theJ Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 53 minutes ago, acowboys62 said: I am not talking about anything specific to COVID to be honest. Isn't it equally distasteful that people can mistreat their health but magically expect others to jump to their aid at a moments notice to fix them when it all catches up to them? Yes. Though in general, those who abuse their health do end up paying for it. Either through higher medical bills, or through just plain living crappier. So it's not like they live the same life as someone who does take care of themselves. Additionally, my neighbor Joe might be mean to me. He might destroy his property and lower my property value through neglect. But if his house burns down i'll still let him to get him out of the cold while he waits for the firemen and cops. Because that's what good people do: they help others, even when they don't necessarily deserve it and i may not necessarily want to. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 Just now, theJ said: Aditionally, my neighbor Joe might be mean to me. He might destroy his property and lower my property value through neglect. But if his house burns down i'll still let him to get him out of the cold while he waits for the firemen and cops. Because that's what good people do: they help others, even when they don't necessarily deserve it and i may not necessarily want to. I wouldn't help Joe. He probably burned his house down through negligence and would not trust him in my house. If his house is burning down it's not like it's raining. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, acowboys62 said: I would be shocked if there is any movement in NJ until well into June, likely July. I mean we have a Governor who already said the Bill of Rights is above his pay grade...so yea, luckily got a lot of home projects! Eh it looks like most of the major metros and hard hit states have pushed back to May 15th - May 20th range. So we'll see what happens then. I think by then there will be a lot of pressure to re-open and case numbers will be way down, we'll also be 3-4 weeks removed since Europe started to re-open. Obviously re-opening is a process that can take weeks and months, so it may be June or July before things start to feel pretty normal. Edited April 16, 2020 by mission27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
animaltested Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, acowboys62 said: I am not talking about anything specific to COVID to be honest. Isn't it equally distasteful that people can mistreat their health but magically expect others to jump to their aid at a moments notice to fix them when it all catches up to them? Well, yes, it should? Tough pill to swallow, but for every one person that sabotages their health intentional, you have scores more with variety of reasons beyond their control. You don't have the time to weed and seed these cases, so you need the broad platform to ensure everyone gets a right to staying alive. Also, I think we blame individuals way too harshly when the system overall is set up for individuals to fail: Food deserts created by a ruthless, and dehumanizing housing and business market. Poor infrastructure discouraging outdoor exercise or activities; and preventing walking from being a adequate choice in most areas. [Gotta pump up those cars numbers] Corporate lobbying preventing information from being put out about unhealthy food options or pushing for the normalization and recommendations for unhealthy products. The fact that from birth to death, you are constantly bombarded by hundreds of hours of advertisements for extremely unhealthy foods. Many of them being incredibly and intentionally deceptive. Foods being jam packed with sugar and sugar like substances (even if sugar isn't even supposed to be in it), and the efforts to hide or distract from it. Many individuals are pushed into low paying, high stress, high hour (multiple jobs) careers, living pay check to check, resulting in choosing quick, inexpensive food options. The cheapest food is by far the most unhealthy. Little to no education related to food choices, and the economics of buying food in school. Completely reliant on family education which creates cycles of unhealthiness. The system completely crushes individuals. Its down right oppressive. And you are not really aware of it, until you step outside the US and see how weird it is. It takes almost a Herculean effort to combat all these factors; and places the ENTIRE burden upon the individual to keep themselves informed. Edited April 16, 2020 by animaltested 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mission27 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 I agree we shouldn't let people die because its 'their fault' and there are tons of factors behind pre-existing conditions But I would say its equally ridiculous to suggest that people who are 400 lbs are not in that situation due to their own choices There are plenty of people who face the same challenges and choose not to eat 8k calories a day as a coping mechanism 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acowboys62 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 2 hours ago, bigbadbuff said: Cuomo just extended the NYS pause to May 15th I feel that NY and NJ are just postponing the inevitable which is to announce we will be closed beyond memorial day. If things were going to blow up in the NE, that would be the announcement to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acowboys62 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 2 hours ago, theJ said: Yes. Though in general, those who abuse their health do end up paying for it. Either through higher medical bills, or through just plain living crappier. So it's not like they live the same life as someone who does take care of themselves. Additionally, my neighbor Joe might be mean to me. He might destroy his property and lower my property value through neglect. But if his house burns down i'll still let him to get him out of the cold while he waits for the firemen and cops. Because that's what good people do: they help others, even when they don't necessarily deserve it and i may not necessarily want to. Better man then me I suppose. I may or I may not lend help in that situation, for me it is all situational and I myself can be selfish and generally am only concerned about the welfare of my family and my dog (and most animals in general). One of my neighbors I would bend over backwards to help, they are great people...another, in the situation you posed, I would let them freeze because they have two dogs who are woefully mistreated. I would happily shelter the dogs but not the