hitnhope Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 1 hour ago, OneTwoSixFive said: Opinion without context tells me nothing. WHY is Safety in the first round dumb ? Also, can you show that Gute is worse than the average GM in the league ? Without seeing some solid reasoning behind it, I am unlikely to give much weight to what you believe. Safety is far from a premium position. While I believe Gute is below average why is average the bar? Is being a .500 team your goal? Average in the NFL is Death Valley. Based on your response here I know I won't give your opinion much weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, hitnhope said: Safety is far from a premium position. While I believe Gute is below average why is average the bar? Is being a .500 team your goal? Average in the NFL is Death Valley. Based on your response here I know I won't give your opinion much weight. But I'm not the one with dogmatic opinions - that's your territory. Safety may not be a premium position, but the safety you just passed on may have been the last really premium PLAYER left on the board. This is where not giving context and stating dogmatic opinions gets you into murky waters. What you are essentially saying is that even if the best player on the board is a safety, even if by quite a margin, they shouldn't be selected. Also, you didn't say Gute was an average GM, you said he was a BAD one. Do you understand the difference ? Also, just for clarification, Safety wouldn't be a top round one choice for me, far from it, but I certainly wouldn't call drafting one dumb, without considering the details of the pick, like who else was available and how they stacked up against who they drafted. Edited November 25, 2022 by OneTwoSixFive 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitnhope Posted November 25, 2022 Share Posted November 25, 2022 So you agree with me but just want to argue. Being average isn't good enough. It is bad for the team. Get it? Calling Gute average is kind and average doesn't win championships. Tell me who the safety is in this draft that will be the last "premium" player in the top half of this draft where the Packers will likely pick? There isn't one, so it would be a reach. If you want to argue bring some facts and logic to the table. If you don't like that I criticize Packers management when criticism is well earned by them then grow up. Be a real fan and demand better for our team than what we are getting from the current GM. He isn't good enough. Sorry you either don't like to hear it or can't see it. Both are your problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malfatron Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 Things arent looking great 6-11 and the 12 pick is my prediction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tperk Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) So looking at prospects and that we will likely be in the early to mid teens for draft position, who do we currently see as a possibility at a position of need? Would Skoronski or Quentin Johnston fall to us? Or would we hope for Tyree Wilson at EDGE? Edited November 26, 2022 by Tperk add Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneTwoSixFive Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) On 11/24/2022 at 7:15 PM, hitnhope said: Drafting a safety first round would be dumb. Wouldn't surprise me if Gute did that. He's bad at his job. Let me remind you of your original statement shown above, that began this discussion/argument 4 hours ago, hitnhope said: So you agree with me but just want to argue. No, I disagree. I think I'm pretty clear on that. 4 hours ago, hitnhope said: Being average isn't good enough. It is bad for the team. Get it? Calling Gute average is kind and average doesn't win championships. You didn't say Gute was average, you said he was bad at his job. 4 hours ago, hitnhope said: Tell me who the safety is in this draft that will be the last "premium" player in the top half of this draft where the Packers will likely pick? There isn't one, so it would be a reach. Ah, so now you have added some context and at least you are now moving away from a flat 'Safety is a bad pick', to: (this year) "There isn't one, so it would be a reach." I'd say it was too early to determine how the college players stack up, but I am having some success in making you expand on your simple, unsubstantiated statements. Incidentally, it was you that stated Safety would be a 'bad' pick' so it's on you, not me, to back that up. 4 hours ago, hitnhope said: If you want to argue bring some facts and logic to the table. If you don't like that I criticize Packers management when criticism is well earned by them then grow up. Be a real fan and demand better for our team than what we are getting from the current GM. He isn't good enough. Sorry you either don't like to hear it or can't see it. Both are your problem. Again, it is you that made the original statement, not me. I just asked for some kind of reasoned argument why you think the way you do. As for "be a real fan", what you actually mean is " be a real fan and think exactly the way I do". No, that's not going to happen without cogent arguments. Finally it's not that I don't like to see or hear criticism of Gutekunst, it's that I don't AGREE with the flat statement that he is bad at his job (and it isn't a problem for me either, btw). Edited November 26, 2022 by OneTwoSixFive 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hitnhope Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 