incognito_man Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Just now, Sasquatch said: Agreed with the one-sided representation. I just can’t wrap my head around how inept the DA was in this case - basically opened the door wide for a docu-drama like this. The film exploits almost every single stereotype you could possibly conjure up, also, which is sad in its own right. It's a small town DA and performed as poorly as you might expect. The police botched the Dassey interrogations, but the two of them are guilty beyond reasonable doubt, absolutely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 1 minute ago, incognito_man said: It's a small town DA and performed as poorly as you might expect. The police botched the Dassey interrogations, but the two of them are guilty beyond reasonable doubt, absolutely. Definitely botched the Dassey interrogation, but some of the evidence was clearly planted - hell, even the DA didn’t dispute that assertion. His answer was, “Even if the keys to Halbach’s car were planted, there’s enough other evidence to try him (Avery) for murder”. While he may be right, what a ridiculous comment to make under oath. Honestly, the show took the ‘poor white trash getting railroaded by vindictive local police and an ignorant, if not arrogant, DA’ angle all while forgetting that a really remarkable young woman was brutally raped, murdered, dismembered, and burned. Just an absolute cluster f*** of events all the way around man. That whole sordid tragedy - literally everything about it - made my skin crawl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaRisMa Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Josh Hader at my place tonight. Kinda crazy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywindO2 Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Just popping in to recommend American Vandal. It's the same docu-drama story telling as Making a Murderer, but it's actually good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 1 minute ago, skywindO2 said: Just popping in to recommend American Vandal. It's the same docu-drama story telling as Making a Murderer, but it's actually good. Thanks for the recommendation. As soon as I wash the filth off from MaM, I may gave it a look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywindO2 Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 2 minutes ago, Sasquatch said: Thanks for the recommendation. As soon as I wash the filth off from MaM, I may gave it a look. It's not a serious show by any means but it's a much smarter show than it deserves to be. Very binge-able too if you're into that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 Just now, skywindO2 said: It's not a serious show by any means but it's a much smarter show than it deserves to be. Very binge-able too if you're into that. Netflix? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 18 minutes ago, Sasquatch said: Definitely botched the Dassey interrogation, but some of the evidence was clearly planted - hell, even the DA didn’t dispute that assertion. His answer was, “Even if the keys to Halbach’s car were planted, there’s enough other evidence to try him (Avery) for murder”. While he may be right, what a ridiculous comment to make under oath. Honestly, the show took the ‘poor white trash getting railroaded by vindictive local police and an ignorant, if not arrogant, DA’ angle all while forgetting that a really remarkable young woman was brutally raped, murdered, dismembered, and burned. Just an absolute cluster f*** of events all the way around man. That whole sordid tragedy - literally everything about it - made my skin crawl. Yep. Agreed. It's sad all around. And this docu-drama makes it 1000x times worse because it has people doubting the guilt and, disgustingly, feeling bad for Avery and Dassey. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, Sasquatch said: Definitely botched the Dassey interrogation, but some of the evidence was clearly planted - hell, even the DA didn’t dispute that assertion. His answer was, “Even if the keys to Halbach’s car were planted, there’s enough other evidence to try him (Avery) for murder”. While he may be right, what a ridiculous comment to make under oath. Honestly, the show took the ‘poor white trash getting railroaded by vindictive local police and an ignorant, if not arrogant, DA’ angle all while forgetting that a really remarkable young woman was brutally raped, murdered, dismembered, and burned. Just an absolute cluster f*** of events all the way around man. That whole sordid tragedy - literally everything about it - made my skin crawl. I'm sure every state has their share of stories like this, but ever since the Margaret Anderson murder (Green Bay) a long, long time ago, and the story behind that, I distance myself from that stuff. Especially since having a daughter of my own. I knew of every relevant location (first hand) and circumstance of the Anderson case and it has stuck with me all these years. They even wrote a book about it - "Torture at the Back Forty" which got mixed reviews. I didn't read it. Picturing