GDT: Week 5 - Dallas @ SF

[NoFlyZone]

It’s almost like none of you understand who Dallas played tonight. Just move on. This team has time to build for a potential rematch… but obviously we need to remember who we’re talking about.

The Niners have won 14 games in a row in the regular season. They are by FAR and away the best team in football. Obviously Dallas didn’t measure up to that level of dominance tonight.. but just because a team that isn’t the best team in football got humbled by unquestionably the best team in football that doesn’t mean you need to lose your minds over it.

I know this sport makes people very emotional.. but the highs and lows you people put yourselves through has to be exhausting. Let’s possible make the effort to be a little more rational. 

Edited October 9, 2023 by NoFlyZone

[BigD88]

21 minutes ago, Dallas94Ware said:

I think this is a little overstated cause of emotions of the loss my man...

Dak IS good. The problem is that in situations like this, he needs to rise above being pretty good and be special. He isn't special. He was paid to become special. But he isn't.

But make no mistakes about it. He is certainly good. If you give him the chance he can pick apart a good defense. This is the same issue we have seen for a decade or longer with Romo - you can't throw the ball off your back. And when the heat is on and it's do or die, and you need to force a tough pass that has low probability of completion just to take a chance at trying to pull yourself out of a hole, and it doesn't go your way, it is indeed on you statistically - but too many people forget all the plays, players and errors that led to that nearly unwinnable situation.

This team should have been developing a successor for two years or longer now. It's why I was thrilled with Lance. It's a nice attempt at trying to do something to upgrade or at least replace for cheaper - but there were better opportunities for several years. Willis, Levis and Hooker in the last two drafts. Howell I understand was even on their radar. Ben DiNucci unfortunately was never given a long enough chance to work and grow,.but that gunslinger type could have been worked with and developed, potentially. 

So don't get me wrong. I'm not saying don't knock Dak. I'm saying don't undersell what Dak can do and the impact of the other 21 people on the field with him. Or the abilities of a damn good coaching staff.

This is why I wanted Vrabel so bad years ago, Ryans this past year, Mike McDaniels before that...these strategists who see the whole picture, seem to get the best out of the players they coach and assemble a "portrait" that works together schematically will ALWAYS win the day over a cookie cutter coach who forces players to fit their mold, instead of breaking and creating a new a mold every year.

The last paragraph is spot on.

But as others have mentioned, the Joneses can’t control the ever-evolving strategists.

So we’re stuck with retreads with a standard “he’s done it before” résumé sales pitch. And continuously stuck in neutral.

[Dallas94Ware]

20 minutes ago, plan9misfit said:

I’m not emotional about this at all. I just know what 7 years of empirical evidence has provided. He isn’t good enough to beat solid teams, let alone good ones. I honestly don’t care because I know that we’ll never be a real competitor with him. 

And that is the problem therein, isn't it? Good enough to win, good enough to compete and keep your team alive at the end of the year. Good enough to make you think at times, 'hey, wait a minute...'

But then not good enough to shoulder the team when his contract prevents keeping other players and injuries take away others, and bad situations arise in games. You put him in those dire situations and he can just as quickly make the situation more dire than pull you out of it.

But realistically, there are so few QBs able to pull you out of that dire situation who deserve that kind of pay. Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, maybe Burrow and Purdy will join that tier, looks like CJ Stroud and Lawrence may one day also. But overall of 32 starters, a small fraction.

But Dak was paid to be in that fraction. So it is has long been time to find that successor. I give Vegas all the credit in the world for moving on from Carr for this very reason. Put a band aid there and begin the search. Problem is Dak is the bandaid and the search began about two years too late.

[WizardHawk]

40 minutes ago, NoFlyZone said:

It’s almost like none of you understand who Dallas played tonight. Just move on. This team has time to build for a potential rematch… but obviously we need to remember who we’re talking about.

The Niners have won 14 games in a row in the regular season. They are by FAR and away the best team in football. Obviously Dallas didn’t measure up to that level of dominance tonight.. but just because a team that isn’t the best team in football got humbled by unquestionably the best team in football that doesn’t mean you need to lose your minds over it.

I know this sport makes people very emotional.. but the highs and lows you people put yourselves through has to be exhausting. Let’s possible make the effort to be a little more rational. 

You can sugarcoat it until the end of time, but this team should be past the point of being non-competitive in this type of game. Dak, Micah, MM and DQ. All of them. 

