LETSGOBROWNIES Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, Mind Character said: You lack any human perspective. Lol because I don’t agree with you? Jesus you paint with a broad brush. 5 minutes ago, Mind Character said: My point is not about tears or a sob story. It's about the rights of players versus the organization and vice versa in the pro football business. No one has argued he doesn’t have the right to do it, myself included. We’re arguing he looks like a whiner for doing something he’s fully within his rights to do. 5 minutes ago, Mind Character said: It's funny to hear the "he's being paid so he should shut up and take whatever his employer does" argument. It makes no sense to whine about player agency but be quiet as a programmed sheeple when organizational execs do as they please. You'd have no problem if we traded Duke a month ago... not a single issue with the John Dorsey's decision to trade Duke, but you have a issue with Duke the player formally requesting a trade after finding out he was on the trade block. As I’ve stated before, everyone (almost) is available for the right price. Not sure why Duke would think that didn’t apply to him. 5 minutes ago, Mind Character said: It's clear: Duke saw what happened to Carlos Hyde. Doesn't want to wait to get traded mid-season. Felt the team violated his personal code of loyalty and doesn't want to sacrifice for this organization anymore and would prefer to be relocated to another employer in alignment with what John Dorsey was seeking to do without Duke's approval back when he put Duke on the trading block before Duke made his trade request. It's part of NFL Business for players to have agency now. When they exercise their right like Duke has (not going crazy in the media like Odell), it's not because they're some adolescent *****. If someone is being underpaid or locked in by a team they didn’t choose to play for (draft picks for example), I have no issue with it. None of these situations apply to Duke, he’s just up in his feelings imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reginaldm9 Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, Mind Character said: You lack any human perspective. My point is not about tears or a sob story. It's about the rights of players versus the organization and vice versa in the pro football business. It's funny to hear the "he's being paid so he should shut up and take whatever his employer does" argument. It makes no sense to whine about player agency but be quiet as a programmed sheeple when organizational execs do as they please. You'd have no problem if we traded Duke a month ago... not a single issue with the John Dorsey's decision to trade Duke, but you have a issue with Duke the player formally requesting a trade after finding out he was on the trade block. It's clear: Duke saw what happened to Carlos Hyde. Doesn't want to wait to get traded mid-season. Felt the team violated his personal code of loyalty and doesn't want to sacrifice for this organization anymore and would prefer to be relocated to another employer in alignment with what John Dorsey was seeking to do without Duke's approval back when he put Duke on the trading block before Duke made his trade request. It's part of NFL Business for players to have agency now. When they exercise their right like Duke has (not going crazy in the media like Odell), it's not because they're some adolescent *****. This times 1000. Sorry to see him unhappy, but the dude's understandably upset. I can't imagine ever siding with an employer over an employee's morale when it hasn't impacted any part of the team functioning. Are you never allowed to be upset about your job and seek other opportunities? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, Reginaldm9 said: This times 1000. Sorry to see him unhappy, but the dude's understandably upset. I can't imagine ever siding with an employer over an employee's morale when it hasn't impacted any part of the team functioning. Are you never allowed to be upset about your job and seek other opportunities? No one is saying he doesn’t have the right, we’re saying he’s acting like a child. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: As I’ve stated before, everyone (almost) is available for the right price. Not sure why Duke would think that didn’t apply to him. Quote Duke said, “I was kind of put on the trade block to see what the team could get, and at the end of the day, I understand the nature of the business,” “John Dorsey’s job is to do what’s best for the team and the organization. If that’s getting rid of me for a bigger piece, then I’m okay with it. “My request was to meet them at a middle ground. I was put on the trade block a month before I requested a trade.” Duke understands the business, but just made it clear that since he's been on the trade block it would be better to complete that process that was initiated by Dorsey now rather than him having to wait until later mid-season when Kareem Hunt returns because, “I just think it’s better for me to get ahead of this, and if I’m going to be with a new team, I prefer it be before midseason just to give me a fair shot with the new team and just a chance to make a difference and play,” Johnson said. “Going in midseason is kind of tough, as you’ve seen with Carlos. It’s tough just getting in there because they have their guys, they have their system and you’ve just got to play catch-up.” Seems reasonable and non-whiny b*tchy to me. Not sure how people process his comments and go ape sh*t like Duke's a diva. 20 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: If someone is being underpaid or locked in by a team they didn’t choose to play for (draft picks for example), I have no issue with it. None of these situations apply to Duke, he’s just up in his feelings imo. ... and therein lies the disagreement. What he was contracted to be paid in a past time and what any employee is contractually projected to be compensated by the employer in the past does not justify all future actions of the employer and definitely doesn't wipe out Duke's agency to take control of his personal business of self by formally requesting a trade in alignment with what John Dorsey was seeking to do without Duke's approval back when he put Duke on the trading block before Duke made his trade request. Duke to me is not a whiny b&tch in his feelings. He's been a professional and above all else he is a business man taking control of his personal business taking control and agency back from his employer who sought to replace him without consulting him as to where and when he'd be shipped elsewhere. But your perspective aligns with many. So, there's that. 10 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: No one is saying he doesn’t have the right, we’re saying he’s acting like a child. He's acting like a mature adult, human being businessman in my eyes. Why is it that John Dorsey wasn't acting like a child saying "not expendable yet" but Duke is when he takes control of his career/life back from the employer. Lol. "a child." This is the pro football business. Classic fan take... lol I'm done .. some takes/things never change... long live the employer/owner's rights... f*ck the agency of the employee... good times... Edited June 5, 2019 by Mind Character 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, mistakey said: nick chubb makes less (significantly less than duke johnson) nick chubb didnt complain when he was 3rd on the depth chart nick chubb didnt make a situation out of his position on the roster when kareem hunt was signed nick chubb didnt ask for a trade derp derp derp... nick chubb wasn't put on the trading block and didn't have more leaks than a fart factory come out about his being shopped