Leader Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, vegas492 said: What you just described is mostly every tight end drafted over the last decade. I get what you are saying, but in Tonyan's case, he's an undrafted free agent who changed positions. It takes time. To get any good reps from him in year two is a good thing. But yah, he needs to take a pretty large leap forward this year. It is time. No doubt. You're chatting with the "it takes time" guy. I'm the last one to expect instant results. There's the position change - being lower down on the roster totem pole year 1 - then the injury last year. It's been an inconsistent start - but (perhaps) there's reasons. I'm also the "talent shows through" guy - so hopefully, this year (if there is a year this year....) it will come together cause minus the system making Deguara into a rookie sensation, Tonyan's the #2 guy. Edited July 7, 2020 by Leader Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 I think most of us agree that Tonyan has potential to be better, but I think it's unclear if he'll continue to improve, or if he'll plateau. It's just too soon to tell, same with lots of guys, including CB Jackson, LB Burks, DT Adams... which are all sorta in a prove it or we getting your replacement next year (my opinion) place. Physical talents wise, they over drafted Deguara, but I think that's because 2) He fits perfectly for what they were looking for a guy in this scheme 1) They feel they know his mental game is way above average after having good talks with his coaches (whom LaFleur knows pretty well). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 Marcedes Lewis is the #2 TE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 3 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: Marcedes Lewis is the #2 TE. Depends on what the play call is. If you need a physical inline TE, he's #1, if you need a whole bunch of move TE/H-backs then he's #4. My guess is we'll be seeing a lot of running and a physical TE will be needed and he'll get a good bit of playing time outside the RT. Also, I can't help but wonder how the TE Looney project will go and if he might be backing up Lewis in that role. And Looney is more mobile and could probably be more versatile in the H-Back roles than Lewis. I think Looney is clearly 5th, but I wouldn't totally count him out either (but this is pure speculation). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 2 hours ago, Beast said: I think most of us agree that Tonyan has potential to be better, but I think it's unclear if he'll continue to improve, or if he'll plateau. It's just too soon to tell, same with lots of guys, including CB Jackson, LB Burks, DT Adams... which are all sorta in a prove it or we getting your replacement next year (my opinion) place. Physical talents wise, they over drafted Deguara, but I think that's because 2) He fits perfectly for what they were looking for a guy in this scheme 1) They feel they know his mental game is way above average after having good talks with his coaches (whom LaFleur knows pretty well). So...Tonyan wise. It takes TE's years to become good in the league. Very few come in right away and perform at a high level. When they do, they are the exception and not the rule. Corners. There may in fact be a learning curve, but either a corner can play, or he can't. It seems like most of the good ones are pretty good right away. In regards to Jackson, I believe he's a bust. I hold out hope that he will improve, but man, if he were any good, I think he would have seen the field already. Inside linebackers. Very few spots are as easy to produce in like middle linebackers. Maybe running backs are similar in that they can come in and play right away. Burks is a huge disappointment in that regard. Defensive tackles. Not quite as easy to produce in like RB's or ILB's. But still, he should have flashed more. Adams. Pretty disappointed in him. But if I were to rank the disappointments, 1A) Burks. 1B) Jackson C) Adams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 20 minutes ago, vegas492 said: Corners. There may in fact be a learning curve, but either a corner can play, or he can't. It seems like most of the good ones are pretty good right away. In regards to Jackson, I believe he's a bust. I hold out hope that he will improve, but man, if he were any good, I think he would have seen the field already. There is, especially for bump.and run CBs, see Al Harris and Tramon, so I'm holding out a bit of hope, but yeah it doesn't look good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 1 hour ago, Beast said: There is, especially for bump.and run CBs, see Al Harris and Tramon, so I'm holding out a bit of hope, but yeah it doesn't look good. Al Harris was caught in a numbers game in Philly before he came to GB. He was good prior to coming here. And that was totally a different era. Tramon was an undrafted free agent who played well when he got opportunity. Kind of like Shields. Sure they all got better, but they all showed that they could play early in their careers. I hold out hope for Jackson, but, he should have showed something in two years. At least enough to get on the field to be noticed, be it good or bad. Even Holloman showed some good stuff in pre-season last year. Think back just 5-8 years. What corners have come out of nowhere after two years in the league to be legitimate players? I don't follow a lot of the teams, but that kid Bouye