Week 5 Thread: (2-2) Titans @ (1-3) Commanders

[lavar703]

4 hours ago, rbcavalier said:

Redskin/WFT/Commander fans have a major problem. We keep believing and hoping that the team will turn around and become winners. It will not happen!!! The team is cursed with an owner that has destroyed a once proud franchise. We have gone through multiple GMs, HCs, QBs, schemes, etc. yet it is always the same since that curse has became the owner. We will not ever change the destiny of this team until he sells the team. How does he not look in the mirror, remembering as a kid how he was such a fanboy with Joe & Bobby running the team and almost always having a winning season during those 10 hears and not figure out that since he bought the team they have sucked?!!! The man is so delusional that he thinks its always someone else has caused the team to be a failure. He is the failure and we going to the same church of football hearing the same lies over and over again. How can any fan have any faith anymore in this team. How?

Yeah, I honestly don’t ever think they’re going to turn it around at this point. I just keep watching because I’m addicted. 

[turtle28]

A positive! Let’s hope Charles keeps developing into a good guard. He had some good moments last week.

[turtle28]

5 hours ago, RSkinGM said:

IF,,, we'd hired McVay and kept Kyle Smith.. seems so simply. 😊

The whole “if we hired McVay.” Was never a thing. I’ve explained it a million times. Gruden was coming off a 2015 division championship & a playoff game where if a few plays go our way, like DJax actually trying to score in the 1st Q, we may have beat Rodgers & the Packers at home for our fist playoff win in a decade at the time.

Then, in 2016 Gruden had a winning season again. Only time this century we had back to back winning seasons as a franchise & you expect Gruden to get fired?

Coaches don’t get fired if they have back to back winning seasons.

It was just bad timing that McVay got hired the next year. Nothing we would’ve done about it. I will point out that since the Rams have OL issues like we do their offense is also struggling a lot & Stafford is playing like trash. (4 TDs & 6 ints)

So, boy wonder is struggling a bit to find answers for his offense.

Edited October 4, 2022 by turtle28

[turtle28]

2 hours ago, TKellion said:

And the suck train rolls on down the track.Top 5 pick here we come

 

I hope they draft a QB with it if we’re drafting around 5th. Possibly Levis from Kentucky will be our QB next year, Heinicke as a stop gap or Howell if he progresses.

I’d love to get Stroud or Young, but I’m not sure we’ll have a top 3 pick.

Edited October 5, 2022 by turtle28

[naptownskinsfan]

12 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Yeah, I honestly don’t ever think they’re going to turn it around at this point. I just keep watching because I’m addicted. 

Only thing we haven’t tried is the young GM route and giving them complete control.  But even if that is the case, how does that GM know he has full control?  Snyder has taken it back on multiple occasions.  

[naptownskinsfan]

11 hours ago, turtle28 said:

The whole “if we hired McVay.” Was never a thing. I’ve explained it a million times. Gruden was coming off a 2015 division championship & a playoff game where if a few plays go our way, like DJax actually trying to score in the 1st Q, we may have beat Rodgers & the Packers at home for our fist playoff win in a decade at the time.

Then, in 2016 Gruden had a winning season again. Only time this century we had back to back winning seasons as a franchise & you expect Gruden to get fired?

Coaches don’t get fired if they have back to back winning seasons.

It was just bad timing that McVay got hired the next year. Nothing we would’ve done about it. I will point out that since the Rams have OL issues like we do their offense is also struggling a lot & Stafford is playing like trash. (4 TDs & 6 ints)

So, boy wonder is struggling a bit to find answers for his offense.

Snyder did fire Marty after he finished 8-3, and that was a proven head coach who was given GM authority as well.  

But I do agree, I don’t think Gruden was going anywhere.  McVay was on the upswing, and there was little left they could do to keep the vultures away at that point. 

GMSM and Gruden were actually a decent combination together. 

[Thaiphoon]

3 hours ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Snyder did fire Marty after he finished 8-3, and that was a proven head coach who was given GM authority as well.  

But I do agree, I don’t think Gruden was going anywhere.  McVay was on the upswing, and there was little left they could do to keep the vultures away at that point. 

GMSM and Gruden were actually a decent combination together. 