every which way in the league... nick chubb wasn't a long suffering upright leader and positive locker room influencer and sacrificer for this organization during the darkest times... to then be put on the trade block... Duke responded like "cool... no problem.. I understand the business... let's go ahead and trade me now then instead of midseason... no hard feelings here's my formal trade request in alignment with your wishes to trade me earlier" That's the essential piece you can't seem to grasp... Edited June 5, 2019 by Mind Character 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomahawk Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 37 minutes ago, Mind Character said: It's funny to hear the "he's being paid so he should shut up and take whatever his employer does" argument when that's just not how business works. It's part of NFL Business for players to have agency now. When they exercise their right like Duke has (not going crazy in the media like Odell), it's not because they're some adolescent b*tch. He could easily say "I'm currently a Cleveland Brown. The writing is on the wall and I'd like to be traded, but I am here to work. All other questions talk to my agent." 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reginaldm9 Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 23 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: No one is saying he doesn’t have the right, we’re saying he’s acting like a child. I think AB was acting like a child. Not that he was acting like a kid, but Leveon Bell didn't even show up when he was unhappy. Duke's even gone through the lengths to show up, even if he's voicing displeasure. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, Tomahawk said: He could easily say "I'm currently a Cleveland Brown. The writing is on the wall and I'd like to be traded, but I am here to work. All other questions talk to my agent." Did you watch the calm and reasonable nature of his presser? That' essentially what he said sans the agent remark. You know how our beat writers are. He talked about not being disgruntled or a negative influence... how he'll be professional and give his all... how he's excited to be back working with the guys... etc... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 12 minutes ago, Tomahawk said: He could easily say "I'm currently a Cleveland Brown. The writing is on the wall and I'd like to be traded, but I am here to work. All other questions talk to my agent." Yeah that would be the good PR thing to do. I can see both sides of this. If I knew my employer was replacing me I would look to go somewhere else. He can't just give his 2 week notice and stay in the same field and get a new job. He also is paid slightly different than I am and should be set for life so this isn't as impactful as me seeing my replacement has been hired and having to be worried about finding new employment for financial reasons. As far as just going out and proving himself he has proven who he is already. He isn't going to be an all time great RB, he is who he is. We all know who he is, he isn't a better option than Chubb or Hunt but he is a better option than Hilliard in all likelihood. He says he will show up and do his job so I say we allow that unless Hilliard is a better option. If he wants to push it and sit out that is his choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 11 minutes ago, Reginaldm9 said: I think AB was acting like a child. Not that he was acting like a kid, but Leveon Bell didn't even show up when he was unhappy. Duke's even gone through the lengths to show up, even if he's voicing displeasure. I agree he’s been better about it than Bell or Bryant, no argument there. But.... either you’re showing up to work and focusing on your job or your not. Voicing your displeasure to the media is definitely not “just doing your job”. Shoulda directed questions to his agent of hit them with no comments imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistakey Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 49 minutes ago, Mind Character said: derp derp derp... nick chubb wasn't put on the trading block and didn't have more leaks than a fart factory come out about his being shopped every which way in the league... nick chubb wasn't a long suffering upright leader and positive locker room influencer and sacrificer for this organization during the darkest times... to then be put on the trade block... Duke responded like "cool... no problem.. I understand the business... let's go ahead and trade me now then instead of midseason... no hard feelings here's my formal trade request in alignment with your wishes to trade me earlier" That's the essential piece you can't seem to grasp... na i get it. youre being dramatic again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistakey Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 25 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: Yeah that would be the good PR thing to do. I can see both sides of this. If I knew my employer was replacing me I would look to go somewhere else. He can't just give his 2 week notice and stay in the same field and get a new job. He also is paid slightly different than I am and should be set for life so this isn't as impactful as me seeing my replacement has been hired and having to be worried about finding new employment for financial reasons. As far as just going out and proving himself he has proven who he is already. He isn't going to be an all time great RB, he is who he is. We all know who he is, he isn't a better option than Chubb or Hunt but he is a better option than Hilliard in all likelihood. He says he will show up and do his job so I say we allow that unless Hilliard is a better option. If he wants to push it and sit out that is his choice. how does he know the browns are replacing him? he hasnt been traded, it costs more to trade him than keep him, and the draft has passed? . . . plus he can play for 8 games without hunt breathing down his neck. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomahawk Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, mistakey said: how does he know the browns are replacing him? he hasnt been traded, it costs more to trade him than keep him, and the draft has passed? . . . plus he can play for 8 games without hunt breathing down his neck. This is all about him being available to be traded, and the rumor mill that is our local reporters. Personally, I think he should just show up and ball out. If he does that, and makes Hunt WORK for it, he will show his true value, and maybe end up with a better team than what we are going to end up trading him to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, mistakey said: how does he know the browns are replacing him? he hasnt been traded, it costs more to trade him than keep him, and the draft has passed? . . . plus he can play for 8 games without hunt breathing down his neck. Well he will be behind Chubb and Hunt after week 8 so his spot on the depth chart will fall to 3rd which means he will see very little action the second half of the season if we stay healthy. . We'd save 800k if we traded him we'd lose 1 million (against the cap) if we cut him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted June 5, 2019 Share Posted June 5, 2019 8 minutes ago, Tomahawk said: This is all about him being available to be traded, and the rumor mill that is our local reporters. Personally, I think he should just show up and ball out. If he does that, and makes Hunt WORK for it, he will show his true value, and maybe end up with a better team than what we are going to end up trading him to. Yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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