2017 Preseason GDT Week 2 Browns and Giants

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

I can't believe hoe much folks were talking about bbc's hit being dirty.

As Gruden was saying, you can't hit them high, where do you think they're going to hit them??

It was unfortunate, no doubt, but not dirty.

[BwickRedux]

5 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I can't believe hoe much folks were talking about bbc's hit being dirty.

As Gruden was saying, you can't hit them high, where do you think they're going to hit them??

It was unfortunate, no doubt, but not dirty.

Let me start off by saying, I completely agree with you. It wasn't against the rules and it wasn't malicious - what more do you need? Additionally, if you re-watch it, it does look like BBC lost his footing a little when he launched, which caused him to hit lower closer to the knees than the waist. 

But, to play devils advocate for a moment, I think it's getting negative reactions because in the end, fans and players alike feel it would have been better to have a degree of sportsmanship and try to avoid that type of hit or soften it, even if it meant OBJ successfully caught the ball. That's not Gregg Williams type of defense or mentality though and in that moment his coaching took over for BBC, so I doubt he even had the chance to do anything other than react.

Injuries suck, but all this is is people taking the side of the superstar against a relative unknown they don't care to defend.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, BwickRedux said:

Let me start off by saying, I completely agree with you. It wasn't against the rules and it wasn't malicious - what more do you need? Additionally, if you re-watch it, it does look like BBC lost his footing a little when he launched, which caused him to hit lower closer to the knees than the waist. 

But, to play devils advocate for a moment, I think it's getting negative reactions because in the end, fans and players alike feel it would have been better to have a degree of sportsmanship and try to avoid that type of hit or soften it, even if it meant OBJ successfully caught the ball. That's not Gregg Williams type of defense or mentality though and in that moment his coaching took over for BBC, so I doubt he even had the chance to do anything other than react.

Injuries suck, but all this is is people taking the side of the superstar against a relative unknown they don't care to defend.

It's one thing to sit back and think about things like easing up after the fact, but in the moment it doesn't even cross your mind.

How would that have looked had he eased up just enough for OBJ to potentially catch it, break a tackle, score, etc?

I get a DE being able to take something off when teeing off on a slow qb when rushing from the blind side, but arguably the biggest playmaker in the league in the middle of the field? Can't happen IMO.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

Some videos for your viewing pleasure.

 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

 

[BwickRedux]

17 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

It's one thing to sit back and think about things like easing up after the fact, but in the moment it doesn't even cross your mind.

How would that have looked had he eased up just enough for OBJ to potentially catch it, break a tackle, score, etc?

I get a DE being able to take something off when teeing off on a slow qb when rushing from the blind side, but arguably the biggest playmaker in the league in the middle of the field? Can't happen IMO.

For sure - but if you look at from Joe Public's perspective, they couldn't care less about Calhoun making the team, or the Browns' success in general, so they're processing all this as "This scrub just launched into ODELL FREAKING BECKHAM during a PRESEASON GAME! What teh frickz?!?" 

Again, this isn't to endorse their line of thinking, but I think this is most plausible explanation as to why anyone is even upset with the tackle.

[BwickRedux]

Dustin Fox came out with these tweets regarding Hue's plays last night, and I couldn't agree more:

If there is one thing that drives me bonkers about Hue, it's all these shifts and trying to look complicated, then the play just turns out to be a WR screen that goes for -2 yards. Quit it with all that and just start the play!

[mistakey]

20 minutes ago, BwickRedux said:

Dustin Fox came out with these tweets regarding Hue's plays last night, and I couldn't agree more:

If there is one thing that drives me bonkers about Hue, it's all these shifts and trying to look complicated, then the play just turns out to be a WR screen that goes for -2 yards. Quit it with all that and just start the play!

it worked in cinci.  its starting to work better here.  not there yet, but its year 2 and they're getting better.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

Meh, motion can help the qb identify coverage.

When done right, it can be helpful  and keep a defense thinking.  Our QB's are just too slow in running there offense. 

[BwickRedux]

5 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Meh, motion can help the qb identify coverage.

When done right, it can be helpful  and keep a defense thinking.  Our QB's are just too slow in running there offense. 

In response to your first point:

 

To me it's putting the cart before the horse-

1. It's preseason - why is Hue trying to add the icing to the cake before the thing is even done baking? Let the offense build it's foundation before add all flares.
2. Even if "our QB's are just too slow" and it is really all there fault and otherwise these motions would be gold, is that how we want our coaches to be with young players? Put them in a poor position to succeed just to stay principled to what they want to do?

I think it's fine to put Kizer through a stress test in the preseason by seeing how he handles a couple pre-snap wholesale motions being added, but last night it just seemed like it was being done too much. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

This is his playbook, if see no reason to change it as it's proven effective.

I get your point, but the fact that it's preseason allows the QB a chance to work on these things.  Perhaps all the QB's feel comfortable lining up in the I and running an iso? 

I think the biggest issue is they haven't settled one QB and they're all splitting reps.

[EL Brownso]

26 minutes ago, BwickRedux said:

In response to your first point:

 

To me it's putting the cart before the horse-

1. It's preseason - why is Hue trying to add the icing to the cake before the thing is even done baking? Let the offense build it's foundation before add all flares.
2. Even if "our QB's are just too slow" and it is really all there fault and otherwise these motions would be gold, is that how we want our coaches to be with young players? Put them in a poor position to succeed just to stay principled to what they want to do?

I think it's fine to put Kizer through a stress test in the preseason by seeing how he handles a couple pre-snap wholesale motions being added, but last night it just seemed like it was being done too much. 

Is Bwick really Dustin Fox? Hmmmm...

[BwickRedux]

2 minutes ago, EL Brownso said:

Is Bwick really Dustin Fox? Hmmmm...

I've been accused of many things in my life, but I don't believe being Dustin Fox is one of them.

13 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

This is his playbook, if see no reason to change it as it's proven effective.

I get your point, but the fact that it's preseason allows the QB a chance to work on these things.  Perhaps all the QB's feel comfortable lining up in the I and running an iso? 

I think the biggest issue is they haven't settled one QB and they're all splitting reps.

It's proven effective elsewhere, but certainly not here, not yet. Isn't that why so many people were excited for Gregg Williams - because he is flexible and plays to the strengths of his team? 

I believe there is a fine-line between pushing players to get better at things they are not yet good at vs. being rigid and not adapting to strengths. Hue drew criticism last year during the regular season for these pre-snap motions and their ineffectiveness, and last night was seemingly more of the same. I don't want to make a mountain out of a mole-hill because I think their are probably at least 20 things ahead of this one that lead to the offense's poor showing, but I do question why this tactic continues to be used when it hasn't shown much (if any) success and it may actually be hurting the development of running the offense instead.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

Watch the video I posted of Kizer's post game presser, he discussed some of the issues and one of them was the time spent in the huddle which cuts into his time to make those presnap adjustments and motions.

They could obviously dumb down the playbook, and maybe they should, but the bottom line is these QB's just need to learn the offense. This is why I'm fully on board with Kizer starting, naming him the starter now and giving him the reps in practice to prepare.