Browns General Discussion

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

6 minutes ago, NateDawg said:

I think I believe the aggression by Berry. Primarily because I think this is a make or break year with our head coach and head executive.

But also, this is the time.  We have our QB and they’re in their prime.  Same thing at DE, CB x2-3, LB, WR, TE, RB, our OL is experienced and talented…. now’s the time.

[Thomas5737]

2 hours ago, NateDawg said:

I think I believe the aggression by Berry. Primarily because I think this is a make or break year with our head coach and head executive.

If we want to be aggressive we can only do it by mortgaging the future. I get why those whose jobs are in jeopardy would do it but as a franchise it would be a bad idea.

The only way to do it is to give Watson more money and restructure his contract with voided years, which will limit what we can do once Watson is gone. Not a great idea, he was supposed to make up for small flaws. Why admit that he can't and then give him even more money?

I'd rather see if we can get more out of our defense with what we have and cheap pieces filled in. You have very good corners, JOK and Myles, you can't field a pro bowl team.

Our offensive salaries are already insane, more than some teams total salaries. Again, I don't expect any flashes.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

21 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

If we want to be aggressive we can only do it by mortgaging the future. I get why those whose jobs are in jeopardy would do it but as a franchise it would be a bad idea.

The only way to do it is to give Watson more money and restructure his contract with voided years, which will limit what we can do once Watson is gone. Not a great idea, he was supposed to make up for small flaws. Why admit that he can't and then give him even more money?

I'd rather see if we can get more out of our defense with what we have and cheap pieces filled in. You have very good corners, JOK and Myles, you can't field a pro bowl team.

Our offensive salaries are already insane, more than some teams total salaries. Again, I don't expect any flashes.

If Watson is gone anytime soon we’ll be nuking everything anyway and it won’t matter.

Top down I think they feel this is their core for the next 3 years or so and let’s see what we can do.  
 

Maybe it’s short sighted to some degree, but it’s a short term league.  Try to go all in when you can and after that window closes auction off what you need to so you can rebuild the war chest and try again.  One rebuilding year is plenty to reset the cap more or less.

[Thomas5737]

37 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

If Watson is gone anytime soon we’ll be nuking everything anyway and it won’t matter.

He's here through the 2026 season, you can't really cut him because the cap hit would put you so far over the cap that we'd lose every draft pick for a decade. The only way he isn't on our roster (assuming he is alive and free) is if someone agrees to trade for him which seems extremely unlikely with what he is owed and what his performance level would have to be that we would want to get rid of him. TLDR he is here through the 2026 season and we will probably have to rework his deal meaning giving him more bonus money and adding voided years so screw the future Browns of 2027,2028 etc... and whoever works the front office for them at that time.

 

42 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Top down I think they feel this is their core for the next 3 years or so and let’s see what we can do.

Yep, that's why they paid them like they paid them.

43 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Maybe it’s short sighted to some degree, but it’s a short term league.  Try to go all in when you can and after that window closes auction off what you need to so you can rebuild the war chest and try again.  One rebuilding year is plenty to reset the cap more or less.

You still have to prepare for it. You can't tear down a roster if they have large signing bonuses because you'll still be handcuffed and without talent.

The only way this will work long term (lets say through 2026) if if we get production from draft picks and lower level free agents who are surrounded by the Garretts/Watsons/Wards/Chubbs/Bitonios/Tellers/Njokus/Conklins of the team. Cooper will almost certainly be a casualty, probably Chubb too but I don't want to think about that.

For the most part the team we saw late in the year will have to take down the Bills/Chiefs/Bengals of the league. Obviously the defense will need coached better and Watson has to be great but we traded and signed him for greatness so it should be expected. Defense has to have a better scheme. Almost impossible not to.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

He's here through the 2026 season, you can't really cut him because the cap hit would put you so far over the cap that we'd lose every draft pick for a decade. The only way he isn't on our roster (assuming he is alive and free) is if someone agrees to trade for him which seems extremely unlikely with what he is owed and what his performance level would have to be that we would want to get rid of him. TLDR he is here through the 2026 season and we will probably have to rework his deal meaning giving him more bonus money and adding voided years so screw the future Browns of 2027,2028 etc... and whoever works the front office for them at that time.

He’s not an unknown rookie or anything, he’s a 27yo 3x pro bowler and former passing yardage leader.  I don’t think he forgot how to play.

I think we can debate how good he is, but I don’t think it’s really debatable he’s the best we’ve had since at least Bernie and is prolly gonna be here for a while by choice as opposed to need.

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

 

Yep, that's why they paid them like they paid them.

You still have to prepare for it. You can't tear down a roster if they have large signing bonuses because you'll still be handcuffed and without talent.

Now?  No.  But in 2-4 years when the team would be looking blow things up if it didn’t work out they’ll have paid enough of those bonuses to do so.  This is a fun thought btw lol.