[matt79511]

The amazing thing about the Cowboys right now is that they’re 3-2 right now with zero one-score games. Our closest margin so far is a 12 point loss

Sports are fun because they’re exciting, unpredictable, you know? And right now it feels like you know what’s going to happen with this team before the end of the first quarter. A 10-0 lead either way is insurmountable. And that’s what’s so deflating about this whole thing

[Dallas94Ware]

Just to pour salt into the wound caused by the Mazi Smith lack of impact -

Here are the very short list of players Dallas could have taken at that pick that would have had an impact today, let alone all year, and likely for years going forward. And not surprise finds either, guys that were on this forums - and this staffs - radar, be it mentioned in interviews, documentaries, or vetted at combines, interviews, etc:

G/C Matt Bergeron 

LB Nolan Smith 

CB Joey Porter Jr

TE Sam LaPorta

C Joe Tippman

S Brian Branch

WR Rashee Rice

RB Zach Charbonnett (not that id do RB in first round again but still)

And then not to mention, a QB with the talent and potential to have gone top 10 and no one would have blinked, QB Will Levis, as a potential successor.

Instead we selected a fat, strong, slow nose guard in a modern NFL who can't even beat out a much less talented fat, less strong, even slower nose guard for playing time.

That's what happens when you go into a draft thinking 'we need' instead of 'lets make the team better'

[NoFlyZone]

1 hour ago, WizardHawk said:

You can sugarcoat it until the end of time, but this team should be past the point of being non-competitive in this type of game. Dak, Micah, MM and DQ. All of them. 

I don’t even disagree, but that also doesn’t really change anything that I said. 
 

This team is absolutely good enough to get yet another rematch with the Niners somewhere down the line in January. Nothing has changed in that regard. The problem is the fact that the Niners are simply the most dominant team in football and clearly match up very well. 
 

But does that mean you give it all up? Or that you blow it up simply because you’re not the best team in football right now? Of course not. You just trek along and hope that next time your fortune can finally turn against a team that has been a major roadblock for years now.
 

But let’s not make it more than what it is simply because the Niners are best team in football and showed that in humbling fashion tonight. 

Edited October 9, 2023 by NoFlyZone

[elevators_rule]

4 hours ago, NoFlyZone said:

It’s almost like none of you understand who Dallas played tonight. Just move on. This team has time to build for a potential rematch… but obviously we need to remember who we’re talking about.

The Niners have won 14 games in a row in the regular season. They are by FAR and away the best team in football. Obviously Dallas didn’t measure up to that level of dominance tonight.. but just because a team that isn’t the best team in football got humbled by unquestionably the best team in football that doesn’t mean you need to lose your minds over it.

I know this sport makes people very emotional.. but the highs and lows you people put yourselves through has to be exhausting. Let’s possible make the effort to be a little more rational. 

The reason this loss hurts so much is because they're the best team in football. If we lost this bad to any other team, I could mentally chalk it up as a fluke or just a bad, irrelevant game, but we lost by 30 points to the team we have to beat if we have any hopes of going to the Superbowl. I probably speak for most of the fan base here when I say another playoff berth and possibly 1-and-done means absolutely nothing to me. It would be another failure of a season for our already closing Superbowl window. We got dominated on every side of the ball to the one team we absolutely need to beat at some point.

I'm not even worried about Philly. Their team is obviously very good, but I don't think we're outclassed by them. I think we have a good shot at winning the division given how hard their upcoming schedule is... but the 9ers? What I saw tonight makes it seem like we don't even belong on the same field as them.

[NoFlyZone]

Seriously guys.. reading through this thread.. there is seriously some embarrassing content. It’s one thing for the team to get embarrassed, but you don’t have to follow suit. I know this team is in the spotlight and it sucks when they lose.. but you could swear this is a team with a losing record that just lost to a nobody with how so many of you are acting. You could swear that this is not a team coming off of back to back seasons of 12+ wins before starting this season with evidence of dominant tendencies in their own right. 
 

Are they the best team in football? No. Did they just get punched in the mouth by the best team in football? Yes. Are they still a good team with something to look forward to this season? Yes.

Wanting to throw in the towel after one truly bad loss against arguably the SB favorite on a 14 game regular season dominant win streak is an absolute loser mentality. Find some backbone. So many of you want to blame the people associated with the team that you (supposedly) support, but the second you witness legitimate adversity the tears start flowing and you start overreacting like a teenager that thinks their world is ending over the smallest inconvenience. Pull it together. You better hope this team has significantly more fortitude than so many of you irrational crybabies do. 
 

Obviously being frustrated is one thing, and it’s understandable. I’m frustrated, too. We don’t often see the team get beat down like this. In fact.. it’s the worst loss in the MM era. But it’s one game of football against this team’s biggest nemesis.

Things snowballed out of control tonight… but you move on. We’re still watching a good football team.. and even good football teams get embarrassed sometimes. Credit the Niners for being ridiculously dominant and hope that the team can build enough for another shot at this unit.

