Last Games in a Packer Uniform - 2017 Edition

[MacReady]

Just now, ChaRisMa said:

So we agree a player who's played 3 full seasons, produced very little, and has no interesting traits does indeed stink.

Yes.  We agree there.  Where we disagree is whether or not any of the players you mentioned fit this description.  None of them do except for Allison.  I'll give you Allison. 

Hundley is the best backup we could hope for unless we were to sign someone else.  Agree/disagree?

Fackrell has some solid traits and isn't at this point a bust.  He hasn't played 3 full seasons, he's produced more than a lot of players and he has interesting traits.  Agree/disagree?

Davis hasn't played three seasons.  He's shown improvement in the return game and is currently the 5th best punt returner in the NFL.  Agree/disagree?

I feel like you're trying to muddy the discussion because you don't want to admit you were wrong about Fackrell/Davis/Hundley and them 100% being replaceable by an UDFA next year.  Even Allison is doing more for us next year than an UDFA.  That's how this all started. 

[ChaRisMa]

9 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Yes.  We agree there.  Where we disagree is whether or not any of the players you mentioned fit this description.  None of them do except for Allison.  I'll give you Allison. 

Hundley is the best backup we could hope for unless we were to sign someone else.  Agree/disagree?

Fackrell has some solid traits and isn't at this point a bust.  He hasn't played 3 full seasons, he's produced more than a lot of players and he has interesting traits.  Agree/disagree?

Davis hasn't played three seasons.  He's shown improvement in the return game and is currently the 5th best punt returner in the NFL.  Agree/disagree?

I feel like you're trying to muddy the discussion because you don't want to admit you were wrong about Fackrell/Davis/Hundley and them 100% being replaceable by an UDFA next year.  Even Allison is doing more for us next year than an UDFA.  That's how this all started. 

Hundley has 9 games, 8 starts in this, his third year, with a surrounding cast that another QB has shown is capable of putting up MVP caliber numbers behind. He's completed 61% of his passes for 1664 yards, 8 TDS, and 10 INTs and a 71.5 Rating. He has the lowest YPA in the NFL. What will be different for him next year? Is the fourth year the year QBs figure it out? He stinks this year. He will stink next year. I'll take the unknown guy over someone who is a clear bust.

Fackrell is a 26 year old who has shown very little ability to make plays for himself. At 6'5" 245 pounds he's neither strong enough to bull rush and his long legs and strides make bending the edge difficult. What do you think he will develop next year to change his ability? Because he apparently can't add the strength to bull rush and he can't shrink his legs either.

Trevor Davis is the worst punt returner in the NFL. Statistically, no problem there. The problem is that his average got a huge boost from his 65 yard return which as you can see in the video below he had absolutely no business getting. He really shouldn't have even fielded the ball at the 9 yard line. Cleveland has him stopped at the 15 but then they remember they are Cleveland, and it's time for one mans inability to take himself and three of his teammates out of the fold. Which is then followed by another Brown making the least athletic tackles attempt anyone has seen from a player with a linebacker number.

http://www.packers.com/media-center/videos/Cant-Miss-Play-Trevor-Davis-makes-huge-65-yard-punt-return/6350d616-e921-42b5-ae55-6509c08ce41a

Without that 65 yard return he's 15th. Which is still respectable, especially given it's Davis' first year fielding punts. But what makes Trevor Davis the worst punt returner in the NFL is his decision making. Against Seattle, he fair caught a ball at his own 5 yard line. Last week, he did it again, with no one within ten yards of him. The guy doesn't understand his job includes making the right decision on when to return, when to fair catch, and when the get the hell out of the way. The average NFL PR guy makes the right call while the ball is in the air probably 90% of the time, with the other 10% resulting in something good/bad/horrific happening. But not Trevor. Trevor only lets the ball bounce when its outside the twenty, only fair catches the ball inside his own 20, and only returns the ball when there is no one near him, unless he's standing at his own 5 yard line, in which case its a mandatory fair catch. His job is to get us the best field position possible, which he fails at every week via either poor judgment, or stupidity. Not to mention, his body hasn't developed either.

There are UDFAs with better odds to not suck at these things, because we can look at these guys and know they suck at them. 