So I need to post a dissertation on my statement? I said Gute is bad at his job - Yes I do believe that. The talent slide with the Packers speaks to it directly. My original statement was that drafting a safety with our 1st round pick this year would be dumb. If you spent any time looking at players who will be eligible for this draft you would know that it is absent of any prospects expected to be 1st round talents. Some have the safety from Texas A & M getting picked late in the 1st. Rare but some do see it. Beyond that we will be picking in the top half of this draft and need to target more important positions where 1st round talent should be available. The second part of my statement is that Gute might do it because he is bad at his job. He picked a terrible safety in the 1st. He picked a QB who may never see time playing for the organization. At a time when we were close to SB talent. He got no contribution toward actually winning a SB with that pick. He has left the team woefully thin in receiving talent. He has done little to nothing to help out the ST which cost us a SB run. Is that enough context for you? Others stated it with less backup documentation than I if you go back through this thread, so why didn't you call them out? Just because you have no clue regarding the talent in the coming draft doesn't mean others weren't aware that a safety would be a forced pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 2 hours ago, Malfatron said: Things arent looking great 6-11 and the 12 pick is my prediction If we go 6-11 we'd be more likely to get around the 8th pick actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malfatron Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Sandy said: If we go 6-11 we'd be more likely to get around the 8th pick actually. Too many crappy teams and we have the highest SOS so we lose all tiebreakers We are at 4-7 now and are at 13 We go 2-4, and we likely only pick up 1 place Edited November 26, 2022 by Malfatron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 1 hour ago, Malfatron said: Too many crappy teams and we have the highest SOS so we lose all tiebreakers We are at 4-7 now and are at 13 We go 2-4, and we likely only pick up 1 place I went through making picks for the whole season. Draft order with us finishing at 6-11 is Texans, Panthers, Rams, Bears, Steelers, Raiders, Broncos, Packers. You are correct that our SOS is the highest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malfatron Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 1 minute ago, Sandy said: I went through making picks for the whole season. Draft order with us finishing at 6-11 is Texans, Panthers, Rams, Bears, Steelers, Raiders, Broncos, Packers. You are correct that our SOS is the highest. Me too. I have the following getting better picks Houston Carolina Jacksonville Los vegas Denver Bears Cleveland Pittsburgh Rams Cardinals Colts Putting us at 12. I even have detroit finishing with a better record if you want to swap them with colts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnar Danneskjold Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 10 hours ago, Malfatron said: Too many crappy teams and we have the highest SOS so we lose all tiebreakers We are at 4-7 now and are at 13 We go 2-4, and we likely only pick up 1 place 4-13 might be a possibility? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NFLGURU Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) 22 hours ago, 15412 said: I would say more so "QB too" if Rodg isn't with us next year. QB is indeed a distinct possibility one way or another in Round 1. I would say EDGE and OT most likely. If Rodgers stays for 2 more years, you got 2 drafts to find a QB. If you don't take one this year and you are stuck with the 2024 draft to find one. You have a higher pick this year, we'll see how it plays out. I'm not convinced Love is more than a middle of the road QB. I hope he gets a game or two at some point this year, but the Packers should be looking at QBs if the talent is there. JMO. Edited November 26, 2022 by NFLGURU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malfatron Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 2 hours ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: 4-13 might be a possibility? Sure, put im mostly referencing probability We could possibly still get first pick, win superbowl or anywhere in between still Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy Posted November 26, 2022 Share Posted November 26, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said: 4-13 might be a possibility? I think it's highly unlikely. If we drop either the Bears or the Rams game, maybe 5-12, but odds are we'd pick up a game somewhere else. The players have no incentive to try and play bad. 12 hours ago, Malfatron said: Me too. I have the following getting better picks Houston Carolina Jacksonville Los vegas Denver Bears Cleveland Pittsburgh Rams Cardinals Colts Putting us at 12. I even have detroit finishing with a better record if you want to swap them with colts We'll see where it actually ends up. I could see Cleveland stringing together wins with Watson. Cardinals offense is getting healthy. Jaguars have a really easy schedule too. I'm fully prepared for us to go 8-9 and pick like 17th lol Edited November 26, 2022 by Sandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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