Edited October 9, 2023 by NoFlyZone

[NoFlyZone]

22 minutes ago, elevators_rule said:

The reason this loss hurts so much is because they're the best team in football. If we lost this bad to any other team, I could mentally chalk it up as a fluke or just a bad, irrelevant game, but we lost by 30 points to the team we have to beat if we have any hopes of going to the Superbowl. I probably speak for most of the fan base here when I say another playoff berth and possibly 1-and-done means absolutely nothing to me. It would be another failure of a season for our already closing Superbowl window. We got dominated on every side of the ball to the one team we absolutely need to beat at some point.

I'm not even worried about Philly. Their team is obviously very good, but I don't think we're outclassed by them. I think we have a good shot at winning the division given how hard their upcoming schedule is... but the 9ers? What I saw tonight makes it seem like we don't even belong on the same field as them.

This is reasonable. I really agree with most of what you’re saying. At the end of the day, though.. only 2 teams out of 32 are walking away as their respective conference champs. I’m not going to pretend that this group is a bunch of losers and that everything needs to be blown up just because they’re not the absolute best team in their conference. I mean.. if the barometer for success is being on the level of this ridiculously dominant 49ers squad.. then every team in the NFC should be ready to blow it up and start over because everyone will have to go through the 49ers. 
 

All you can really do is see how it goes. If someone told the average NFL fan that the 2021 Bengals would surge and beat the Chiefs in the AFCCG that person would have been called delusional. You just have to let the season play out and not throw in the towel because of some early season adversity.. especially when you’re a team coming off back to back 12+ win seasons with flashes of absolute dominance of your own this current season. Let’s see how things progress. 

Honestly, if this team and the 49ers played again next week I don’t think the same beat down would occur. It was a perfect storm that didn’t go their way.

Edited October 9, 2023 by NoFlyZone

[Rtnldave]

6 hours ago, NoFlyZone said:

It’s almost like none of you understand who Dallas played tonight. Just move on. This team has time to build for a potential rematch… but obviously we need to remember who we’re talking about.

The Niners have won 14 games in a row in the regular season. They are by FAR and away the best team in football. Obviously Dallas didn’t measure up to that level of dominance tonight.. but just because a team that isn’t the best team in football got humbled by unquestionably the best team in football that doesn’t mean you need to lose your minds over it.

I know this sport makes people very emotional.. but the highs and lows you people put yourselves through has to be exhausting. Let’s possible make the effort to be a little more rational. 

And just 2 weeks ago we got beat by the worst team in football.

[D82]

7 hours ago, Dallas94Ware said:

And that is the problem therein, isn't it? Good enough to win, good enough to compete and keep your team alive at the end of the year. Good enough to make you think at times, 'hey, wait a minute...'

But then not good enough to shoulder the team when his contract prevents keeping other players and injuries take away others, and bad situations arise in games. You put him in those dire situations and he can just as quickly make the situation more dire than pull you out of it.

But realistically, there are so few QBs able to pull you out of that dire situation who deserve that kind of pay. Mahomes, Allen, Rodgers, maybe Burrow and Purdy will join that tier, looks like CJ Stroud and Lawrence may one day also. But overall of 32 starters, a small fraction.

But Dak was paid to be in that fraction. So it is has long been time to find that successor. I give Vegas all the credit in the world for moving on from Carr for this very reason. Put a band aid there and begin the search. Problem is Dak is the bandaid and the search began about two years too late.

I’m really LMAO at you including Josh Allen. People want to rag on Prescott when he’s thrown more interceptions than he has over the last however many games. 

He also handed the game to the Jets earlier this year (y’know, the same team Dak moved the ball well against and didn’t throw a single pick to). And he had yet another bad game against the ******* Jacksonville Jaguars. 

Allen’s a good QB, but don’t give me this bull**** that he and Dak are so far apart.

And people really need to stop with the whole “oh the contract prevents…”. Bull****. We see teams with big contracts to QBs manipulate the cap in order to be able to add resources that help them win. The Cowboys front office is just too cheap to to do it and then they sell the whole “oh but this contract prevents us…” BS and you people buy it. 

[Rtnldave]

6 hours ago, NoFlyZone said:

I don’t even disagree, but that also doesn’t really change anything that I said. 
 

This team is absolutely good enough to get yet another rematch with the Niners somewhere down the line in January. Nothing has changed in that regard. The problem is the fact that the Niners are simply the most dominant team in football and clearly match up very well. 
 

