Best OL in Ravens History?

[diamondbull424]

So in light of rookie Tyler Linderbaum blocking Devin White into the stratosphere, having savvy smart physical vets in Zeitler and Moses, Stanley looking like he’s back in PB form at LT, and Ben Powers looking above average; not to mention Mekari as backup OL for every single spot.

It begs the question, is this the best OL in Ravens history? And if not this OL, which unit are you taking over this one?

And if not, is it simply due to a lack of feats (eg Jamal Lewis 2k rushing, NFL rushing record, etc) or what do you feel makes it inferior atm?

[wackywabbit]

This feels quite charitable. I think they solid and improving, but I don't think this is a great line among teams this season or close to the best in franchise history. 

27 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

And if not, is it simply due to a lack of feats (eg Jamal Lewis 2k rushing, NFL rushing record, etc) or what do you feel makes it inferior atm?

The strength we have up the middle is not even average, IMO. If we had a great O-line we'd have picked up at least 2 more wins on short yardage conversions. Also, the constant heavy formations protect the offensive line a ton, especially on the edge. Honestly they aren't being test much off the edge with few one on one tackle vs edge defender matchups, and we've still lost some notable ones. Also, we're holding less than I'm used to, but getting more formation/snap penalties so far, but that could/should also improve with more games. 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Our 2019 OL was dominant across the board.

I wasn't around for anything pre-2008 so I can't say for those.

[AngusMcFife]

Yes 2019 with Yanda and OBJ plus Stanley was better. 

The 2003 Oline with prime Ogden and the original Orlando Brown was awesome, Jamal Lewis had 2000 yards with Boller at QB. 

The 2012 O-line was great once McKinney transformed into an All-Pro LT for the playoffs. Yanda, Birk, Oher, Osemele.

[DreamKid]

1 minute ago, AngusMcFife said:

Yes 2019 with Yanda and OBJ plus Stanley was better. 

The 2003 Oline with prime Ogden and the original Orlando Brown was awesome, Jamal Lewis had 2000 yards with Boller at QB. 

The 2012 O-line was great once McKinney transformed into an All-Pro LT for the playoffs. Yanda, Birk, Oher, Osemele.

Yea, all the above were better.

Stanley- Hurst - Jensen - Yanda - Howard in 2017 was underrated as well.

I'd call this current unit decent with potential.

[AngusMcFife]

2 hours ago, DreamKid said:

Yea, all the above were better.

Stanley- Hurst - Jensen - Yanda - Howard in 2017 was underrated as well.

I'd call this current unit decent with potential.

Yes, Jensen... the one that got away. 

[wackywabbit]

9 hours ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Our 2019 OL was dominant across the board.

Center wasn't. Skira or Mekari. Also Yanda had already fallen off and was still pretty good, but well off the HOF player he was at his peak. The interior overall wasn't special.

Birk in 12 was a plus at center, and with Yanda and KO being elite was a dominant interior. The "blind side" playing on the non-blind side where he was very good and a good stretch from McKinney was the best O-line I know for this team.

It's not that I didn't watch the teams with Ogden, but I have no awareness of O-line play back then.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 hour ago, wackywabbit said:

Center wasn't. Skira or Mekari. Also Yanda had already fallen off and was still pretty good, but well off the HOF player he was at his peak. The interior overall wasn't special.

Birk in 12 was a plus at center, and with Yanda and KO being elite was a dominant interior. The "blind side" playing on the non-blind side where he was very good and a good stretch from McKinney was the best O-line I know for this team.

It's not that I didn't watch the teams with Ogden, but I have no awareness of O-line play back then.

I was going to say 2012, but LT was a huge weakness all season until Bryant McKinnie decided to stop eating himself to death for the playoffs. 2019 even though Yanda was at the tail end was still elite, we had elite tackles and LG. Center wasn't even an issue. Skura was playing well and then Mekari played nicely when he got hurt 

[diamondbull424]

10 hours ago, wackywabbit said:

This feels quite charitable. I think they solid and improving, but I don't think this is a great line among teams this season or close to the best in franchise history. 

Oh, I haven’t crowned them that yet, I’m a feats guy, but I see this OL as having massive potential that if they earn the feats, could put themselves on the pantheon.

6 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

Yes 2019 with Yanda and OBJ plus Stanley was better. 

My controversial take. I think the 2019 OL was overrated.

First I think the misdirection really took defenses off guard back then and teams like the Ravens and Rams really benefited. Yanda went from being on the decline the (IIRC) two seasons prior to back to an All Pro level. I think defensive confusion played a part in that OL looking better than it was.

Second case in point they were absolutely demolished in the playoffs. They couldn’t win 1on1 battles along the interior. Bozeman and Skura as weak points became apparent when against prepared and explosive interior components.

1 hour ago, wackywabbit said:

Birk in 12 was a plus at center, and with Yanda and KO being elite was a dominant interior. The "blind side" playing on the non-blind side where he was very good and a good stretch from McKinney was the best O-line I know for this team.

This is what I would consider the best stretch at OL play, yet it was still there for only the playoff run.

Also like you my concept of OL play wasn’t there for the SB run. I just remember that JO, Brown, and Mulitalo were great run blockers but pass blocking wasn’t as good for Mulitalo and Brown. I also remember Mike Flynn was the center and IIRC the other OL was pretty JAG.

 

That all said, top to bottom this OL IMO looks to have the most complete pass protecting talent in franchise history. I haven’t crowned them as the best, but my prediction for this OL is they fulfill their potential and join the pantheon. Though they’re definitely more finesse than some of the more burly units of the past, 2003 and 2012 in particular.

