through the patriot way. I see the sentiment you anti patriot folks are coming through with and share the concerns, but let’s not make it bleaker than we need to. Self care y’all. He’s not a coach he’s front office. Read what I said carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydFan Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 7 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: He’s not a coach he’s front office. Read what I said carefully. Ahhh gotcha. Still think it’s a valid point though. You get the right people in and it can work. You cannot affix the mistakes of others to the current time frame. I’d rather have a couple folks but I’m happy with this hire if it happens. Could be a lot worse routes to go and from what I gather seems most of the league would consider this a win for the franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 (edited) 24 minutes ago, FloydFan said: Ahhh gotcha. Still think it’s a valid point though. You get the right people in and it can work. You cannot affix the mistakes of others to the current time frame. I’d rather have a couple folks but I’m happy with this hire if it happens. Could be a lot worse routes to go and from what I gather seems most of the league would consider this a win for the franchise. I have no problem with patriots front office people. It’s the coaches that make me nervous. My honest question though is like what makes you happy with this hire if it happens? i’m trying to figure out what’s the positive angle on this Edited January 28, 2022 by Jeremy408 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Raider Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 1 hour ago, big_palooka said: https://www.si.com/nfl/patriots/gm-report/why-mcdaniels-actually-ditched-colts There was a sound reason for him pulling out if Indy. You only get one chance at a second shot to be a HC, he wanted things set up for his success. No shame in that. Bad look, but always more to the story. I'm more focusing on the positives that Ballard and his crew hand picked him as their HC. That is a good front office endorsement for McDaniels even if it didn't work out. There are always 2 sides to a story, which is why I said if I were personally thinking of hiring him I would have to hear directly from him his side and why that happened. It may very well have been exactly what they describe. It is also possible IMO though that is a journalist that is doing a favor for someone in the league to help with damage control. It seems to me like a breakdown like that happens well before it gets to the point of McDaniels picking a staff, having them leave current jobs, etc. But obviously I only have an outside perspective. I definitely agree with you on the last part. It does say something significant that a well run and stable organization picked him to be their guy and give him his second crack at it. I am not as doom and gloom as some if McDaniels is the guy. There would absolutely be some things that I look at very positively. But we also can't pretend there aren't some concerns with how his career has gone to this point. That's mainly what I'm saying. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 2 hours ago, big_palooka said: https://www.si.com/nfl/patriots/gm-report/why-mcdaniels-actually-ditched-colts There was a sound reason for him pulling out if Indy. You only get one chance at a second shot to be a HC, he wanted things set up for his success. No shame in that. Bad look, but always more to the story. I'm more focusing on the positives that Ballard and his crew hand picked him as their HC. That is a good front office endorsement for McDaniels even if it didn't work out. I have no problem with him pulling out of Indy personally. It’s all the other stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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