Up to this point, I couldn't blame Snyder too much for some of the stuff he was getting wrong as an owner. But firing Marty after he came in and cleaned house and had the organization on the right path, told me everything I needed to know about Dan as an owner. It took me a few more years to realize that he wasn't just a bad owner, he really didn't care about the fans at all.

[turtle28]

3 hours ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Only thing we haven’t tried is the young GM route and giving them complete control.  But even if that is the case, how does that GM know he has full control?  Snyder has taken it back on multiple occasions.  

Yeah, I agree with that. I want Snyder to hire a young GM & allow that guy to hire his HC but, there’s also truth to your point that will Snyder really give the guy full control? And if he does to begin with & his moves don’t work or the team doesn’t win, how long before Snyder starts meddling?

Regardless of if/when Snyder eventually starts meddling again, I do want him to hire a consulting firm to find him young GM candidates & then for Snyder to allow that person to hire our next HC just to see if it works better than what’s been happening most of Snyders 23 years of owning the team.

[turtle28]

3 hours ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Snyder did fire Marty after he finished 8-3, and that was a proven head coach who was given GM authority as well.  

But I do agree, I don’t think Gruden was going anywhere.  McVay was on the upswing, and there was little left they could do to keep the vultures away at that point. 

GMSM and Gruden were actually a decent combination together. 

Yeah but the Marty Schottenheimer firing was more complicated than that. First off yes, Marty finished the season 8-3, but he started off 0-5 & Marty wanted to keep full control while Dan wanted to bring Vinny back and have Vinny do the personnel stuff while Marty just coached. So, there were disagreements throughout that relationship, I’m honestly shocked Marty ever took the job but I guess like Rivera & Gibbs 2.0, Marty never had full control of all football operations before and Dan was giving that to him, so he took the job.

Totally different scenario though with Gruden who had us win the Division in 2015 & hosted a playoff game w/ an offense that kept progressing into its 2nd year w/ Kirk as the starter in 2016 & we had a winning season two years in a row. Again, only time this franchise has done that since Norv in the mid 90s. So, Gruden is the only coach to accomplish back to back winning seasons in 25 years or around that long.

[turtle28]

51 minutes ago, Thaiphoon said:

Up to this point, I couldn't blame Snyder too much for some of the stuff he was getting wrong as an owner. But firing Marty after he came in and cleaned house and had the organization on the right path, told me everything I needed to know about Dan as an owner. It took me a few more years to realize that he wasn't just a bad owner, he really didn't care about the fans at all.

While True, let’s not forget that Marty hired his brother & son to the staff & if he had other family members who were capable of doing a job in pro football that he would’ve probably hired them too. Nepotism was real strong in Marty’s one year in DC.

Everyone points out - and rightfully so - that Allen/Rivera just hired people or signed people from their past at Tampa & Carolina but, so did Marty, Gibbs 2.0 and Shanahan for the most part.

[Thaiphoon]

6 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

Yeah but the Marty Schottenheimer firing was more complicated than that. First off yes, Marty finished the season 8-3, but he started off 0-5 & Marty wanted to keep full control while Dan wanted to bring Vinny back and have Vinny do the personnel stuff while Marty just coached. So, there were disagreements throughout that relationship, I’m honestly shocked Marty ever took the job but I guess like Rivera & Gibbs 2.0, Marty never had full control of all football operations before and Dan was giving that to him, so he took the job.

Totally different scenario though with Gruden who had us win the Division in 2015 & hosted a playoff game w/ an offense that kept progressing into its 2nd year w/ Kirk as the starter in 2016 & we had a winning season two years in a row. Again, only time this franchise has done that since Norv in the mid 90s. So, Gruden is the only coach to accomplish back to back winning seasons in 25 years or around that long.

Gibbs did too. And yes, I know we had Bobby as GM, but I don't think putting the 0-5 start is a negative given that our best coach in team history had the same first year.

Marty wasn't the greatest coach. Nor the greatest personnel guy. What he was, was a stable influence on the team and he got the stench of Cerrato out of the building and was transforming it into a proper NFL organization. Danny firing him and returning things to the status quo signaled to me that we weren't ever going to be a professional organization.