[cooters22]

3 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Yes.  We agree there.  Where we disagree is whether or not any of the players you mentioned fit this description.  None of them do except for Allison.  I'll give you Allison. 

Hundley is the best backup we could hope for unless we were to sign someone else.  Agree/disagree?

Fackrell has some solid traits and isn't at this point a bust.  He hasn't played 3 full seasons, he's produced more than a lot of players and he has interesting traits.  Agree/disagree?

Davis hasn't played three seasons.  He's shown improvement in the return game and is currently the 5th best punt returner in the NFL.  Agree/disagree?

I feel like you're trying to muddy the discussion because you don't want to admit you were wrong about Fackrell/Davis/Hundley and them 100% being replaceable by an UDFA next year.  Even Allison is doing more for us next year than an UDFA.  That's how this all started. 

All I can say is that Mycah Hyde had 76 punt returns in his career with us, went the distance three times and he knew when to fair catch and not fair catch, Trevor Davis has yet to go the distance and I gotta buy myself a tv because I kicked mine in last time the dip**** had a fair catch inside the five yard line. And considering he's our fifth receiver and he has 5 career catches, I hope, no I pray he isn't back. 

Allison has a bright future. 

Hundley will be back, but I'd try my darndest to sign a vet this offseason like the Vikes and Philly have done. 

Fackrell showed me a little this last game, not sure it's enough but atleast it's a start. 

[MacReady]

5 hours ago, ChaRisMa said:

There are UDFAs with better odds to not suck at these things, because we can look at these guys and know they suck at them. 

Gonna just have to let this argument die.  I don't believe that any first year undrafted free agent is going to be as effective as Hundley, Davis or Fackrell.  You do.  We'll have to see if the professional Packers management and coaching staff agree.  My money is on Hundley/Davis/Fackrell either being on the roster or being traded next year and none of them being replaced by an undrafted rookie free agent.  All that's left to do is see what happens. 

[{Family Ghost}]

3 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Gonna just have to let this argument die.  I don't believe that any first year undrafted free agent is going to be as effective as Hundley, Davis or Fackrell.  You do.  We'll have to see if the professional Packers management and coaching staff agree.  My money is on Hundley/Davis/Fackrell either being on the roster or being traded next year and none of them being replaced by an undrafted rookie free agent.  All that's left to do is see what happens. 

It doesn't matter .. those three players are terrible .. just might be a little better shade of terrible than your typical UDFA.  

[ChaRisMa]

7 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Gonna just have to let this argument die.  I don't believe that any first year undrafted free agent is going to be as effective as Hundley, Davis or Fackrell.  You do.  We'll have to see if the professional Packers management and coaching staff agree.  My money is on Hundley/Davis/Fackrell either being on the roster or being traded next year and none of them being replaced by an undrafted rookie free agent.  All that's left to do is see what happens. 

It’s very hard to get on that list. If we were a rebuilding team I’d have more patience with Fackrell. But we are a contender and we can’t waste that trying to win the war on what percentage of my team was drafted by my team. To be the best you gotta leave emotions at the door, and....

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/degrassi/images/2/24/Breakfast_Club_4.gif/revision/latest?cb=20131111042849

[cooters22]

Got this tidbit from Pete Daughtery of the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel: 

Trevor Davis: The third-year receiver is as fast as anyone on the Packers’ offense but hasn’t been able to get on the field (14 snaps total going into Saturday night). We might have seen a glimpse of why in his 16-snap stint against the Vikings.

In the third quarter Hundley overthrew him slightly with a deep ball along the sideline, and for some reason Davis didn’t lay out for the catch. It sure looked like he would have had a shot at the ball if he’d dived, but he didn’t even reach out for it. That was inexplicable.

The next play was basically the same throw to the same spot to Randall Cobb, though this one was probably even a touch more overthrown. Cobb laid out for the ball but was unable to make the catch. Davis is playing these next couple weeks for next year, and he needs to show the coaches and scouts he should be on the field in 2018. He didn’t do that Saturday night.

[MNPackfan32]

13 hours ago, cooters22 said:

Trevor Davis has yet to go the distance and I gotta buy myself a tv because I kicked mine in last time the dip**** had a fair catch inside the five yard line. 