[AngusMcFife]

8 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

My controversial take. I think the 2019 OL was overrated.

First I think the misdirection really took defenses off guard back then and teams like the Ravens and Rams really benefited. Yanda went from being on the decline the (IIRC) two seasons prior to back to an All Pro level. I think defensive confusion played a part in that OL looking better than it was.

Second case in point they were absolutely demolished in the playoffs. They couldn’t win 1on1 battles along the interior. Bozeman and Skura as weak points became apparent when against prepared and explosive interior components.

I think in 2019 Skura and Bozeman were playing pretty well. Let's not let our assessment of post-injury Skura cloud our judgment of his 2019 play. Obviously it was cut short by the injury. 

And Bozeman was a pretty good LG, let's not let his play at C not cloud our judgment as well.

I would give the 2019 O-line credit for executing the scheme that confused so many defenses.

In my estimation in 2019 we had 3 excellent pieces and 2 average ones. In contrast to this year, where I see us having 4 above average players and one slightly below average one (Powers), with Stanley having the upside to be excellent. In 2019 the right side could maul opponents (especially when Bozeman pulled), we don't really have a dominating side this year. But it is an interesting debate. 

[DontTazeMeBro]

2014 was pretty nice too.

[diamondbull424]

4 hours ago, AngusMcFife said:

I think in 2019 Skura and Bozeman were playing pretty well. Let's not let our assessment of post-injury Skura cloud our judgment of his 2019 play. Obviously it was cut short by the injury. 

And Bozeman was a pretty good LG, let's not let his play at C not cloud our judgment as well.

I would give the 2019 O-line credit for executing the scheme that confused so many defenses.

In my estimation in 2019 we had 3 excellent pieces and 2 average ones. In contrast to this year, where I see us having 4 above average players and one slightly below average one (Powers), with Stanley having the upside to be excellent. In 2019 the right side could maul opponents (especially when Bozeman pulled), we don't really have a dominating side this year. But it is an interesting debate. 

Good points they can only execute what’s in front of them.

I will say that I’m not seeing a noticeable flaw with Stanley, honestly he looks to be in the same form in my eyes. Though perhaps I’m comparing him to the 2017 & 2018 form since it’s been so long that I can’t really recall 2019 vs any other year (if that makes sense). I need to see more but so far so good IMO. As it stands I’d give him an A- while 2019 was probably A work. (A+ being Ogden)

I don’t know how you qualify excellent, as it’s all relative, but I don’t think the difference between Brown Jr and Moses is anything more than nominal, if at all. I felt Brown Jr needed to be more protected against speed along the edge but when he got his hands on the opponent they were done, while Moses is less protected (mainly because protection has been moreso going to the LT) and he’s been holding down the fort similarly well. I’d grade Moses and Brown Jr both a B+ in what they bring to the table.

Zeitler vs Yanda is a no brainer, however I think Zeitler is on a similar level to Moses and Brown Jr tbqh. I’d say his run blocking isn’t what it once was, but his pass blocking is still pretty darn good. He’s usually providing ample time if a sack does occur and he’s very rarely destroyed in 1v1. I’d say Zeitler is on a similar level to 2012 Birk as an interior blocker. I’d grade him a B, while Yanda was an A in 2019.

Ben Powers is worse than Bradley Bozeman at guard for sure. I’d say Bozeman was a step below Zeitler, while Powers is a step below Bozeman. That said I think Bozeman was a better center FTMP than a guard. He just didn’t have the same support at guard like he provided to his center, but that’s another point for another story. I’d say Bozeman at guard was C+/B- while Powers has been playing at a C/C+ level (Skura level).

Lastly I don’t think center is particularly close. I think Skura was a mediocre center that was insulated by Bozeman, Yanda, and the scheme. I think it made him look better than he really was and that was the biggest weak spot of the OL revealed in the playoffs. Whereas I think Linderbaum, now that he seems to be recovered from whatever was plaguing him to start the season (he seemed to have a slight limp early in the season), he seems to be taking his game to another level. He looks closer to being tied for the best center prospect since Nick Mangold (along with Creed Humphrey). I’d have given Skura probably a C, while giving Mekari a C+/B-. Conversely I think the last few weeks Linderbaum has been ascending from a C+ to a B (and rising).

I think if Stanley continues to ascend, Linderbaum continues to ascends, and the Powers ascends, plus with Mekari as depth… this OL goes legitimately 6 deep and the starting 5 would rival and possibly surpass the 2019 squad.

Though I’m not sure if they have it in them to overtake the level of the 2012 OL in the playoff run. That was pretty special.

[Ray Reed]

I always thought 2008’s line of 

Jared Gaither - Ben Grubbs - Jason Brown - Chris Chester - Willie Anderson

was really good. McGahee/McClain/Rice all ate that year and Flacco always had plenty of time to throw those comeback routes to Mason. 

[diamondbull424]

3 hours ago, Ray Reed said:

I always thought 2008’s line of 

Jared Gaither - Ben Grubbs - Jason Brown - Chris Chester - Willie Anderson

was really good. McGahee/McClain/Rice all ate that year and Flacco always had plenty of time to throw those comeback routes to Mason. 

Yeah the one year where he convinced everyone he had the talent to be a franchise LT if he actually tried at football.

Dude has to be one of the most lazy dudes of all time. At least he didn’t take us to the woodshed, I suppose.

[sp6488]

2009 is sneaky good

Gaither (when he was good) - Grubbs - Birk - Chester - Oher (when and where he was good)

2008 not bad either:

Gaither - Grubbs - Jason Brown - Chester - Willie Anderson

 

Edited November 2, 2022 by sp6488