[naptownskinsfan]

21 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

Yeah, I agree with that. I want Snyder to hire a young GM & allow that guy to hire his HC but, there’s also truth to your point that will Snyder really give the guy full control? And if he does to begin with & his moves don’t work or the team doesn’t win, how long before Snyder starts meddling?

Regardless of if/when Snyder eventually starts meddling again, I do want him to hire a consulting firm to find him young GM candidates & then for Snyder to allow that person to hire our next HC just to see if it works better than what’s been happening most of Snyders 23 years of owning the team.

I mean, with the history of Peter Angelos, Mike Elias got contractual control written into his contract by John Angelos when he came on board as our GM in 2017-18.  Which was a good thing, considering part of the lawsuit between John/Georgia Angelos and Louis Angelos contents that Louis wanted to operate like his father and be intimately involved with decisions.  But there is a precedent for doing that, I just wonder how you go about doing so, and what kind of protections is offered.  Maybe we figure that out next summer when the family goes to court.  

If picking a young GM doesn’t work out, then it is clear something with the team is cursed, whether the land the stadium is built on, or Snyder himself. 

[Thaiphoon]

13 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

While True, let’s not forget that Marty hired his brother & son to the staff & if he had other family members who were capable of doing a job in pro football that he would’ve probably hired them too. Nepotism was real strong in Marty’s one year in DC.

I haven't forgotten that. My question is this. Were they performing at their jobs? I've hired family members before and have been accused of nepotism. Didn't care. Know why? Because I knew what they were capable of and what I was going to get from them and how easily I might be able to work with them. I don't blame him too much for in his first year bringing in guys like Brian to coach/run things. Now, if he had stayed and 5 years later it was the same situation? Yea, that points to a problem. But year 1? Not gonna bash him too much for staffing decisions.

Quote

Everyone points out - and rightfully so - that Allen/Rivera just hired people or signed people from their past at Tampa & Carolina but, so did Marty, Gibbs 2.0 and Shanahan for the most part.

You're going to hire people you're comfortable with and know their strengths and weaknesses when you first take a new job. Not a problem. The problem is if who you hire already has a bad track record. The problem we face with who you hire, is then...performance. Marty went 8-8 in his first year, finishing the year 8-3, while transforming the team. The division wasn't a dumpster fire back then and was still a competitive one. We don't know what it would look like in year 2 and on because he didn't get one. But with Gibbs and Shanny, we had a team identity and the team was actually doing much better after the first year. I think that the first year for Rivera is his high-water mark for his tenure here. We have gotten steadily worse since he took over for the team that Gruden and Kyle/Bruce/Scott built. And that blame falls squarely on him

[turtle28]

28 minutes ago, Thaiphoon said:

Gibbs did too. And yes, I know we had Bobby as GM, but I don't think putting the 0-5 start is a negative given that our best coach in team history had the same first year.

Marty wasn't the greatest coach. Nor the greatest personnel guy. What he was, was a stable influence on the team and he got the stench of Cerrato out of the building and was transforming it into a proper NFL organization. Danny firing him and returning things to the status quo signaled to me that we weren't ever going to be a professional organization.

True. I mean look what Marty & also AJ Smith then did for the Chargers after Dan fired him?

If we had kept Marty, I definitely think we would’ve been like the early to mid 2000 Chargers, and maybe never won a Super Bowl bc Marty never achieved that but if Marty had kept Brad Johnson & Stephen Davis while drafting replacements to develop that we would’ve be like the Chargers. We could’ve been a very good football team that at least was a playoff contender every year and may have won a few playoff games.

Edited October 5, 2022 by turtle28

[Thaiphoon]

2 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

True. I mean look what Marty & also AJ Smith then did for the Chargers after Dan fired him?

If we had kept Marty, I definitely think we would’ve been like the early to mid 2000 Chargers, and maybe never won a Super Bowl bc Marty never achieved that but if Marty had kept Brad Johnson & Stephen Davis while drafting replacements to develop that we would’ve be like the Chargers. We could’ve been a very good football team that at least was a ply off contender every year and may have won a few playoff games.

Exactly. And I think the Chargers built on that and are where they are now because of that foundation. They might not ever win a Lombardi, but they are a professional organization. And because of that, they have a chance.

Meanwhile, in Ashburn...