this young woman walking in sub zero temperatures (I knew her exact path) with her neck slashed nearly clean through (the bitter cold actually froze the wound partially) - among other details that happened to her that I just won't say .... I can't even imagine .... for some reason that stuff sticks with me. Also remember, this is back when Green Bay was really small. Of course there was a long, drawn out fiasco in bringing the right people to justice, but I don't recall if that ended properly. I think there was a popular magazine (don't recall which one) that even ran an article something to the effect of "if you want to get away with murder, move to Wisconsin." Again, this was a long time ago, but some things you never forget. @Pugger no doubt remembers this if she was around here at the time Edited October 23, 2018 by cannondale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 28 minutes ago, cannondale said: I'm sure every state has their share of stories like this, but ever since the Margaret Anderson murder (Green Bay) a long, long time ago, and the story behind that, I distance myself from that stuff. Especially since having a daughter of my own. I knew of every relevant location (first hand) and circumstance of the Anderson case and it has stuck with me all these years. They even wrote a book about it - "Torture at the Back Forty" which got mixed reviews. I didn't read it. Picturing this young woman walking in sub zero temperatures with her neck slashed nearly clean through (the bitter cold actually froze the wound partially) - among other details that happened to her that I just won't say .... I can't even imagine .... for some reason that stuff sticks with me. Also remember, this is back when Green Bay was really small. Of course there was a long, drawn out fiasco in bringing the right people to justice, but I don't recall if that ended properly. I think there was a popular magazine that even ran an article something to the effect of "if you want to get away with murder, move to Wisconsin." Again, this was a long time ago, but some things you never forget. @Pugger probably remembers this if she was around here at the time What’s concerning, aside from everything in this case (Making A Murderer) is that nearly every piece of evidence the State brought against Avery, was easily discredited or proved as planted evidence after the fact. I’ve no clue what to think because I’m sure as hell not going to only base my opinion on some biased docu-drama. That’s why I was asking what other “locals”, or those closer to this case, think about this whole thing. All involved with this case; the prosecution, detectives, officers, DA, Avery, Dassey, their families, Halbach’s ex-boyfriend - all make me cringe. All but Teresa Halbach herself make me viscerally uncomfortable. Again, this feeling comes only from watching this show, which makes me even more unsettled because I just don’t know who to really trust, therefore, I trust my gut even less as a result. If I wasn’t from Wisconsin and didn’t have relatives from that area, I wouldn’t give this case much more of my time, energy, or concerns - other than for the Halbach family. I guess, much like you with the Anderson case, it sticks with you because that’s your home, and sadly, those are your people, for better or worse. Just really sad and unfortunate, especially for the Halbach’s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Sasquatch said: What’s concerning, aside from everything in this case (Making A Murderer) is that nearly every piece of evidence the State brought against Avery, was easily discredited or proved as planted evidence after the fact. I’ve no clue what to think because I’m sure as hell not going to only base my opinion on some biased docu-drama. That’s why I was asking what other “locals”, or those closer to this case, think about this whole thing. All involved with this case; the prosecution, detectives, officers, DA, Avery, Dassey, their families, Halbach’s ex-boyfriend - all make me cringe. All but Teresa Halbach herself make me viscerally uncomfortable. Again, this feeling comes only from watching this show, which makes me even more unsettled because I just don’t know who to really trust, therefore, I trust my gut even less as a result. If I wasn’t from Wisconsin and didn’t have relatives from that area, I wouldn’t give this case much more of my time, energy, or concerns - other than for the Halbach family. I guess, much like you with the Anderson case, it sticks with you because that’s your home, and sadly, those are your people, for better or worse. Just really sad and unfortunate, especially for the Halbach’s. Yeah - like I said - I just don't follow that stuff anymore. I certainly caught wind of it when it happened - and vaguely remember seeing some helicopter footage of the crime scene - but I don't even watch the news any more. Too much death, corruption and hard times. I used to joke that I watched ESPN for my news. Of course, that doesn't happen much anymore either. I don't have any juicy local rumors or facts about this case. I barely knew what "Making A Murder" was about. I knew a lawyer that was involved very early on and removed, but that's about it. I can understand getting caught up in it, but I have become very cynical. Halbach is dead and that's all that matters, and nothing will bring her back. I'm sure her family is sick to have to re-live this thing. That in itself is a crime. More and more people being released from prison every day after being wrongly accused, and I'm sure more and more are getting away with murder as well. When everything else is broken I guess karma and God is where I hope justice can prevail. Edited October 23, 2018 by cannondale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 15 minutes ago, cannondale said: Yeah - like I said - I just don't follow that stuff anymore. I certainly caught wind of it - and vaguely remember seeing some helicopter footage of the crime scene - but I don't even watch the news any more. Too much death, corruption and hard times. I used to joke that I watched ESPN for my news. Of course, that doesn't happen much anymore either. I don't have any juicy local rumors or facts about this case. I barely knew what "Making A Murder" was about. I knew a lawyer that was involved very early on, but that's about it. I can understand getting caught up in it, but I have become very cynical. Halbach is dead and that's all that matters, and nothing will bring her back. I'm sure her family is sick to have to re-live this thing. More and more people being released from prison every day after being wrongly accused, and I'm sure more and more are getting away with murder as well. When everything else is broken I guess karma and God is where I hope justice can prevail. If I’m the family of Halbach, I’m not only pi$$ed by the regurgitation of this terrible event, I’m angry that now I have to wonder if they actually caught the right guys. I think they probably did, but if I’m the family, and I’m seeing all of the other unsavory characters involved in prosecuting this case - especially DA Kratz - I’m wondering, maybe these idiots totally screwed everything up, and that would make me even more despondent, angry, and left feeling hopeless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Sasquatch said: If I’m the family of Halbach, I’m not only pi$$ed by the regurgitation of this terrible event, I’m angry that now I have to wonder if they actually caught the right guys. I think they probably did, but if I’m the family, and I’m seeing all of the other unsavory characters involved in prosecuting this case - especially DA Kratz - I’m wondering, maybe these idiots totally screwed everything up, and that would make me even more despondent, angry, and left feeling hopeless. I can't speak for them, but I gotta think at some point moving on becomes a priority. Short term everyone wants justice, but long term you realize it won't bring her back, you want her to rest in peace, and you want to try to live the rest of your life the best you can. After this amount of time, the last thing I would want is to have to re-live it all again. Unfortunately, Hollywood doesn't care about such trivial things Edited October 23, 2018 by cannondale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 (edited) The only thing I'll say from very much afar - is that when you say every piece of evidence was discredited - a dead body in a burning car on your property is a big piece of evidence that is pretty hard to explain away. Again, this is very much from afar. Lawyers are very good at introducing smoke and mirrors. That's their job. Sometimes the obvious is too obvious to ignore. I know near nothing about it - but sounds like pieces of this may be very OJ Simpson-esque ? The glove may not have fit - but he sure as hell killed her Edited October 23, 2018 by cannondale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted October 23, 2018 Share Posted October 23, 2018 6 hours ago, cannondale said: The only thing I'll say from very much afar - is that when you say every piece of evidence was discredited - a dead body in a burning car on your property is a big piece of evidence that is pretty hard to explain away. Again, this is very much from afar. Lawyers are very good at introducing smoke and mirrors. That's their job. Sometimes the obvious is too obvious to ignore. I know near nothing about it - but sounds like pieces of this may be very OJ Simpson-esque ? The glove may not have fit - but he sure as hell killed her I know nothing of the case/program being discussed - but I can comment on one thing.......The glove may not have fit - but he sure as hell killed her You got that right. (and btw...I'm not so sure the gloves didnt fit. Nobody "helped" OJ get them on and even I can "widen" the palm of my hand and make sliding a glove on difficult. No less a leather glove thats been soaked with blood. When he raised his hand with a "Oh well, they dont fit...." look - somebody should have stepped up saying "Let me help you with that...." ) Didnt happen. Oh well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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