But does that mean you give it all up? Or that you blow it up simply because you’re not the best team in football right now? Of course not. You just trek along and hope that next time your fortune can finally turn against a team that has been a major roadblock for years now.
 

But let’s not make it more than what it is simply because the Niners are best team in football and showed that in humbling fashion tonight. 

Dude, this loss wasn't a matter of fortune. This loss is the direct result of a team that is steeped in poor decision making when it comes to hiring a HC, poor decision making in drafting players that can make a difference, poor decision making in NOT being able to recognize the shortcomings of your starting QB and addressing that issue, poor decision making in general because the owners ego is more important to him than hiring someone who is innovative, young, tough-minded and wont take any **** on how to get things done. 

The 2 best teams in league have EXACTLY the things we fall short on. That is why we will NEVER win a title again as long as ownership reads Jones.

[Rtnldave]

1 hour ago, D82 said:

I’m really LMAO at you including Josh Allen. People want to rag on Prescott when he’s thrown more interceptions than he has over the last however many games. 

He also handed the game to the Jets earlier this year (y’know, the same team Dak moved the ball well against and didn’t throw a single pick to). And he had yet another bad game against the ******* Jacksonville Jaguars. 

Allen’s a good QB, but don’t give me this bull**** that he and Dak are so far apart.

And people really need to stop with the whole “oh the contract prevents…”. Bull****. We see teams with big contracts to QBs manipulate the cap in order to be able to add resources that help them win. The Cowboys front office is just too cheap to to do it and then they sell the whole “oh but this contract prevents us…” BS and you people buy it. 

Here's the problem with Prescott and why we are doomed to fail with him. Chris Collinsworth said it all in one sentence last night.

The "Texas Coast Offense" is designed to keep Prescott's turnovers down. 

Now think about that. If you have to design an offense to protect your QB from turning the ball over, how in the hell is your offense going to be aggressive enough to win?

The onus is on playing safe, not aggresive. This very notion encourages defenses to attack rather than defend. Remember the days of "pick your poison?" Do we stop the run or the pass?

In this offense, defenses are foaming at the mouth because they know we CANNOT TRUST OUR QB!

In short, Prescott is a liability, not an asset. Defenses know it. He has hit his ceiling and we have not advanced out of the Div round. 

It's time to consider other options. Perhaps Lance isn't ready to take the reigns or we should wait until we are mathematically eliminated from post season play? I don't know. That is a decision a competent HC would know how to make. Shame we don't have one of those either.

[D82]

1 hour ago, Rtnldave said:

Here's the problem with Prescott and why we are doomed to fail with him. Chris Collinsworth said it all in one sentence last night.

The "Texas Coast Offense" is designed to keep Prescott's turnovers down. 

Now think about that. If you have to design an offense to protect your QB from turning the ball over, how in the hell is your offense going to be aggressive enough to win?

The onus is on playing safe, not aggresive. This very notion encourages defenses to attack rather than defend. Remember the days of "pick your poison?" Do we stop the run or the pass?

In this offense, defenses are foaming at the mouth because they know we CANNOT TRUST OUR QB!

In short, Prescott is a liability, not an asset. Defenses know it. He has hit his ceiling and we have not advanced out of the Div round. 

It's time to consider other options. Perhaps Lance isn't ready to take the reigns or we should wait until we are mathematically eliminated from post season play? I don't know. That is a decision a competent HC would know how to make. Shame we don't have one of those either.

I disagree wholeheartedly. Dak is more than a capable QB and other QBs that are viewed more favorably are more turnover prone than he is (and the numbers back this up) - but, I digress. 

I think a point has been reached where it's best that both sides separate if this team does not reach the NFC Championship Game this season - at the very least. 

Do I think it'll matter? Likely not. I think you could have Patrick Mahomes here and Dallas would still attain the same level of success it has over the last decade or so because ultimately the one problem in Dallas is the same one that has been there since 1996 - Jerry Jones and his son. They both will do just enough to ensure this franchise stays relevant enough to have the fairweather big spenders buy tickets and sell jerseys and sell the idea that "Hey, we're so close we just need yada yada yada to happen" so that people buy in. Meanwhile they'll continue to squander the careers of future Hall of Fame and really good players. 

My involvement with the team has really dropped over the last three years - used to be I'd watch a Cowboys game until the very end, no matter the score. I used to get angry and upset when they'd lose (especially in disappointing fashion). It used to throw off my entire day. 

Now, eh. I've come to expect it. I gain more enjoyment watching other teams and being a neutral party. I've kind of taken on Houston as a team to support now living in the area. If Dallas wins, great. If they lose...ah well. I've come to accept the fact that so long as the Jones's and their nepotism run this franchise, nothing will ever change - so why invest myself in it?