kind of did that. Thinking that Chris Harris, Jr. really elevated his game. I'm sure there are more, but it just doesn't seem like corners pop later in their careers like some other positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 1 hour ago, vegas492 said: Al Harris was caught in a numbers game in Philly before he came to GB. He was good prior to coming here. And that was totally a different era. Tramon was an undrafted free agent who played well when he got opportunity. Kind of like Shields. Sure they all got better, but they all showed that they could play early in their careers. I hold out hope for Jackson, but, he should have showed something in two years. At least enough to get on the field to be noticed, be it good or bad. Even Holloman showed some good stuff in pre-season last year. Think back just 5-8 years. What corners have come out of nowhere after two years in the league to be legitimate players? I don't follow a lot of the teams, but that kid Bouye kind of did that. Thinking that Chris Harris, Jr. really elevated his game. I'm sure there are more, but it just doesn't seem like corners pop later in their careers like some other positions. Exactly, Al Harris in Philly, but what about his time in Tampa before that? You know the team that drafted him. It normally takes time for bump and run CB to develop at the NFL level unless they're outstanding athletes even for NFL standards. I'm certainly not saying all CBs, mainly just bump and run types. It takes some extra time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingOfTheNorth Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) 14 hours ago, Beast said: Exactly, Al Harris in Philly, but what about his time in Tampa before that? You know the team that drafted him. It normally takes time for bump and run CB to develop at the NFL level unless they're outstanding athletes even for NFL standards. I'm certainly not saying all CBs, mainly just bump and run types. It takes some extra time. You mean the one season he was on Tampa's practice squad and then released? He immediately went to Philly, played and started for them. Not sure Harris falls in line with the point your trying to make. Josh Jackson has more than exceeded this timeline. Edited July 8, 2020 by KingOfTheNorth 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 (edited) This is the 2020 Offense Outlook Thread Edited July 9, 2020 by Shanedorf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanedorf Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 The forgotten man...Jamaal Williams https://cheeseheadtv.com/blog/jamaal-williams-remains-reliable-entering-contract-season-122 ...Then came 2019 where Williams put up some sneaky good numbers behind Jones in the backfield. For starters, Williams tied Davante Adams for the team lead in receiving touchdowns with five. Williams started only two games for the Packers but led the team by a significant margin with a catch percentage of 86.7%. He was targeted 45 times and made 39 receptions for 253 yards. Despite playing his fewest snaps on offense with only 35%, he still added 460 yards and one touchdown on the ground, averaging 4.3 yards per carry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brat&Beer Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 Williams should again have a big role in the offense, especially early. As the season wears on though, he could start losing some snaps to Dillon as Dillon becomes more familiar with the offense. That said, I suspect Williams might have a better chance of being a Packer in 2021 than Jones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 15 hours ago, Beast said: Exactly, Al Harris in Philly, but what about his time in Tampa before that? You know the team that drafted him. It normally takes time for bump and run CB to develop at the NFL level unless they're outstanding athletes even for NFL standards. I'm certainly not saying all CBs, mainly just bump and run types. It takes some extra time. Name me a bump and run corner in the league right now. I can't come up with one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, Brat&Beer said: Williams should again have a big role in the offense, especially early. As the season wears on though, he could start losing some snaps to Dillon as Dillon becomes more familiar with the offense. That said, I suspect Williams might have a better chance of being a Packer in 2021 than Jones. I can see Williams going either way. As in kept now and in the future, or cut this year. Case against Williams.... He's limited athletically. Roster. He's an average to slightly above average #2 RB. High end #3. Drafting of Dillon. I guess I don't think you draft a RB in round 2 and not give him RB#1 or RB#2 snaps right away. He may have a little trade value. Case for Williams.... Cheap insurance policy. Pass protector. Can catch. Tough as nails. Brings a ton of passion to the field and probably the locker room. I guess I'm feeling that it is Jamal or Dexter as RB#3. Ervin is a lock as a specialist. Jamaal needs to clearly beat out Dexter in camp. And I hope he does. He's got such great passion that it would be a shame to lose that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 48 minutes ago, vegas492 said: Name me a bump and run corner in the league right now. I can't come up with one. Richard Sherman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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