drd23 Posted May 1, 2019 Author Share Posted May 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Danand said: According to him, pass coverage is more important than the pass rush. Basically if the coverage can hold their own, the pass rush will get there. While I'd probably agree with the premise, I'm not sure it's necessarily as simple as that graph makes it seem. The fairly small correlation could also be a commentary on the quality/usefulness/descriptiveness of PFF's grading system for pass rushers, rather than purely being about whether a good pass rush wins games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 7 hours ago, drd23 said: While I'd probably agree with the premise, I'm not sure it's necessarily as simple as that graph makes it seem. The fairly small correlation could also be a commentary on the quality/usefulness/descriptiveness of PFF's grading system for pass rushers, rather than purely being about whether a good pass rush wins games Doesn't matter how good your coverage is - if your rush can't get there in 3-4 seconds, you're going to lose. We are the king's of coverage not because we have the best CB's in the league who can cover man to man (we don't), but because we have a balance of rush + coverage that most teams don't have. We still have that balance this year, but it's going to rely heavily on some interior guys like Willie Henry to step up and provide an inside rush while guys on the outside like Tim Williams and Tyus Bowser need to find their potential and provide the edge rush for us, unless Judon feels like he can finally consistently be a pass rusher for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wackywabbit Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: We are the king's of coverage not because we have the best CB's in the league who can cover man to man (we don't), but because we have a balance of rush + coverage that most teams don't have. I'm not sure that we don't. Who has a better set of CBs? Not sure what other team's group I'd take and I certainly can't imagine us outside the top few. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Just now, wackywabbit said: I'm not sure that we don't. Who has a better set of CBs? Not sure what other team's group I'd take and I certainly can't imagine us outside the top few. Last year I would certainly put us below Chicago. Then you have groups like New England and Dallas who I feel were also pretty good but I'd probably take us over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wackywabbit Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 4 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: Last year I would certainly put us below Chicago. Then you have groups like New England and Dallas who I feel were also pretty good but I'd probably take us over. We definitely have better CBs than Chicago. They had better safety play and an elite front 7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, wackywabbit said: We definitely have better CBs than Chicago. They had better safety play and an elite front 7. We also had an elite front 7 and we also had really good safeties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wackywabbit Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 2 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: We also had an elite front 7 and we also had really good safeties. You sure that you thought we had "really good safeties"? Our front-7 clearly wasn't as good as the Bears. But I'll easy take our corners for both top talent and depth 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamKid Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 8 minutes ago, wackywabbit said: You sure that you thought we had "really good safeties"? Our front-7 clearly wasn't as good as the Bears. But I'll easy take our corners for both top talent and depth Yea....it's not even a discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Doesn't matter the semantics - the bottom line is that you cannot survive without a pass rush. We're not some anomaly team that did that - we had a balance of a good pass rush with a good secondary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamKid Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreamKid Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wackywabbit Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 I'm always interested in seeing who's 5th year options do/don't get picked up. It's a pretty good indicator of a team's self-evaluation of a first round hit and miss. Stanley was a pretty easy yes, but there are some interesting names like Jack Conklin being passed up. Shaq Lawson and Laquon Treadwell were 2 guys that I was super high on in that draft. I would have said both of them have super high floors and wouldn't have believed the lack of production, but here we are... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warrenblue Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 Conklin is a very good player. Titans passing on his 5th year option has probably more to do with his injuries and the the fact that they paid a huge amount of money to Lewan than the player himself. Conklin won't have a problem to find a new home if the Titans decide to not pay him long-term. I'm surprised about the Bears and Floyd. I never thought he was that great at the time and now. What pisses me off in that draft is that the Ravens truly screwed up in the 2nd and in the 3rd round with high picks. First we denied to include our 3rd round pick to move 2 spots and take Ramsey (I'm good with Ronnie here though). But then the Ravens decides to choose Kamalei Correa in the 2nd round and Bronson Kaufusi in the 3rd round. Yikes. I hated those picks at the time and obviously hate them now. So many great players passed on. Chris Jones, Xavien Howard, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Ngakoue, etc 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drd23 Posted May 2, 2019 Author Share Posted May 2, 2019 4 hours ago, warrenblue said: I hated those picks at the time and obviously hate them now. You weren't the only one. I was relatively high in Correa when I thought he was going to be our next OLB but didn't really understand why they thought he should be an ILB, but I absolutely hated the Kafausi pick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danand Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 18 hours ago, drd23 said: While I'd probably agree with the premise, I'm not sure it's necessarily as simple as that graph makes it seem. The fairly small correlation could also be a commentary on the quality/usefulness/descriptiveness of PFF's grading system for pass rushers, rather than purely being about whether a good pass rush wins games The graph simply correlates a grading system with wins, and here coverage wins. If we try to explain that, and the guy also does it a bit in the twitter-thread, the coverage has to hold up for about 3-3,5 seconds. This is the time it takes from the snap to the pass rush to typically have an influence on the pass. If the coverage breaks down early it never give the pass rush a chance to get there, and I think it is that factor that correlates to wins. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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