Calvert28 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 7 hours ago, sunnygsm said: I also liked how naturally some common Joker traits emerged. I thought they managed it nicely without it being too in your face. Edit: somewhat surprised to see how much worse the critic response has gotten since the release. Cause they are very very butt hurt. I think some people have some misconceptions about this film. This was not meant to be a solo feature "Dark Knight" type film. This is a c character piece and as someone else pointed out, an art house film. If you go to watch this film, go to expect you are watching There Will Be Blood rather then getting big explosions and such and keep in mind this is about his descent into madness not him already being mad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Good movie, not a great movie. Not even really an entertaining movie, but message communicated in a coherent manner without forgoing any means of subtlety (though when he states the theme of the movie like he's reading an essay thesis, he gets close). There was about 10% too much Phoenix being weird for the sake of being weird, but overall very solid. Anybody who watched this movie and thought it was in any way glorifying his actions/life is an idiot. His life was plain miserable from beginning to end. The only messaging that I thought was questionable, and I'm not even sure it was intentional, was the point that people who protest for social justice will follow anybody for any reason without really looking into who the person is or what they really stand for. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckrock101 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 honestly thought this movie was kinda awful. There was the framework of a good movie, but they absolutely destroyed the character of the Joker. He's supposed to be this huge villain, one of Batman's biggest foes, a criminal mastermind etc. And in this film they made him a mentally challenged idiot. You're supposed to believe this guy is one of the biggest villains in the Batman universe? This is supposed to be a complex character, and this film made him shallow and one-dimensional. Which is fine, there are shallow and one-dimensional people in real life, but this is an established character. If they try to make any followups and introduce this Joker to a Batman movie, it will be laughable (seriously no pun intended). I think the movie would have been better served telling the same story but without the Joker name or any of the Batman stuff. The story and the character just did not line up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted October 6, 2019 Author Share Posted October 6, 2019 There are plenty of valid criticisms of this movie. Phoenix being shallow and one-dimensional is absolutely not one of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 2 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Good movie, not a great movie. Not even really an entertaining movie, but message communicated in a coherent manner without forgoing any means of subtlety (though when he states the theme of the movie like he's reading an essay thesis, he gets close). There was about 10% too much Phoenix being weird for the sake of being weird, but overall very solid. Anybody who watched this movie and thought it was in any way glorifying his actions/life is an idiot. His life was plain miserable from beginning to end. The only messaging that I thought was questionable, and I'm not even sure it was intentional, was the point that people who protest for social justice will follow anybody for any reason without really looking into who the person is or what they really stand for. Well alot of people in Gotham were suffering but media wants yo compare our situation to that. Gotham was more so in a setting of a Great Depression where there is nothing but homeless, garbage and crap everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 26 minutes ago, Buckrock101 said: honestly thought this movie was kinda awful. There was the framework of a good movie, but they absolutely destroyed the character of the Joker. He's supposed to be this huge villain, one of Batman's biggest foes, a criminal mastermind etc. And in this film they made him a mentally challenged idiot. You're supposed to believe this guy is one of the biggest villains in the Batman universe? This is supposed to be a complex character, and this film made him shallow and one-dimensional. Which is fine, there are shallow and one-dimensional people in real life, but this is an established character. If they try to make any followups and introduce this Joker to a Batman movie, it will be laughable (seriously no pun intended). I think the movie would have been better served telling the same story but without the Joker name or any of the Batman stuff. The story and the character just did not line up. Not all the versions of the Joker were criminal masterminds. Joker was Batmans most difficult foe because he had no boundaries and was completely unpredictable. Batman can always gain the edge on someone when he figures them out. But that's just it with the Joker which this movie stayed true too. You cant figure someone like this out, he has no real goal, nothing but pain and hate driving him, and anything can set him off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 5 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Well alot of people in Gotham were suffering but media wants yo compare our situation to that. Gotham was more so in a setting of a Great Depression where there is nothing but homeless, garbage and crap everywhere. I didn't see enough of Gotham to make that distinction. It just kinda looked like regular Chicago to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Just now, AlexGreen#20 said: I didn't see enough of Gotham to make that distinction. It