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

The only way this will work long term (lets say through 2026) if if we get production from draft picks and lower level free agents who are surrounded by the Garretts/Watsons/Wards/Chubbs/Bitonios/Tellers/Njokus/Conklins of the team.
 

Yeah, that’s the league.  Find your stars and build around them with role players.  Hopefully you can find some good players to take over and become the next group of core players along the way.

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Cooper will almost certainly be a casualty, probably Chubb too but I don't want to think about that.

eh, hard to say.  Depends on how well they play.

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

For the most part the team we saw late in the year will have to take down the Bills/Chiefs/Bengals of the league.
 

Those teams will have the exact same problems though.

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Obviously the defense will need coached better and Watson has to be great but we traded and signed him for greatness so it should be expected.

I think they signed him like the most recent big name QB to get a contract.  He’s was a unique situation as we didn’t have any leverage like a franchise tag or whatever.  He was like negotiating with a FA and I think that contract will help us to some degree when some of these other guys go to sign their extensions.

If we get a top 10 QB I think it’s a good trade from a football perspective.  

5 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Defense has to have a better scheme. Almost impossible not to.

Agreed.

[Thomas5737]

22 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I think we can debate how good he is, but I don’t think it’s really debatable he’s the best we’ve had since at least Bernie and is prolly gonna be here for a while by choice as opposed to need.

Well time will show what he is, he was close to a top 5 guy at one time. He was also playing for a contract so we'll have to see what drives him, hopefully it isn't money.

 

23 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Now?  No.  But in 2-4 years when the team would be looking blow things up if it didn’t work out they’ll have paid enough of those bonuses to do so.  This is a fun thought btw lol.

In 4 years contracts will have expired and there is no issue.Unless you rework a bunch of them with voided years and stuff.

 

24 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I think they signed him like the most recent big name QB to get a contract.  He’s was a unique situation as we didn’t have any leverage like a franchise tag or whatever.  He was like negotiating with a FA and I think that contract will help us to some degree when some of these other guys go to sign their extensions.

If we get a top 10 QB I think it’s a good trade from a football perspective.  

No, not at top 10. You don't pay that for Andy Dalton/Trevor Lawrence/Ryan Tannehill (9/10/11 last season). Top 10 means Kirk Cousins/Kyler Murray/Matt Stafford, that's about where those guys would line up on an eye test. Lets say he isn't Mahomes, Allen, Burrow or Herbert. That's fair. But he has to absolutely be in the conversation after that as a top 5 guy or we got screwed. That's ignoring off the field risks, this is just simply football talk.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

22 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Well time will show what he is, he was close to a top 5 guy at one time. He was also playing for a contract so we'll have to see what drives him, hopefully it isn't money.
 

Yeah, let’s hope lol.

22 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

In 4 years contracts will have expired and there is no issue.Unless you rework a bunch of them with voided years and stuff.
 

Even then if you’re only kicking a fraction of the money down the line it becomes workable.  Look at the Falcons, they just ate like 40 million with Ryan.

22 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

No, not at top 10. You don't pay that for Andy Dalton/Trevor Lawrence/Ryan Tannehill (9/10/11 last season). Top 10 means Kirk Cousins/Kyler Murray/Matt Stafford, that's about where those guys would line up on an eye test. Lets say he isn't Mahomes, Allen, Burrow or Herbert. That's fair. But he has to absolutely be in the conversation after that as a top 5 guy or we got screwed. That's ignoring off the field risks, this is just simply football talk.

Yeah I think the tiering is a better description.  Not gonna be first tier most likely, but in that second tier of guys who you can win BECAUSE of, not just with.

[sdrawkcab321]

Probably a name to look out for 

[dawgdish]

21 hours ago, Thomas5737 said:

Well time will show what he is, he was close to a top 5 guy at one time.

Really hoping it's a, erm, happy ending

[candyman93]

 

Edited March 6, 2023 by candyman93

[brownie man]

38 minutes ago, candyman93 said:

 

But yet no one wants to believe me that we’re gonna get Jessie Bates smh 

[candyman93]

If we sign Bates we can play Nickel 95% of the time and just have 2 starting linebackers. Which honestly isn’t a bad idea considering those guys dropped like flies last year.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 hour ago, candyman93 said:

If we sign Bates we can play Nickel 95% of the time and just have 2 starting linebackers. Which honestly isn’t a bad idea considering those guys dropped like flies last year.

That’s also a recipe to get run on. I’m all for nickel, but we need to have a roster that’s ready to address power run schemes as we’re gonna see plenty of that after last season.

[MWil23]

11 hours ago, candyman93 said:

 

Bates with Hargrave would be ideal. Head into the draft and go straight BPA wherever but hopefully not CB unless there's a superstar there.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

25 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

Bates with Hargrave would be ideal. Head into the draft and go straight BPA wherever but hopefully not CB unless there's a superstar there.

If we’re gonna land 2 big name free agents I’d rather have Hargrave and Edmonds tbh.

Bates is great, he’d be great here, etc, I just think the need for impact players in the front 7 is a much bigger need.