?? I laughed too hard at this. It's true though, drives me insane. He has the ability, he has shown he can be a decent returner. I want to see us make an effort to get him the ball in Detroit. I'm still intrigued by his speed and agility with the ball in his hands.

[MacReady]

1 hour ago, ChaRisMa said:

It’s very hard to get on that list. If we were a rebuilding team I’d have more patience with Fackrell. But we are a contender and we can’t waste that trying to win the war on what percentage of my team was drafted by my team. To be the best you gotta leave emotions at the door, and....

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/degrassi/images/2/24/Breakfast_Club_4.gif/revision/latest?cb=20131111042849

I don't have a problem with cutting any of them, and you gotta stop this argument because  your argument is FAR from fair.  This whole thing started by YOU saying that you were 100% SURE any UDFA could replace their production.

That is fundamentally not true.  I would cut Hundley/Davis/Fackrell today if there was a better option available than them.  I mean this with the utmost respect and I'm really not trying to be a jerk, but you're out of your mind if you think we have a 10% chance at finding a better option than Hundley/Fackrell/Davis as an undrafted free agent next year. 

I don't know why you find it so difficult to admit you exaggerated. 

[Joe]

I don't think we can really evaluate too many defensive players until we see what they look like in a new scheme. We let three defensive players go that all went to have stellar seasons elsewhere. That has rarely happened with this organization and it's the Dom effect. Dom has to go, period; we all know this. The only defensive player to be let go in which we can agree unanimously is Demitri Goodson. I suspect that he'll stay around as well...

 

However, I can buy that Brooks probably won't be back. I want to buy that Rodgers and Hammerstein won't be back but that leaves us with only 1 TE unless we moved Michael Clark inside(there's an interesting idea); the TE class is fairly weak this year. Trevor Davis isn't going anywhere and neither is Hundley.

[SassyFascistAlphaGuy]

Get Aldon Smith to replace Ahmad Brooks

Get Austin Seferian-Jenkins to replace Richard Rodgers

Get Sammy Watkins to replace Randall Cobb

Cut Jordy

Spend a high pick on a good WR that isn't slow

Spend the highest pick you have on the best pass rusher you can find (the market is bare).

But most importantly..

FIRE

CAPERS

[MNPackfan32]

10 minutes ago, SassyFascistAlphaGuy said:

Get Aldon Smith to replace Ahmad Brooks

Get Austin Seferian-Jenkins to replace Richard Rodgers

Get Sammy Watkins to replace Randall Cobb

Cut Jordy

Spend a high pick on a good WR that isn't slow

Spend the highest pick you have on the best pass rusher you can find (the market is bare).

But most importantly..

FIRE

CAPERS

Ok, but I haven't bought Madden in years, so these guys aren't even on there...

[MacReady]

Just now, SassyFascistAlphaGuy said:

Get Aldon Smith to replace Ahmad Brooks

Get Austin Seferian-Jenkins to replace Richard Rodgers

Get Sammy Watkins to replace Randall Cobb

Cut Jordy

Spend a high pick on a good WR that isn't slow

Spend the highest pick you have on the best pass rusher you can find (the market is bare).

But most importantly..

FIRE

CAPERS

Only problem I hae with any of this is that if we sign Watkins, we really don't need to draft a WR high or cut Jordy.  Watkins is 24 years old.  If we sign him, we don't need to draft a receiver, and we don't cut Jordy.  Cutting Cobb is fine in this scenario.  Everything else I'm fine with. 

[AlexGreen#20]

You guys don't realize how dumb Aldon Smith is.

On top of that, his addiction problems are BAD.

[gizmo2012]

10 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Only problem I hae with any of this is that if we sign Watkins, we really don't need to draft a WR high or cut Jordy.  Watkins is 24 years old.  If we sign him, we don't need to draft a receiver, and we don't cut Jordy.  Cutting Cobb is fine in this scenario.  Everything else I'm fine with. How about the Packers go for a difference maker on offense and do somethign with the defesne staqrtign with a complete coaching overhaul. 

 

So sign the oft injured and under performing Watkins and cut Jordy who was havin a good year until Rodgers got hurt LOL. You people I swear.