Andrei01 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 34 minutes ago, Daniel said: What even is an athletic finesse tackle? Because broadly, I think we tend to talk about guys as either athletic or finesse guys. If you’re both then I think the term is “complete.” That stuff sounds like just betting against the market to be a contrarian. Think Cosell explained it as basically lacking power in his punch and strength in his hands, not being aggressive and not firing his hands. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingTitan Posted February 23 Author Share Posted February 23 I see Joe Alt being like a healthy version of Taylor Lewan or like a Brad Hopkins. Never the best in the league but among the top. Could be a Pro-Bowl player in the right year. I've settled on him being the best in the class that is ready to go, but I don't think he will end up being the best LT career wise. My only push back on drafting Alt or LT at 7 is the idea that this is supposed to be such a deep OT class. I'd love to drop down gain some more picks in that 2nd/3rd round. Get an OT that will have a very comparable career to Alt with coaching and development. Like if I dunno, someone like Mims could be had at 18 and ends up being just as good as Alt, I'd be slightly disappointed, knowing we could have had a combo like Mims, Mitchell, top corner and an another OL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 21 minutes ago, KingTitan said: I see Joe Alt being like a healthy version of Taylor Lewan or like a Brad Hopkins. Never the best in the league but among the top. Could be a Pro-Bowl player in the right year. I've settled on him being the best in the class that is ready to go, but I don't think he will end up being the best LT career wise. My only push back on drafting Alt or LT at 7 is the idea that this is supposed to be such a deep OT class. I'd love to drop down gain some more picks in that 2nd/3rd round. Get an OT that will have a very comparable career to Alt with coaching and development. Like if I dunno, someone like Mims could be had at 18 and ends up being just as good as Alt, I'd be slightly disappointed, knowing we could have had a combo like Mims, Mitchell, top corner and an another OL. He’s nowhere near Taylor maybe a better pass blocker, but Taylor played nasty. When Lewan came out the only question about him was, is he a LT or a RT, but he always played with a edge especially in the run game. I can’t compare him to Brad Hopkins, Brad was 6’3 & was athletic as hell & played with a chip on his shoulder. He’s more like Roos, Roos was finesse a solid pass protector that came from a small school. Don’t get me wrong Alt is good, he just don’t scream top 10 pick he doesn’t jump off when watching him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Hope- Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 not sure how you can watch alt run block and call him a "finesse" player. he doesn't play with the violence of a lewan or, in this class, fuaga, but he's extremely effective. and hell, any tackle we get michael roos-level play from is absolutely worth a top 10 pick. roos was one of the best tackles in football and an absolute steal in the second. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanSlim Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 11 minutes ago, -Hope- said: not sure how you can watch alt run block and call him a "finesse" player. he doesn't play with the violence of a lewan or, in this class, fuaga, but he's extremely effective. and hell, any tackle we get michael roos-level play from is absolutely worth a top 10 pick. roos was one of the best tackles in football and an absolute steal in the second. I think that’s what I’m missing with the Alt discussion. I keep seeing things like “well he may be a Roos, Jake Matthews, Eric Decker level player” and I’m like I’d take that all day everyday. Sure getting an All Pro, HOF level player would be ideal but if we’re guaranteed to get a decade of LT play similar to the guys mentioned, you take that and run with it. And speaking for myself, his play strength doesn’t bother me that much considering he’s among the youngest players in the draft. I don’t even know if he’s got his “man strength” yet. Same with the talk about Malik Nabers play strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrei01 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 18 minutes ago, -Hope- said: not sure how you can watch alt run block and call him a "finesse" player. he doesn't play with the violence of a lewan or, in this class, fuaga, but he's extremely effective. and hell, any tackle we get michael roos-level play from is absolutely worth a top 10 pick. roos was one of the best tackles in football and an absolute steal in the second. Again, Cosell kind of explains this, that he plays with good technique, leverage, and pretty much takes the best angles to take out defenders in the run game. Hence, he wins by being a "finesse" player and not necessarily with power or strength. Which, though Cosell did sound much more negative than I would've ever expected him to on Alt in general, is not an attack on him as a prospect but rather an