people, they can freeze. Probably not the best outlook to take but and I commend anyone would help under any and all circumstances, but can't say that is my style which I suppose is why I have the viewpoint I have. Probably not great for my long term karma outlook but so be it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acowboys62 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 48 minutes ago, mission27 said: Eh it looks like most of the major metros and hard hit states have pushed back to May 15th - May 20th range. So we'll see what happens then. I think by then there will be a lot of pressure to re-open and case numbers will be way down, we'll also be 3-4 weeks removed since Europe started to re-open. Obviously re-opening is a process that can take weeks and months, so it may be June or July before things start to feel pretty normal. I hope you are right. I have been largely optimistic throughout all of this with the exception being normalcy in NJ anytime soon. I am fairly jaded though and actually will likely be out of here within a year so probably just bias ignoring facts at this point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenos Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 17 hours ago, incognito_man said: Seriously, let's all just ignore it. Let's Make Thread Great Again. Can we use this opportunity to ask Webby for unlimited footballs? I feel like I run out too quickly. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acowboys62 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 41 minutes ago, animaltested said: Well, yes, it should? Tough pill to swallow, but for every one person that sabotages their health intentional, you have scores more with variety of reasons beyond their control. You don't have the time to weed and seed these cases, so you need the broad platform to ensure everyone gets a right to staying alive. Also, I think we blame individuals way too harshly when the system overall is set up for individuals to fail: Food deserts created by a ruthless, and dehumanizing housing and business market. Poor infrastructure discouraging outdoor exercise or activities; and preventing walking from being a adequate choice in most areas. [Gotta pump up those cars numbers] Corporate lobbying preventing information from being put out about unhealthy food options or pushing for the normalization and recommendations for unhealthy products. The fact that from birth to death, you are constantly bombarded by hundreds of hours of advertisements for extremely unhealthy foods. Many of them being incredibly and intentionally deceptive. Foods being jam packed with sugar and sugar like substances (even if sugar isn't even supposed to be in it), and the efforts to hide or distract from it. Many individuals are pushed into low paying, high stress, high hour (multiple jobs) careers, living pay check to check, resulting in choosing quick, inexpensive food options. The cheapest food is by far the most unhealthy. Little to no education related to food choices, and the economics of buying food in school. Completely reliant on family education which creates cycles of unhealthiness. The system completely crushes individuals. Its down right oppressive. And you are not really aware of it, until you step outside the US and see how weird it is. It takes almost a Herculean effort to combat all these factors; and places the ENTIRE burden upon the individual to keep themselves informed. I get what you are saying, but I think you took it too extreme. Down right oppressive is extreme IMO. I agree the system is not setup great, but the system is also not changing anytime soon, the old saying "adapt or die" feels appropriate. I am in my great life situation because I adapted, I did not wait for the system to change, I changed my ability to thrive in a crap system. And yes, I agree with that most of the noise out there pumped by companies, media, etc. is BS...I have a massive disdain for that stuff, but what that really tells me and what this post kind of insinuates even if it was not meant to, is that people are too stupid to think for themselves. If someone can't figure out that going to McDonald's daily vs eating a balance meal is the unhealthy thing...I am not sure anything would help them. I don't think we blame individuals enough, at the end of the day, each one of us creates our own situation, happiness, etc. I do think on both extremes you have people who legit have zero chance to make it and others who do not have to raise an eye lid and get everything handed to them...in the middle I believe the majority of us sit. And we all determine where we go, some against worse odds than others. I also don't get the comment about a dehumanizing housing and business market? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 Also on the bright side TheJ’s property value went up since the house is burnt down and will be rebuilt. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikesfan89 Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Outpost31 said: I wouldn't help Joe. He probably burned his house down through negligence and would not trust him in my house. If his house is burning down it's not like it's raining. What makes you say that? Even if it's not raining it could be 20 below Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 5 minutes ago, vikesfan89 said: What makes you say that? Even if it's not raining it could be 20 below Throw a coat out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theJ Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 5 minutes ago, vikesfan89 said: What makes you say that? Even if it's not raining it could be 20 below It was snowing yesterday, and it's going to snow again tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 Calvert County in Maryland's health department just issued a recommended (but not mandated by the county commissioners) guideline for people going out for essential businesses, separated by letters of last name. There are five groupings, and over a 10 day period you could go out twice. They had to publish another article just now explaining it more and hitting home on the "voluntary" portion because it went viral, and as I've pointed out, Maryland is having some increased grumblings about the stay at home order. Numbers are tapering off, and it seems we are following the patterns of the places that were infected before we were. Why are local and state governments still trying to limit things like this is beyond me. Especially when it seems most of the areas that aren't heavily urban are going to start coming out of this pretty soon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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