ThatJerkDave Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 1 hour ago, Refugee said: They also drafted Hooker in the 3rd so it really depends on what they see in him. People counting on Detroit’s demise might end up disappointed. They drafted well and built up their lines. They got a steal with St. Brown who they will have to pay. They won’t keep everyone but if they do have even a decent QB in Hooker, they will be cap rich to pay some me of their premium guys. Detroit has also drafted some quality players even if people felt they drafted them too early. Branch was the guy we had at pick 45 that we ended up trading for Reed, Wicks and Brooks. I like how it worked for us but Branch can play and would fill a major need for us. They have reset the culture and kept their OC but just as importantly built a solid foundation of talent. Even if they slip a bit I believe we’ll be tangling with them for years to come for this division. I agree on all fronts except Hendon Hooker. I don't have any faith in him. Also, I am biased against Tennessee. In fact, I think that is the only SEC team that I don't like... until Texas and Oklahoma join. So it is very possible that I am wrong about him. The Lions were a 12 win team this season. That is a playoff team with a solid roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refugee Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 17 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: I agree on all fronts except Hendon Hooker. I don't have any faith in him. Also, I am biased against Tennessee. In fact, I think that is the only SEC team that I don't like... until Texas and Oklahoma join. So it is very possible that I am wrong about him. The Lions were a 12 win team this season. That is a playoff team with a solid roster. I have no idea and don’t watch college ball but they obviously saw something in him to make him a project in the 3rd. I’m sure he’ll play in August and we can all see what’s cooking. Either way, they have one more year with Goff at mid level money. If they don’t think they can make their system work with another QB they will pay him but I don’t think that is their only option. Mainly, they have built up their OLine and have talent at RB and TE they will continue to be a tough out and I think people are writing them off because it’s the Lions. Either way, they’re just another hurdle for us to get to where we want to be. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 7 hours ago, ThatJerkDave said: That does remain to be seen. But if you look at their last three drafts: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/det/draft.htm they have selected a lot of guys that have at least contributed, through all rounds. Of course they are going to have to continue to draft well to remain a good team, that is a given. And in my estimation, they have put together a pretty good little stretch of doing just that recently. They also still have a pretty good young base to carry them for a couple more seasons even if they start drafting worse. Detroit has definitely drafted well the last few years. Helps to have high picks and multiple of them in round 1/2. Hitting on day 3 picks at a high % is easier said than done over a long enough number of years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 9 hours ago, squire12 said: Hutchinson, Sewell, Gibbs, Decker, Ragnow, Campbell and all top 20 picks. Lets see how well Detroit finds quality players picking late 20s Fair, but also as That Jerk points out, they've done well getting quality players later; their scouting and personnel depts seem to be on-point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 15 hours ago, spilltray said: I will laugh if they pay Goff. Right now he's cheap for them, but I don't see him as anything more than "solid" 10 hours ago, spilltray said: I also have zero faith Hooker is a viable replacement. As of right now I see nothing to convince me this is or isn't a blip. I see GB fans are still in denial about DET. The Lions have become a well run organization. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 38 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said: I see GB fans are still in denial about DET. The Lions have become a well run organization. Are they really? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 1 hour ago, spilltray said: Are they really? Exhibit A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brit Pack Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 2 hours ago, squire12 said: Detroit has definitely drafted well the last few years. Helps to have high picks and multiple of them in round 1/2. Hitting on day 3 picks at a high % is easier said than done over a long enough number of years Brad Holmes is a stud GM and he has drafted exceptionally well since coming in 2021. Great dude, started working in 2002 for a car rental company, got a PR internship in the NBA, moved over to the NFL in the same role with the Rams, then became a scout for them, and moved up to director of college scouting by 2013 and finally a GM. He also brought with him former Packer John Dorsey in 2021 too. Dan Campbell came in as well in 2021. Virtually all day 3 players in 2021 have been contributors and some studs too Alim McNeill - 3rd - good/stud - 5 sacks in 2023 Ifeatu Melifonwu - 3rd - good - 3 sacks and 2 picks in 2023 Amon-Ra St. Brown -4th - stud Derrick Barnes - 4th - arite - 4 sacks 200 tackles in 3 seasons as a LB 2022 Kerby Joseph - 3rd - stud Malcolm Rodriguez - 6th - contributed in 2022 not so much in 2023 James Houston 6th - 8 sacks in 7 games as rookie, injured all of 2023 Holmes and his crew have definetly had the ability to draft well beyond the first couple of rounds. They have done good in FA bringing in Montgomery, Glasgow, Josh Reynolds, they signed Badgley a stud kicker. Now in 2024 they actually have some serious cap space to play with and are currently sitting on $61m. They have Goff on a $21m base salary with a $5m dead cap, so they could extend and create even more cap space here. They could create further cap space if they wanted to, they have $30m sitting in high base salaries across 4 players and extending/converting is an option. Their window is now and the Holmes and Campbell partnership is doing very well. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 30 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said: Exhibit A They've built an offense but still have a pretty mediocre defense. They've done ok so far but I think Campbell crosses the line between aggressive and foolish. Then as far as draft picks... Sure they set themselves well and hit on a bunch, however... I strongly question drafting players like Williams at 12 (2022) and to a smaller degree a RB and off ball LB last year (even if those picks are reasonably productive). They got lucky on Goff as a reclamation project, but if they end up paying him 50/mil a year they could very well end up in purgatory very quickly and everything falls apart. One playoff trip doesn't prove that this isn't a blip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 1 hour ago, spilltray said: Are they really? We really have since 2021 to evaluate their current GM/Executive VP, Brad Holmes. Since then, he has seemed to right the ship. That is step one. Step two is maintaining. That is more difficult. There is nothing indicating that he can't continue to draft well and manage the roster well. Matt Millen being a joke of a GM has as much bearing on the Lions as Tom Braatz does on the Packers. I am not proclaiming them to be the next dynasty. But I can't dismiss a team that has been on an upward trajectory and won 60% of its games in the last two seasons, especially when they started the previous season 1-6 and have gone 20-7 since, and just won the division by 3 games. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazrimiv Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 13 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: We really have since 2021 to evaluate their current GM/Executive VP, Brad Holmes. Since then, he has seemed to right the ship. That is step one. Step two is maintaining. That is more difficult. There is nothing indicating that he can't continue to draft well and manage the roster well. Matt Millen being a joke of a GM has as much bearing on the Lions as Tom Braatz does on the Packers. I am not proclaiming them to be the next dynasty. But I can't dismiss a team that has been on an upward trajectory and won 60% of its games in the last two seasons, especially when they started the previous season 1-6 and have gone 20-7 since, and just won the division by 3 games. It's the "they are nothing but a blip" talk that I don't get. Much like GB, DET still has plenty to prove, but is on a clear upward trajectory. Many GB fans want to believe 2023 was some kind of fluke for DET. It wasn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 5 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said: It's the "they are nothing but a blip" talk that I don't get. Much like GB, DET still has plenty to prove, but is on a clear upward trajectory. Many GB fans want to believe 2023 was some kind of fluke for DET. It wasn't. I don't think they really have an upward trajectory. Between Goff being who he is and Campbell mistaking stupidity for aggression, I think there are some fundamental flaws that make an incoming implosion a very real possibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 42 minutes ago, spilltray said: Campbell mistaking stupidity for aggression Well there's no way to explain things to this guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spilltray Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 29 minutes ago, Mr Bad Example said: Well there's no way to explain things to this guy Oh please explain it to me. Going for it on 4th cost them multiple games this year and will continue to cost them close games vs good teams. I don't see a rational argument to defend Campbell from literally throwing the game away because he doesn't know when to just take the points. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 so drafting well for a few years is not the concern.... it is doing it over a long enough span of time to remain a top contender. you mentioned 3 years, which is great 3 hours ago, Brit Pack said: Brad Holmes is a stud GM and he has drafted exceptionally well since coming in 2021. Great dude, started working in 2002 for a car rental company, got a PR internship in the NBA, moved over to the NFL in the same role with the Rams, then became a scout for them, and moved up to director of college scouting by 2013 and finally a GM. He also brought with him former Packer John Dorsey in 2021 too. Dan Campbell came in as well in 2021. Virtually all day 3 players in 2021 have been contributors and some studs too Alim McNeill - 3rd - good/stud - 5 sacks in 2023 Ifeatu Melifonwu - 3rd - good - 3 sacks and 2 picks in 2023 Amon-Ra St. Brown -4th - stud Derrick Barnes - 4th - arite - 4 sacks 200 tackles in 3 seasons as a LB 2022 Kerby Joseph - 3rd - stud Malcolm Rodriguez - 6th - contributed in 2022 not so much in 2023 James Houston 6th - 8 sacks in 7 games as rookie, injured all of 2023 Holmes and his crew have definetly had the ability to draft well beyond the first couple of rounds. They have done good in FA bringing in Montgomery, Glasgow, Josh Reynolds, they signed Badgley a stud kicker. When did Badgley become a stud kicker?? the kicker that was a driving force behind NOT kicking the FG in those 4th down attempts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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