acknowledgement of his style of play. Otherwise, yes, I do believe Alt is a pretty good and effective run blocker and will be so at the next level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 4 hours ago, ttitansfan4life said: Exactly. Guys are expecting every pick to be a superstar and yea a top 10 pick should turn into an elite player but getting a consistent good LT for the next 10 years is fine by me. Y’all all are missing my point, nobody once said he’s not good or we shouldn’t draft him. As I keep saying over & over his play doesn’t say 7th best player in the draft. I know he’s pretty much a lock in the top 10. I’m not doubting him as a player. I’m just a firm believer in drafting BPA not by need, & my opinion he’s not top 7. That’s why I wouldn’t mind going MHJ, or Nabers & if Nabers not there trading down. That’s my point it’s not I want him to be a superstar, I want value Mr sal, not another Corey Davis a top 5 pick but play doesn’t live up to the pick. Or how we could’ve drafted Tunsil but went Conklin. Again my opinion Alt isn’t top 7th player, we can’t afford to keep missing on talent if we stay at 7 we need a game changer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 37 minutes ago, -Hope- said: not sure how you can watch alt run block and call him a "finesse" player. he doesn't play with the violence of a lewan or, in this class, fuaga, but he's extremely effective. and hell, any tackle we get michael roos-level play from is absolutely worth a top 10 pick. roos was one of the best tackles in football and an absolute steal in the second. He was a steal in the 2nd there you go, we got value in Roos we didn’t miss on him as a prospect. Again I’m not saying Alt is a bad player or we shouldn’t draft him, I simply feel he’s not a top 7 pick. I think you should take the best player available not draft by need. I wouldn’t mind taking him if we trade down but it’s pretty much guaranteed he’s a lock to go top 10. That’s the reason when everyone was 1st saying it’s a must we go LT at 7 & protect our QB, I kept saying repeatedly we literally need to take a WR’s at 7 & draft a LT in the 2nd round, this draft is deep at OL talent, & we literally drafted 2 of the best OT’s in franchise history in the 2nd & 4th round of the 05 NFL draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 32 minutes ago, -Hope- said: not sure how you can watch alt run block and call him a "finesse" player. he doesn't play with the violence of a lewan or, in this class, fuaga, but he's extremely effective. and hell, any tackle we get michael roos-level play from is absolutely worth a top 10 pick. roos was one of the best tackles in football and an absolute steal in the second. Agreed. Mean streaks are overrated. Lewan had to dial it back a lot when he got to the pros. He was guilty of a lot of penalties his rookie year. If you like powerful punches and aggressive play, I get liking Fuaga over Alt. He's by a wide margin the most effective puncher in this class, and I struggle to remember a recent prospect who has his kind of arm power. But frankly, I just don't think that's as important as movement ability. And Alt and Fashanu both move better than Fuaga does. I would also agree with Cosell that Alt primarily uses his length for power, but like, of course he does. He's 6'8" with long arms. He'd be insane not to use his best physical feature. As for whether he's an elite athlete, I don't care that much. Doesn't come off as an elite athlete on film, but a plus athlete is more than enough. Elite athleticism is usually just gravy, and combine stars fizzle out way more often than they succeed. 1 hour ago, KingTitan said: I see Joe Alt being like a healthy version of Taylor Lewan or like a Brad Hopkins. Never the best in the league but among the top. Could be a Pro-Bowl player in the right year. I've settled on him being the best in the class that is ready to go, but I don't think he will end up being the best LT career wise. My only push back on drafting Alt or LT at 7 is the idea that this is supposed to be such a deep OT class. I'd love to drop down gain some more picks in that 2nd/3rd round. Get an OT that will have a very comparable career to Alt with coaching and development. Like if I dunno, someone like Mims could be had at 18 and ends up being just as good as Alt, I'd be slightly disappointed, knowing we could have had a combo like Mims, Mitchell, top corner and an another OL. Lewan without the mean streak is actually the thing I thought of watching Alt play. Don't know if that's because that's what I want to see, hoping he's a Titan, or if it's backed up by Lewan as a prospect. Been too long. I'm warming up more and more to the idea of trading down. Especially if the hype on McCarthy is real. There are so many Day 2 guys I just love that we can't afford to spend the draft capital on. It would be awesome to be able to say, spend pick 38 on Kool-Aid McKinstry, or Jer'Zhan Newton if they fall, knowing that we've stockpiled a couple more picks to spend on receivers. I can pass on Coleman or Mitchell or Franklin if it we can instead come away with like, Jermaine Burton and Roman Wilson. Multiple picks at receiver seems like a no brainer the more I look at this class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 Jake Matthews drafted 6th overall made 1 pro bowl out of 10 + yr career tell me did the falcons get value. Don’t tell me he was good cause we’ve stated he was a solid starter tell me did they get value. Luke Joeckel drafted 2nd overall - pretty much out the league now & is a bust Eric fisher #1 overall 2x probowl. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 10 minutes ago, Daniel said: Agreed. Mean streaks are overrated. Lewan had to dial it back a lot when he got to the pros. He was guilty of a lot of penalties his rookie year. If you like powerful punches and aggressive play, I get liking Fuaga over Alt. He's by a wide margin the most effective puncher in this class, and I struggle to remember a recent prospect who has his kind of arm power. But frankly, I just don't think that's as important as movement ability. And Alt and Fashanu both move better than Fuaga does. I would also agree with Cosell that Alt primarily uses his length for power, but like, of course he does. He's 6'8" with long arms. He'd be insane not to use his best physical feature. As for whether he's an elite athlete, I don't care that much. Doesn't come off as an elite athlete on film, but a plus athlete is more than enough. Elite athleticism is usually just gravy, and combine stars fizzle out way more often than they succeed. Lewan without the mean streak is actually the thing I thought of watching Alt play. Don't know if that's because that's what I want to see, hoping he's a Titan, or if it's backed up by Lewan as a prospect. Been too long. I'm warming up more and more to the idea of trading down. Especially if the hype on McCarthy is real. There are so many Day 2 guys I just love that we can't afford to spend the draft capital on. It would be awesome to be able to say, spend pick 38 on Kool-Aid McKinstry, or Jer'Zhan Newton if they fall, knowing that we've stockpiled a couple more picks to spend on receivers. I can pass on Coleman or Mitchell or Franklin if it we can instead come away with like, Jermaine Burton and Roman Wilson. Multiple picks at receiver seems like a no brainer the more I look at this class. Stay away from Koop Aid Mckinstry I wouldn’t touch him unless im running a cover 2 system, he’s all hype. You want a quality cover corner that can mix it up, check out Caelen Carson from wake forest. Plays the run well, aggressive in man coverage & is good in press bump & run, fluid hips. Not as instinctive playing zone coverage & playing off. But I think he’s going to be a mid round steal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titansfan_13 Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 6 minutes ago, TitanRedd said: Jake Matthews drafted 6th overall made 1 pro bowl out of 10 + yr career tell me did the falcons get value. Don’t tell me he was good cause we’ve stated he was a solid starter tell me did they get value. Luke Joeckel drafted 2nd overall - pretty much out the league now & is a bust Eric fisher #1 overall 2x probowl. If we draft a guy in the first round and don't have to worry about that spot for 10 years, that's a good pick. I don't care what you think of the value, we have got to start hitting on our 1st round picks. Skor looks good, but beyond him you have to go back to Simmons to find the last hit, and who before Simmons? Matthews and Fisher might not have been top 5 tackles, but they were good players whose teams didn't have to worry about replacing them. They were good picks, and if Alt is the same then he will be too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twotonebluenation Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 I wonder if we could be thinking Fuaga at 7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 11 minutes ago, Titansfan_13 said: If we draft a guy in the first round and don't have to worry about that spot for 10 years, that's a good pick. I don't care what you think of the value, we have got to start hitting on our 1st round picks. Skor looks good, but beyond him you have to go back to Simmons to find the last hit, and who before Simmons? Matthews and Fisher might not have been top 5 tackles, but they were good players whose teams didn't have to worry about replacing them. They were good picks, and if Alt is the same then he will be too. Okay so Corey Davis was a good pick at 5 that we let walk in FA. 1 thing we agree on we have to hit on our 1st rd picks but I don’t believe in drafting a player because of need over value. I feel if we stay at 7 they’re other players better than Alt. I really hope we trade down for me. There’s too much talent in key positions of need in this draft, we need more draft capital. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TitanRedd Posted February 23 Share Posted February 23 4 minutes ago, twotonebluenation said: I wonder if we could be thinking Fuaga at 7. If we did this we better keep him at RT, don’t mess him up forcing to play LT, now if he can do it naturally maybe but I think he’s better at RT, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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