just kinda looked like regular Chicago to me. Lol low blow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 (edited) 40 minutes ago, Buckrock101 said: honestly thought this movie was kinda awful. There was the framework of a good movie, but they absolutely destroyed the character of the Joker. He's supposed to be this huge villain, one of Batman's biggest foes, a criminal mastermind etc. And in this film they made him a mentally challenged idiot. You're supposed to believe this guy is one of the biggest villains in the Batman universe? This is supposed to be a complex character, and this film made him shallow and one-dimensional. Which is fine, there are shallow and one-dimensional people in real life, but this is an established character. If they try to make any followups and introduce this Joker to a Batman movie, it will be laughable (seriously no pun intended). I think the movie would have been better served telling the same story but without the Joker name or any of the Batman stuff. The story and the character just did not line up. I disagree with this take a lot. There's a whole bunch of versions of the character, but more importantly, this had nothing to do with Batman. It's not intended to be a telling of the Joker story as it relates to his encounters with Batman. Edited October 6, 2019 by AlexGreen#20 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 2 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Lol low blow. I guess thinking back on it, the mom does try to communicate that the city isn't doing well, but considering what's going on with her, I kinda shrugged it off. I suppose another theme of the movie would be that only the delusioned would ever call out for a corporate monolith to step in and run the executive branch of a failing city/state/nation when they've contributed so much to the failure in the first place. This is probably a more intentional theme than my second conclusion, but not communicated nearly as clearly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnygsm Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 3 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Good movie, not a great movie. Not even really an entertaining movie, but message communicated in a coherent manner without forgoing any means of subtlety (though when he states the theme of the movie like he's reading an essay thesis, he gets close). There was about 10% too much Phoenix being weird for the sake of being weird, but overall very solid. Anybody who watched this movie and thought it was in any way glorifying his actions/life is an idiot. His life was plain miserable from beginning to end. The only messaging that I thought was questionable, and I'm not even sure it was intentional, was the point that people who protest for social justice will follow anybody for any reason without really looking into who the person is or what they really stand for. Agree with a lot of these points. The excessive Phoenix made it drag at times or it reiterated a point that had already been made. In regards to him not being Joker-like, I thought that he eventually became more like the Joker we know. Once he stopped his meds and embraced himself he became a lot more confident. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 1 hour ago, sunnygsm said: Agree with a lot of these points. The excessive Phoenix made it drag at times or it reiterated a point that had already been made. In regards to him not being Joker-like, I thought that he eventually became more like the Joker we know. Once he stopped his meds and embraced himself he became a lot more confident. Exactly, he finally accepted he wasnt going to be like society expected him to be and he just let his conformeties go. That bathroom scene was the best scene of the movie with second being his conversation with Murray at the end. In the bathroom scene it's like he had a moment of clarity on how to solve all of his life problems and for a moment he let go but later returned to be Arthur because he was terrified but you could see the change come in waves where he become more and more aggressive and assertive with getting what he wants. His entire goal throughout the movie was kill himself and be remembered which he figured wouldnt happen in life and he wanted to leave his life behind. And his last line to Murray was him not only abandoning that but really hitting society in the mouth for everything it did to him. This scene sums up his character and the movie and really Gotham for that matter perfectly. Arthur Fleck: How 'bout another joke, Murray? Murray Franklin: No, I think we've had enough of your jokes. Arthur Fleck: What do you get... Murray Franklin: I don't think so. Arthur Fleck: ...when you cross... Murray Franklin: I think we're done here now, thank you. Arthur Fleck: ...a mentally ill loner with a society that abandons him and treats him like trash? Murray Franklin: Call the police, Gene, call the police. Arthur Fleck: I'll tell you what you get! You get what you f%&kin' deserve! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Prince Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 93 million domestically, and a 234 million global opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Prince Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 (edited) As good as this movie is without a sequel, it ends up being pointless. No reason for me to watch the whole movie again besides the last 25 minutes. Edited October 6, 2019 by Fresh Prince Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaiderX Posted October 6, 2019 Share Posted October 6, 2019 Beautiful film. Felt a lil underwhelming but there were plenty of tense moments. Honestly wasnt a cb movie with the unimportant references. Just a push by Phillips to the studio to make it. Very good nonetheless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.